Thu, 16 Feb 2023 18:06:23 +0000

Hooked
Vespa GTS 300
Joined: Fri, 02 Sep 2022 18:41:22 +0000
Posts: 386
Location: Germany
 
Hooked
Vespa GTS 300
Joined: Fri, 02 Sep 2022 18:41:22 +0000
Posts: 386
Location: Germany
Thu, 16 Feb 2023 18:06:23 +0000 quote
I still believe that, at least in part, reading the oil level contributed to the suspicion that there was/is a problem.

Monitor oil level regularly, ensure correct reading (see above).

If necessary, install oil pan with sight glass.

What vehicle (model, engine, age) are we actually talking about?
Thu, 16 Feb 2023 21:01:06 +0000

Banned
2006 GTS 250
Joined: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 00:24:46 +0000
Posts: 10590
Location: KS USA
 
Banned
2006 GTS 250
Joined: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 00:24:46 +0000
Posts: 10590
Location: KS USA
Thu, 16 Feb 2023 21:01:06 +0000 quote
GermanGTSDriver wrote:
What vehicle (model, engine, age) are we actually talking about?
The OP has a GTS 250 2007. It's a quasar engine.
Fri, 17 Feb 2023 11:27:36 +0000

Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(48,000)Red Devil SH150i (8,500)
Joined: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 01:39:49 +0000
Posts: 3041
Location: Orange Park Florida
 
Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(48,000)Red Devil SH150i (8,500)
Joined: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 01:39:49 +0000
Posts: 3041
Location: Orange Park Florida
Fri, 17 Feb 2023 11:27:36 +0000 quote
Jah wrote:
Sure there is. I have a good parts table for MP3'250, but it has the same engine and probably the same part numbers. Here #5
#5 is a reed valve for the secondary air supply. The crankcase breather in my Honda free flows into the air filter box with a splash plate in front of it. Blow by thru Valve guide/piston rings creates an oil mist that bypasses the splash plate/ air filter and enters the intake.
Check your spark plug. If it shows it running lean, could be the O2 sensor reading an oil burn too light to see. If you have oil in the air box, this is where I'd start.
OP
Mon, 13 Mar 2023 16:45:36 +0000

Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
 
OP
Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
Mon, 13 Mar 2023 16:45:36 +0000 quote
Finally, a pic of the spark plug


Looks good to me?

Tue, 14 Mar 2023 07:52:09 +0000

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 07:52:09 +0000 quote
that plug looks terribly oil fouled.
OP
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 08:25:21 +0000

Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
 
OP
Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 08:25:21 +0000 quote
This means the oil went out the exhaust?
I did not notice oil smoke in the exhaust.
In the last 1000 miles I have not needed to add any oil?
I'm not saying you are wrong, just that I am confused.
Also, the engine performs as good as ever.
36000 miles on this fine machine
I do appreciate your comments, Greasy
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 09:26:21 +0000

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 09:26:21 +0000 quote
tonymarchman wrote:
This means the oil went out the exhaust?
I did not notice oil smoke in the exhaust.
In the last 1000 miles I have not needed to add any oil?
I'm not saying you are wrong, just that I am confused.
Also, the engine performs as good as ever.
36000 miles on this fine machine
I do appreciate your comments, Greasy
well, now we are all confused.

here's the deal, the oil has to go somewhere. it's getting pushed into the air box, it's leaking on the ground, it's in coolant or it's in the cylinder and getting burned or pushed into the exhaust.

the picture of the plug suggests that it's in the cylinder and being burned. how much of it, I don't know. but I do know a fair amount of unburnt oil can sit in a muffler.

to me, the real head scratcher is two fold: motors don't just lose a bunch of oil and then stop. they're not self healing. they don't recover, they just keep losing oil. with the noted caveat that if you overfill them, they will "lose" that bunch of oil somewhere and usually be okay. the second part of conundrum is that you're burning oil but not laying down a James bond smoke screen. I don't know, maybe you're just not noticing it while riding? maybe the cat in the exhaust is catching it all and it's just chilling out in there? maybe you were pushing oil and it wasn't getting hot enough to burn off? who's to say.

so, we're back to square one: how much oil did it *actually* lose, how much was *actually* put in and if the levels were *actually* read correctly.

something, somewhere doesn't add up. so I'd be retracing steps, and checking things. find the oil and you'll have your answer.

can you get of picture of the plug's center electrode, ground straps and insulator? basically "head on" if you will.

oh, and we have a saying, they always run the best right before they give up the ghost...
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 11:39:46 +0000

Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(48,000)Red Devil SH150i (8,500)
Joined: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 01:39:49 +0000
Posts: 3041
Location: Orange Park Florida
 
Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(48,000)Red Devil SH150i (8,500)
Joined: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 01:39:49 +0000
Posts: 3041
Location: Orange Park Florida
Tue, 14 Mar 2023 11:39:46 +0000 quote
I know my Honda isn't a Vespa.
At 8,000 miles I was getting oil in the air filter box. Online research indicated piston ring blow by. < $150 Replaced piston/cylinder. No change.
Next, I replaced the head and it fixed it. The bike still looses about 1 oz. per 200 miles but the spark plug looks like the bike is running lean. I don't have leaks(but the engine gets oily) and it doesn't show exhaust smoke. I still have the piston/cylinder with 8,000 miles I can drop in any time.
I guess this is the long way to say your plug doesn't look like mine.
OP
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 21:24:13 +0000

Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
 
OP
Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 21:24:13 +0000 quote
A couple more pics of that spark plug.


Spark plug from the GTS 250 that was losing oil

OP
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 21:25:34 +0000

Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
 
OP
Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 21:25:34 +0000 quote
Again



Thu, 16 Mar 2023 23:35:18 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:00:49 +0000
Posts: 7258
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:00:49 +0000
Posts: 7258
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 23:35:18 +0000 quote
tonymarchman wrote:
I have been very quiet for a good reason. The oil does not disappear now. I have covered 200 miles w/o needing to add anything. Is it possible my Vespa has AI and knows how to repair itself?
If it takes AI to bed in piston rings, then yes.
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 23:39:59 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:00:49 +0000
Posts: 7258
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:00:49 +0000
Posts: 7258
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Thu, 16 Mar 2023 23:39:59 +0000 quote
greasy125 wrote:
to me, the real head scratcher is two fold: motors don't just lose a bunch of oil and then stop. they're not self healing.
With respect, my MP3 lost a ton of oil (into the airbox; I found it) until it didn't.
Engine healed thyself, as it were. It just stopped, and the only intervention I made was cleaning the air filter.
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 02:50:02 +0000

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 02:50:02 +0000 quote
Madison Sully wrote:
With respect, my MP3 lost a ton of oil (into the airbox; I found it) until it didn't.
Engine healed thyself, as it were. It just stopped, and the only intervention I made was cleaning the air filter.

if early on, it could be attributed to the rings fully seating. if not, then perhaps the riding style or conditions changed? ie less WFO, for instance.

but sometimes things DO happen, it's just rare, is all.
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 02:52:20 +0000

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 19:59:19 +0000
Posts: 12919
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 02:52:20 +0000 quote
I'd say that plug looks worn and oil fouled.
OP
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 20:57:40 +0000

Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
 
OP
Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 20:57:40 +0000 quote
I agree, is a CR8EIB-10 NGK a compatible plug. Scooter west sent it, I am also adjusting the valves, and replacing the belt. I plan to do more riding this season than last. No cannonball stuff, just enjoying the scenery.
Oh, and replacing the shocks with Bitubo.s
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 21:44:25 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:00:49 +0000
Posts: 7258
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:00:49 +0000
Posts: 7258
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Fri, 17 Mar 2023 21:44:25 +0000 quote
tonymarchman wrote:
I agree, is a CR8EIB-10 NGK a compatible plug.
This is the plug I use in my 2008 GTS.
Sat, 18 Mar 2023 20:00:33 +0000

Member
GTS 250
Joined: Sat, 04 Mar 2023 00:48:04 +0000
Posts: 9
Location: Mid, TN
 
Member
GTS 250
Joined: Sat, 04 Mar 2023 00:48:04 +0000
Posts: 9
Location: Mid, TN
Sat, 18 Mar 2023 20:00:33 +0000 quote
tonymarchman wrote:
So I got the new battery installed and was about to go for a ride and enjoy the 60 degree weather. Then I remember the oil light coming on during my last ride. I paid $8.50 for a quart at a gas station and rode it home. So I pulled the dip stick out and nothing showing on it. This was a 10 mile and low oil again, I refilled it and went for a 20 mile ride and low oil again, Nothing on the floor, the water looks clean, so going out the exhaust in a big way. I'm thinking if I have to pull the motor and do the rings and valves I might want to do the malossi upgrade kit, piston, cylinder and head. Just wish I knew a competent Vespa mechanic in middle tennessee. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.
TIA
Tony
Fast Italian Bikes is in the back room of Hooligans on 96 west of Murfreesboro. Its halfway between the Boro and the Castle. He plays with Ducati's and Guzzi's. Maybe he could help ya out with the rebuild/repair/ oil investigation if necessary. Cant hurt to call.
OP
Sat, 18 Mar 2023 22:55:51 +0000

Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
 
OP
Hooked
2007 Vespa 250 GTS
Joined: Fri, 16 Sep 2016 01:58:48 +0000
Posts: 333
Location: Nashville, Tn
Sat, 18 Mar 2023 22:55:51 +0000 quote
I gave FIB a call and 'YES' they do work on Vespas!!! and only an hour from me.
Thanks for the tip!
PS: I was really surprised they would answer the phone at 5:55 on Sat. evening.
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