Modern Vespa

Looking for a late model Primavera 150. Found a nice one, although a bit overpriced IMO, but it has a lien on it from an out of state bank. This means we can't both go to the bank and pay it off.

Even if the owner paid it off ahead of time, it will still take a few weeks for him to get the title in his name and be able to transfer it over.

I'm pretty sure I'm not going to pursue this one anymore, but just looking for opinions.

Run away! Don't even think about it!

There's never going to be a happy ending to that one.

Yeah, that was my thought also.

When I was young and impatient(er) I did a 'third party lease buyout' on a car I had to have. It was a nightmare.

The process of transferring the title from the lienholder was awful and cumbersome. It required countless phone calls listening to what seemed like hours of hold music, putting trust in strangers to either 'do their jobs or do the right thing' to keep the process moving, paying for all sorts of certified mail, and in the end I think it was still 3mo before I had what I needed to take ownership and register the car.

While my transaction was different than what you are looking at, I foresee the possibility of a similar hassle.

NOPE. Title in hand only.

Good advise here. A story from heck for sure.

Also, when I sold one of my used vehicles to a private party, I
road with them to the department of motor vehicles and transferred
title then and there.

If the buyer drags their heels on transferring the title and gets
into a serious accident, you are still on the title and get named in
the law suit. Months later and attorney fees later you can get out of
the thing if you have a bill of sale.

Liability and responsibility follows ownership in this country.

Bob Copeland
Disclosure: I am not a attorney. Just an insurance dude that has watched the horror stories unfold from my customers over the years.

Same here in I think all states

An owner can pay off a vehicle from a remote location to a bank. You can be shown the proof of a lien release from a remote location. The real question is your need to see the scooter up close and personal before handing over money.
Might have a proxy friend to help.
Many such sellers need your money to pay the lien off, a common issue.

I bought wrecked vehicles that cost far more than a scooter from a puter and often sent electronic payments after my bid. Of course these were sellers who'd not have offered a vehicle with non-clear title.

Not so much anymore. There's often a form attached to the title that is filled in and submitted by the seller as soon as they sell the bike and take their name off the title. There is nothing that an attorney in an ambulance chaser type case is going to gain by adding the previous owner of a motorcycle to a lawsuit.

Not how it works. The title is in the owner's name. The lender has a lien against the bike that is recorded on the title. It's like buying a house with a mortgage from an out of state lender. Not that uncommon anymore. If the experts didn't scare you off, and you do want the bike, it's fairly easy to contact the lender and find out how they would handle this.

A lien is resolvable but IMO this, and the high price, are signs of a reluctant or unprepared seller. Sellers who want to be rid of a vehicle get the title cleared up one way or another so they can move on.

No clear title =no purchase There are just too many nice scooters for sale at reasonable prices to get involved with purchasing a pig in a poke.

Thanks. This is one of the reasons I have decided not to pursue the Vespa. I did call the financial company that has the lien. They told me they would hold onto the lien for 10 days after receiving payment before the would notify the DMV that it has been removed. Then the DMV would send the owner a new title showing the lien has been removed. All this can take a few weeks to happen.

I was surprised at the 10 day hold so I called them back and another person told me the same thing. The only excetion to this would be if the seller sent a certified check and then it would only be a 3 day hold.

I agree. The lien holder can part of the trusted other parties, same as a friend who does your pre-sale inspection. Both parties might have far more experience than you in such matters?
The 10 days is for $$$ to transfer. Thats why many vehicle auctions mandate electronic transfers from even those whom they know well.
The crux of it is IF you want it at the price where it sits or not. There are ways to pull it off. Much depends on your ability to either personally inspect or remotely decide on the scoot.
Most all road vehicles will have a lien unless a dealer sale. It's quite common to move a vehicle via a bill of sale, fancy or hand written.
Having a phone conversation works wonders for making deals in my world, not that they serve all purposes.
Me thinks you're a poor candidate for remote buying of big-ticket items unless it's a dealer and good luck with that senario. Candidly said, many of the very same issues discussed above are present in sales done face to face.
Which states involved matters a lot for tidbit details of transactions.

As long as you can prove your not the current owner.[/img]

One day received a post card from a foreign car repair shop.
Warning me that failure any longer to pay the $460 repair bill will entitle them to take ownership of the Audi 4000S.
!!!
WTHeck-! My son sold that car before shipping out in the Marines months ago!
Phone call revealed lady had never finished the paperwork on the car...then drove over parking block. Tore off oilpan. Towed to their shop.
Never came back.
Car was ours again if we paid the $460!

Visited the shop. We talked.....then told him to keep it. Car wasn't ours any longer....of course I never mentioned this to my son.
Not the part where he could have sold it twice🙂
O.S.

I sold a car (2000 BMW Z3 one of my sons drove in college) to a KY golf pro, guy about 55, who never titled the car after a couple of years from date of sale. This was long enough ago that I've forgotten every little aspect but needless to say, I got a letter from KY DMV or maybe my Co clerk asked if I still owned it when I was in there-something like that. I found the guys golf course online and called him and gave him the riot act, title it or I call your local cops, etc..
No liability to me really as I had a copy of bill of sale.

Brings to mind an idea that states send letters to all owners on file to verify current ownership. Anything not registered after a certain amount of time anyway; perhaps 1.5 years for one-year registrations, and 2.5 years for 2-year registrations. Motorcycles in Wisconsin get registered every 2 years, I think...

To answer the original question, no, I'd not buy any used vehicle where I'm not walking away with the title. I have had occasions where I had to walk away (at least temporarily) due to the loan not being paid off. Which gets frustrating, especially if I drove two hours cash in hand.

Now that you mention the "letter idea", I recall what happened on that car.
In KY get a property taxes owed postcard in KY on real property, cars, RV's, boats, motos, etc.. I kept getting one on that Z3 and would tell the Co clerk when I'd go in person to pay for tag stickers that it was sold. After more than once she said it was not getting paid by anyone so I then made a serious phone call to the buyer. I assume he was dumb enough to think he'd avoid paying.
Pay in 30 days or interest grows, not to mention the leos stopping you for lapsed tag sticker.

When you sell a vehicle in SC, there is a form on the bottom.of the title that has to be filled out by the new and original owner. Then removed from the title and sent to the state DMV. This is to protect the seller. That and a signed bill of sale from both parties. Many people don't bother with this detail but it has saved me a few times when a former buyer did not register for title.
Bluside: scoots come up for sale all the time, the right one will come alone at the right price. Good luck with the hunt.

I bought a bike with a lien on it once, kind of. Here's how we made it work:

I went to the person's house, saw the bike, saw this person was very much settled in there (didn't look like a renter, wasn't in a building, etc).

I left a very small deposit (few hundred bucks) to show good faith.

I left and the seller went to the bank to wire the money to pay off the bike.

Two days later we called the finance company, from my cell phone, from the number I googled, put them on speaker phone, and together we went through the situation with the customer service lady who verified with the VIN# and the loan number that the loan was paid off and they already submitted for the lien to come off the title. I also had her confirm that once the loan was closed it could not be re-opened again.

Then I gave him the rest of the money and left with my bike.

So, I get why everyone else is saying run away, however, I'm a firm believer in this:



If everyone else is running away from this Vespa, which based on the forum, might be the case, that's a great opportunity for you to swoop in for a really good deal, IF you find it reasonable to trust this person to not disappear on you and pay off the remainder, and IF you take precautions like using your own phone, calling the number for the finance company you looked up yourself, and verifying everything yourself.

I got my old Suzuki Boulevard for $5,000. Three years and 5,000 km earlier it had cost the guy $10,000. Nobody wanted the bike with the lien on it, but I did. I rode it for several years, loved that bike, and when I sold it I managed to make a profit on that bike and put it towards my V-Rod.

Be greedy when others are fearful.