Modern Vespa

For Europe, rumors about an upcoming price increase for all Vespa models from January 2023 are doing the rounds. The background is said to be rising manufacturing and transport costs.

To the amount of the increase I have no information, just as little whether it also affects scooters from Piaggio and / or Aprilia. If this also applies to markets outside of Europe, here in particular for Germany, I do not know.

Does anyone know more specifics?

Not heard anything in the UK, but then our inflation is currently above 10% - so it wouldn't be the biggest shock.

Is inflation similar in Germany at the moment?

Nearly 10%, yes. Expecting to lower a little bit.

The 2023 price increase has already appeared in the US. Vespas went up a bit over 10% for the new models over the 2022.

Awesome.
That should help keep the rabble out of MV.

Hmm... The GTS has also become more expensive in Germany with the facelift already at the beginning of October

GTS 300 Classic pre-facelift 6519€ to 6999€ 2023 facelift
GTS 300 Super pre-facelift 6599€ to 7099€ 2023 facelift
GTS 300 SuperSport pre-facelift 6799€ to 7299€ 2023 facelift
GTS 300 SuperTech pre-facelift 6999€ to 7499€ 2023 facelift

All prices above are ERP including taxes, dealer fees, etc.

I'm talking of ANOTHER price increase on 01.01.23!!!

Our increase was higher

2022 GTS Super Sport $ 7,199
2023 GTS Super Sport $ 8,099

I didn't price out the other models.

The way to you is also much longer...

For us it is only the short distance over the Alps

Yes, in percentage terms, the increase is higher in the USA than here.

Those prices do not include shipping. That is another $750 for the 2023 Super Sport I have on order. If shipping is included in the EU price you are definitely getting a lower price increase.when I bought my 2018 shipping was $500.

German Prices include 238€ for shipping and handling (Pontedera to German dealer)

The out the door price including shipping, title, tax,,dealer prep before accessories on my 2023 Super Sport order is $9,971.69. At todays exchange rate that €9,344.47 so we get screwed.

I have to find a good mechanic and parts supplier. I do not want to have to buy a new Vespa. I see no benefit in an upgrade over the last 15 years.

Maybe... maybe not…

However, I don't want to discuss that at all. Nor that we Europeans are ripped off for example, on IPhone and cars. Regardless of whether the manufacturer is German or American, regardless of whether the production of a particular model takes place in Germany or overseas, we Germans have been paying significantly more for years.

Let's state: different countries, different markets, different prices.

BUT: I believe, that there will be a new price increase for Vespa (all Modells) two month after the last one (only on GTS).

Sorry snobs. We just buy the used low mileage Vespe that typical Vespisti were afraid to take out lol

I am definitely on that camp. There's no way in hell I would be able to afford a brand new investment or want to.

Honestly, if you just wait for the right used bike, and jump on the deal, you'll make a profit on every single bike you ever own, and you won't care less what the new prices are.

I started riding in 2007. In 2017 I got really into Excel and started keeping track of my babies and all their associated costs. Since 2017 I've let go of 44 of them. I'm guessing I've had close to 70 bikes altogether. I've only ever lost money on one: a Derbi Atlantis 2T 50cc I rode year round, including through four salty canadian winters which cost me $250-ish US, over 12,00 miles.

I still have 6 bikes, and only expect to lose money on 1 of them (a KYMCO I've owned for 14 years and plan on being buried with lol). That's two out of 70-ish.

The bikes I buy are all pretty new (BMW G650GS 1,200 miles, BMW F700GS 2,500 miles, Bonneville SE 3,700 miles). People ask "how do you have so many??" and it's like, well, all three of these bikes combined cost me less than the 2014 F700GS would have when it was new - only my friend paid for that (and all the touring extras) before she decided to stop two-wheel riding.

This isn't to dissuade anyone from buying new (guys like me, and maybe Max, count on you guys lol). My girl's father bought himself a smokin' hot Porsche when he sold his business and retired and I know for a fact the depreciation on that thing in the first year alone was probably more than all of my current motorcycles are worth, but if you have the means and/or want to celebrate, why not? Life's short! It's the most beautiful machine I've ever driven. They take you to free track days when you buy one. The whole thing is a very cool experience.

I'm just saying for those of us who aren't buying Porsches and getting free private track days to teach us how to use our supercars, you can literally "Ride Free" and not care about MSRPs, ever.

Our getting ripped off has to do with taxes and fees which I believe are included in your pricing at least as far as taxes go aka VAT so while often higher are harder to spot. I'm wondering if the proposed tarriff on midsize European motorcycles did quietly pass as so many others did during the pandemic. From what I recall that would have added a couple hundred to the price of a new Vespa GTS.

The German prices quoted always include VAT.

Stores must always display the gross price incl. VAT. This is always 19% or 7% for food (and 1000 other senseless exceptions).

Not having been in Germany no idea what the VAT rates are. I know when I went to school in France some of the VAT rates were complicated to try and figure out, especially on various types of alcohol. Probably some of those 10000 senseless type exceptions you reference.

Small world. I did some schooling in France too.

Question: What's a simple definition of VAT and how does that compare to standard taxes on a good or service?

It's a term I only see used in online forums, never used by anyone I know here in Canada.

TY.

VAT = Value Added Tax
German = Mehrwertsteuer (MwSt.); literally "More Value Tax"

The tax is paid only by private end users, companies and traders are reimbursed. It is basically a tax on the value chain.

I buy raw material/goods as a trader/manufacturer and get back the VAT paid, resell goods at a higher price, have to collect the VAT and pay it to the tax office. At the end of the chain is the private end consumer, who pays the VAT (and does not get it back).

No one has to calculate it, by law: the displayed price in the store, restaurant or for a service always includes the VAT (with a few exceptions on some products witch are VAT-free).

Interesting, thank you. So if you were to register a business, and the business were to purchase a lot of motorcycle parts, for business use of course... no tax on motorcycle parts?

I am pro-VAT

Yes and no…

The business has to be the intend to make money… As a business you have to proof, that your purchased goods are necessary to run your business or you want sell them (your stock).

If you don't make any money from it, it's considered a "hobby" (Liebhaberei) and the tax office will reclaim the VAT (for up to 10 years). On profits you pay of course trade taxes, etc. / Income as an entrepreneur is subject to income tax...

Complicated? Yes! Not for nothing, 90% of the books about taxes are in German language...

I guess they use databases and online resources in other nations, then.

It is sooo complicated. My math skills are not up to that level 🤠

All part of the plan

I knew it all along. There is a nefarious plot out there to confuse me and to make me even more paranoid.

No just to get mo money out of you

What a BS name Value Added Tax. Taxing a product adds no value it only adds cost.

The tax is on the value added at each step in the manufacturing and sales chain.

Sales tax only gets collected from the end retailer.

The advantage of a VAT is that taxes are collected at the points where profit happens and proportionate to that profit, regardless of the relative market power of each participant in the chain.

If government taxing goods actually added value the malls in northern Delaware (no sales tax) would be in NJ (6.625%).Also your gasoline purchased in California would be better not just more expensive since your state government taxes it more than NJ.

You're not listening.

Thanks for all of this. It's probably useless knowledge for me but still cool to read/learn about. I appreciate it.

10K or more OTD for a vehicle originally designed to transport people with modest means post WW2 seems a little ironic.

With affordable electric cars and cheaper quality scooters available I think Vespa sales will be tough sledding in this economy.

10K for a scooter, they are losing the plot.

SDG

The word is iconic.

For the German market, the price updates are known from January 2023:

Primavera 50 and 50S +100€
Primavera 125 +80€
Primavera 125S +100€
Primavera (RED) 50 +100€
Primavera (RED) 125 +30€
Primavera Touring (all engines) +100€
Primavera Picnic (all engines) +100€
Sprint (all versions, all engines) +100€
Elettrica (all engines) +200€
GTS (all variants, all engines) unchanged(!)

The 2023 special model Primavera Color Vibe is not yet listed, the GTV and the 946 are also still missing.

I hope for the other markets, the price adjustments also remain humane. Somewhere else already news?

Somehow I think they will still be around for a long while. You can still buy Omega watches and look what happened to that market. Last I checked Burberry was also for sale when I bought something last month. That doesn't mean I can't go into Walmart and get a watch and scarf for under $50 .

The cost of manufacturing has gone up a LOT on some products as a result of this little pandemic we are coming out of. Italy absolutely did not escape the pandemic undamaged and was hit very hard. The materials will also have gone up in cost and as someone somewhat involved in high-rise construction costs there have skyrocketed for materials putting many projects on hold.

Vespa is a premium product and there are other options out there. I See way, way more cheaper scoots on the roads than Vespa. Actually, I see more BMWs and Mercedes than Vespas around here come to think of it. There is a very good chance all these products will likely be around long after we're gone.

*EDIT*

Was just out running some errands and popped into the mall. When I put the Lululemon bag on the curry hook and Klin Gore-Tex gloves on the saddle I was reminded of this thread. All 3 brands I imagine will be around for a while and make quality though pricey products.