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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
 
Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
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Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
UTC quote
Few days ago I accidentally picked up another Vespa.
It is 1984 PK 50 S (V5X2T) which stayed few years on the open air. As far as I know the previous owner had it for 12 years but scooter never was in good shape.

I always like look of pre-XL PK's. But the main advantage is that this PK S have all papers and a number plate.
And I also have PK 50 Nuova without papers but with freshly built engine and front fork assembly.
So Nuova again sacrifices herself to give life to another Vespa.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
First time I see it on 30 May, 2020.
The day I picked up it - 03.02.2023
The day I picked up it - 03.02.2023
The day I picked up it - 03.02.2023
The day I picked up it - 03.02.2023
Gave it some attention, take off weird stuff, clean it a little.
Gave it some attention, take off weird stuff, clean it a little.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
It's outrageous - only 1 km for three years!
It's outrageous - only 1 km for three years!
I decide to call it the Snowball.
I decide to call it the Snowball.
V5X1M ?
V5X1M ?
With new friends in dry garage.
With new friends in dry garage.
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
New spark plug, bit of fresh fuel and here we are! Was really surprised that all lights and turn signals works. Ride on it a little - clutch is terribly slips, gears change ok but seems too short so I think maybe it have something bigger than original cylinder.
UTC

Molto Verboso
'07 GTS250, '07 LX150, '81 P200E, '78 P200E, '64 V90 and 3 Ciaos
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Molto Verboso
'07 GTS250, '07 LX150, '81 P200E, '78 P200E, '64 V90 and 3 Ciaos
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UTC quote
Neat find!
@garncarz avatar
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UTC quote
"accidentally picked up another Vespa." ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon
@greasy125 avatar
UTC

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
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@greasy125 avatar
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
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UTC quote
hell yeah!

pre-XL PK's are where it's at.

your rear signals and tail light look slightly different than mine, I'm guessing it's just a market difference or maybe because it's a 50

you're gonna want to take off those foot pegs immediately, they're total ankle biters!
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
garncarz wrote:
"accidentally picked up another Vespa." ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon
Yes mate maybe I said it wrong but my english is not very good.

Few years ago I already offered to buy this Vespa and later I asked again, but the owner categorically did not want to sell it, saying that he would repair it and ride.
So another three years have passed since my last proposal and he called me and offered to buy. Of course now is not the best time to buy, but I couldn't resist the great price. He called me on Thursday, and on Friday I went to pick it up.
OP
@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
greasy125 wrote:
hell yeah!

pre-XL PK's are where it's at.

your rear signals and tail light look slightly different than mine, I'm guessing it's just a market difference or maybe because it's a 50

you're gonna want to take off those foot pegs immediately, they're total ankle biters!
Tail light is original and it have no stop light. And rear blinkers is not original, it have wires solded to bulbs Facepalm emoticon and bulbs hanging on zip ties.

It seems that it have combined 6V and 12V electrical system - turn signals have 12V bulbs but rear and front lights have 6V bulbs.
And now I'm a little confused because I want to put in motor with original PK XL 12V ignition and I don't know if it will work correctly with the original wiring of PK S.

It have no high beam - only running and parking light. The high beam indicator have original plastic blank on the bulb place.

I also think that this PK S had no speedometer but plastic blank when it came from the factory. Thats why it have 125cc speedo and no wires to speedo light.

And the first what I done - removed that weird PX crash bars and foot pegs. Maybe previous owner likes how it looks... But the main problem with it was that you can't comfortably kick the motor.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
⚠️ Last edited by roland87 on UTC; edited 1 time
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
So the question about electric scheme. All this electric things and wires harness is nightmare for me.

Hope somebody can help me. I want to use PK XL 12V ignition(I also have CDI, voltage regulator and indicator relay) with PK S wiring loom. Will it work straight or I need do some changes?

Here is electric diagram of my PK S

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
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PK50XL, PK100S, ET3
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UTC quote
roland87 wrote:
Yes mate maybe I said it wrong but my english is not very good.

\you said it perfectly.
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UTC quote
I love the "accidentally picked up another vespa" line. Always a good excuse. Great little find.
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
As I was a lot of enthusiasm I wanted to do at least something.

As Snowball was left in friend's garage I came home and start to tear down Nuova. Taked off front fork and engine.
Next day I put Nuova frame in my car and go to friend's garage. Taked off front fork and engine from Snowball.
Left Nuova and Snowball fork in the friend's garage and go home with Snowball frame and engine.
Then put Nuova's fork on Snowball.
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Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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PK50XL, PK100S, ET3
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UTC quote
From my knowledge of PK wiring, its a nightmare. Rather than put the PK XL engine in with its current flywheel and stator, could you swap and put the PK S stator onto you rebuilt engine. I guess its all down to if its a 19 or 20 mm cone for the flywheel. Or would either flywheel work with the stator.
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
Matchlessman wrote:
From my knowledge of PK wiring, its a nightmare. Rather than put the PK XL engine in with its current flywheel and stator, could you swap and put the PK S stator onto you rebuilt engine. I guess its all down to if its a 19 or 20 mm cone for the flywheel. Or would either flywheel work with the stator.
Excellent tip! I don't think about this way as I thought that PK S have 19mm cone. But I don't look at it yet.
On other side 6V headlight is very dim...
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UTC quote
roland87 wrote:
Excellent tip! I don't think about this way as I thought that PK S have 19mm cone. But I don't look at it yet.
Its got to be worth having a look. Its all down to if the PK S stator will work with the PK XL flywheel
roland87 wrote:
On other side 6V headlight is very dim...
Could you make it rev harder
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
Matchlessman wrote:
Its got to be worth having a look. Its all down to if the PK S stator will work with the PK XL flywheel


Could you make it rev harder
4-pole stator not compatible with 6-pole flywheel, I tried it on another engine. If I'm remember correct it rubs one another.
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
Looked at PK S ignition closer and realised that flywheel for small cone.

And I remembered one small but important moment - on my PK XL engine crankshaft is with small cone too! The PK XL flywheel mount on it with Crimaz adapter.
So puzzle is done and I will go by advice of Matchlessman and try to use PK S ignition and look how it will go.

Thanks again mate!

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
⚠️ Last edited by roland87 on UTC; edited 1 time
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
I also made photos of... voltage regulator and indicator relay???
It is totally mess and madness. But this shit works

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
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'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
And on the next step I changed primary cog from 19T to 21T on the PK XL motor.
Gearbox was very short with 19/60 but for off-road riding it was perfect. I use gearing calculator and it seems that 21/60 must be ok for road usage with 3 speed gear box. I also have 20T cog if 21T appears too long.

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
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'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
Removed the flywheel(yes it is for small cone) and was surprised how nice and clean the stator looks.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@sdjohn avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
'15 GTS300, '86 PX125EFL, '66 VBB, '01 ET4
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@sdjohn avatar
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UTC quote
that's the best part of all of the electrical you've shown!
UTC

parallelogramerist
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parallelogramerist
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UTC quote
roland87 wrote:
I also made photos of... voltage regulator and indicator relay???
It is totally mess and madness. But this shit works

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
Looks like a capacitor was used with that regulator rectifier in order to store up some 12VDC power?
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
sdjohn wrote:
that's the best part of all of the electrical you've shown!
100% !
whodatschrome wrote:
Looks like a capacitor was used with that regulator rectifier in order to store up some 12VDC power?
I'm very bad in electric questions. All I can saw that on the original electric diagram of my PK 50 S there is no any capacitor or voltage regulator - only indicators relay and Bizener(Zener) diode... NIGHTMARE Facepalm emoticon
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
Had few hours today that I spent in my garage.

Changed ignition on PK XL engine from 6-pole to 4-pole.
And noticed that 4-pole ignition not works with PK XL CDI - it gives sparks only two or three times when kicked and then nothing.
So I put CDI unit from PK 50 S too.
6-pole out.
6-pole out.
4-pole in.
4-pole in.
Fresh wires and connectors.
Fresh wires and connectors.
4-pole ignition works only with this orange CDI.
4-pole ignition works only with this orange CDI.
I had to drill one additional hole on the CDI bracket.
I had to drill one additional hole on the CDI bracket.
Hope all will work proper.
Hope all will work proper.
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@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
I realised that I have no decent exhaust for this build. I can't use Polini Banana as it needs lot of frame cutting because it was for V-range Vespas.
I will be use terrible original exhaust for some time with this SIP stainless steel manifold. Hope it gives a little more power.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
Can somebody help me with advice about glove box lock?
On my PK 50 S it looks like after bad repair and works terrible.
I understand that I need buy new cylinder lock and new button and other parts. But I can't understand what exactly I need. Maybe somebody can give photos of lock mechanism or link with it?

I need to buy:
1.Cylinder lock
2.Press button set
Is it enough or I need some more parts?

Here is how lock looks on my Vespa:
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
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'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
Some good news. My friend found his old exhaust which was mounted on his PK when he got it. And now he presented me this exhaust.

Seems like Leo Vince Secsys but have different muffler and have no upper muffler mount.
For sure this pipe saw better days but also for sure it will give better performance to my engine than old original pipe.

I also was surprised how easy and right on it mounts on the engine. Much better than brand new Polini Banana which I mounted on few PK's. I even can put in/out wheel without deflate it.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@sdjohn avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
'15 GTS300, '86 PX125EFL, '66 VBB, '01 ET4
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UTC quote
that seems like a good design, do they still make them?
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parallelogramerist
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parallelogramerist
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UTC quote
I gave up on finding a new (or used) Secsys exhaust many years ago for my PK125. I specifically wanted that pipe so that my spare tire would fit. But alas, that pipe wasn't in my cards.
@sdjohn avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
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UTC quote
Someone should copy those.
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@roland87 avatar
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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@roland87 avatar
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UTC quote
whodatschrome wrote:
I gave up on finding a new (or used) Secsys exhaust many years ago for my PK125. I specifically wanted that pipe so that my spare tire would fit. But alas, that pipe wasn't in my cards.
Do Leo Vince was make Secsys for 125cc? The more I googled about this exhaust the more I want one.
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UTC quote
Not quite the same but simonini have this one.

https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/product/racing-exhaust-simonini_40300300?cr=3a6304bb-cc81-4ed5-9f63-1ff45fe1abfa&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI09ndjN-c_QIVTNPtCh00BQ6YEAQYASABEgIGtfD_BwE

The links for the one for a 43mm stroke but they do the 51mm stroke as well.
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parallelogramerist
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parallelogramerist
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UTC quote
roland87 wrote:
Do Leo Vince was make Secsys for 125cc? The more I googled about this exhaust the more I want one.
They made a 50cc version and a 125cc version. I did find a NOS 50cc Secsys about 3 years ago (online overseas), but i would have had to do some modifications to it to fit my 125 cylinder, so i passed on it.
OP
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
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UTC quote
Before I get this Secsys pipe my idea was to buy SIP Road Banana 43mm stroke and then in future when/if I want go to 130cc just buy only SIP manifold for 51mm stroke.
I emailed to SIP with question about compatibility 43mm stroke exhaust with 51mm stroke manifold and they replied "Yes".

But on the other side is my sad experience with Polini Banana - I try 43mm stroke exhaust with 51mm stroke manifold and it was a failure.
OP
@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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UTC quote
BTW today I have few good hours with Snowball.
Changed all cable sleeves and mount a rubber grommet.
Changed all cable sleeves and mount a rubber grommet.
It is really easy work with long enough spare cable.
It is really easy work with long enough spare cable.
Old sleeve out - new sleeve in.
Old sleeve out - new sleeve in.
Mounted brake pedal from my PK Nuova.
Mounted brake pedal from my PK Nuova.
Small diner.
Small diner.
Fresh air bellow.
Fresh air bellow.
Cleaned a bit inside chassis.
Cleaned a bit inside chassis.
One of centre stand springs was wrong...
One of centre stand springs was wrong...
...so it worn out the stand mount...
...so it worn out the stand mount...
...and spring mount hole on the stand.
...and spring mount hole on the stand.
And removed that terrible tractor-style indicators.
And removed that terrible tractor-style indicators.
@sdjohn avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
'15 GTS300, '86 PX125EFL, '66 VBB, '01 ET4
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UTC quote
what will you do with the indicator holes? or do you have different indicators to use?
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Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
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Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
UTC quote
sdjohn wrote:
what will you do with the indicator holes? or do you have different indicators to use?
I want to put original or repro(but model correct) indicators.
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9541
Location: seattle/athens
 
Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9541
Location: seattle/athens
UTC quote
roland87 wrote:
Before I get this Secsys pipe my idea was to buy SIP Road Banana 43mm stroke and then in future when/if I want go to 130cc just buy only SIP manifold for 51mm stroke.
I emailed to SIP with question about compatibility 43mm stroke exhaust with 51mm stroke manifold and they replied "Yes".

But on the other side is my sad experience with Polini Banana - I try 43mm stroke exhaust with 51mm stroke manifold and it was a failure.
Have you seen this Simonini pipe? I had a Primavera I put one on and it did a good job for me. Tire changing was actually pretty easy w/ good access to pull the swingarm bolt, then just swing it out on the header pipe joint, twisting the retainer springs a little.

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

Here it is on my first USA bike:
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text


Also Leo Vince has a decent pipe I got for my PK that I later cut & modified for my older smallie.

On the PK, I got a killer deal from the shop of a friend. It fits nicely up in that muffler cavity underneath that older smallies don't have:
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
OP
@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
 
Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
UTC quote
V oodoo wrote:
Have you seen this Simonini pipe?
Yes saw them. But don't like how they look and finished - too rude and, for my PK S, too race . Never hear them in live but read a lot about the too loud.

So in not near future I think about SIP Road Banana or new Polini Classic
I put the last one on my mate's engine and was really like this pipe - very accuracy and hight quality product, mounting also perfect.
OP
@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
 
Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
UTC quote
Good progress today:
Engine in!
Engine in!
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
It was really hard to do swing arm bolt on exhaust. But done at least.
It was really hard to do swing arm bolt on exhaust. But done at least.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Fast flow tap from my Nuova.
Fast flow tap from my Nuova.
OP
@roland87 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
 
Molto Verboso
@roland87 avatar
'13 LML Star 200, '81 50 Special, '81 P 150 X, '87 PK 50 Nuova, '84 PK 50 S
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1139
Location: Ukraine. Kyiv.
UTC quote
After mounting carburettor I noticed that there is very little space between air filter and chassis seam.
In the static I can't them do to hit one another but there is really very close.

On my Nuova there was no same problem - the seam looks a half smaller and I also think that upper rubbers of shock absorber was in better condition.

I try to sort it tomorrow.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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