@madison_sully avatar
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UTC quote
Matchlessman wrote:
Surely the MP3 is a tricycle.
Makes me wonder if you have ever ridden an MP3.
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UTC quote
Madison Sully wrote:
Makes me wonder if you have ever ridden an MP3.
No, I haven't. I've only seen pictures and they look like they have 3 wheels.
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UTC quote
Matchlessman wrote:
No, I haven't. I've only seen pictures and they look like they have 3 wheels.
Sure, an MP3 has three wheels, but it doesn't ride like a tricycle such as a Harley trike or a Can Am Spyder.

When you are on it, it rides just like a two-wheeler.

So I think of it as a motorcycle with a dual front wheel.
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UTC quote
I reply Vespa, it is a type of motorcycle and it is also known as a scooter.
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UTC quote
greasy125 wrote:
when somebody sees your helmet and asks "what do you ride?" what's your answer?
This is a good question. And my truthful answer is that I call my various motorized rides "bikes". By that I mean my Vespas, my Buddys, my Ural sidecar bike, my Suzuki 650 Savage, my Honda 50cc Cub, my MP3, and so on. If someone asks what kind of bike, I tell them exactly what make and model it is. And as others have noted, the U.S. state where I live and register them, calls all of them motorcycles. (Oregon has a separate definition for "mopeds" - they have pedals, engine under 50cc and are not capable of speeds over 30 mph on level ground- and "scooters" which are those little things that you stand on and are likewise restricted in engine size and speed)
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UTC quote
Miguel wrote:
[*] Scooter: stand on while riding it. No registration or license required. External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
[/list]


Never stood on the seat of a Vespa? Look Mom, no hands!
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UTC quote
I call 'em all "bikes" as well, including bicycles. I sometimes have to clarify what TYPE of bike I'm referring to, depending on the convo and audience. Laughing emoticon

As for Vespas and such being called motorcycles...if Harleys and other liter+ bikes are called scooters by their riders, they have no room to get their feathers ruffled.
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UTC quote
I always thought to be a motorcycle it did not have a step through.
It definitely is not a moped, also for a vehicle to be classified as a moped it isn' about the size of the engine as much as does it have pedals and can it be pedaled by a human if and when required.
All scooters are motorcycles but not all motorcycles are scooters.
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UTC quote
Motorcyclists mostly know the answer. I don't really care much for the opinions of the non riding public when it comes to that.

And then there's also calling motorcycles -bikes - and yes, quite a few among riders call their own motorcycles - mopeds - as well.
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UTC quote
According to most DMVs, yest they are.

I'm a lifelong motorcyclist and at this point I consider anything with two wheels and a motor to be a motorcycle.

Now the question is...do Vespa/Moped riders really WANT to be classified as motorcyclists? Some wear the MOD badge proudly
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UTC quote
On the King Size side of the spectrum, there was the short-lived Craig Vetter Defiant kit, which utilized a complete Sportster chassis, including gas tank, from the steering stem back beneath the main body, and the the bike's entire fork assembly, brakes, and wheel at the front end.

It was not a twist-and-go machine however, it used the Sportster's clutched five speed.

If anything blurred the line between scooter and motorcycle, this surely did a good job of it. Outwardly, it's definitely a scooter that provided a visual disguise for a true motorcycle.

I always questioned the use of an 883 Sportster as the de facto donor machine for this kit when so many first generation Yamaha 1200 V-Max's were available.
Vetter Defiant
Vetter Defiant
Vetter Defiant
Vetter Defiant
Vetter Defiant
Vetter Defiant
@miguel avatar
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UTC quote
greasy125 wrote:
I really don't know how I feel about this. part of me says kill it with fire. the other part of me admires the vision and craftsmanship and wonders how it rides.

both parts of me think that it looks like a modern Harley topper that they totally screwed up trying to modernize it.

at any rate, it need a sparkly unicorn sticker for sure.
I also have mixed thoughts about it. IIRC, it was a frame kit and prolly prolly came with a few other doodads and you transferred parts from a donor Sportster. I don't really the cost but it wasn't outrages. I think they are not in biz any longer so you don't have any pressure to buy one to see how it ride. 🙂

Miguel
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UTC quote
JBacklund wrote:
On the King Size side of the spectrum, there was the short-lived Craig Vetter Defiant kit, which utilized a complete Sportster chassis, including gas tank, from the steering stem back beneath the main body, and the the bike's entire fork assembly, brakes, and wheel at the front end.

It was not a twist-and-go machine however, it used the Sportster's clutched five speed.

If anything blurred the line between scooter and motorcycle, this surely did a good job of it. Outwardly, it's definitely a scooter that provided a visual disguise for a true motorcycle.

I always questioned the use of an 883 Sportster as the de facto donor machine for this kit when so many first generation Yamaha 1200 V-Max's were available.
Love the design! That your Vetter Defiant? Miguel
@rick_dangerous avatar
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UTC quote
It's cool, love the art-deco streamliner style!
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UTC quote
Matchlessman wrote:
Surely the MP3 is a tricycle.
A tricycle has one wheel in front, just like a real grownups motorcycle.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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UTC quote
In the UK on registration document it is scooter.
Under taxation class it is bicycle.
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@adri avatar
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Atypical Canadian
2009 Vespa S50(LX150 motor swap), 2006 Vespa GTS250ie
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@adri avatar
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UTC quote
It's all relative, and it's all about the frame.

Let me park one Vespa in between my two BMW GS motorcycles that could be ridden around the world. My Vespa isn't much of a motorcycle is it?

Let me park the other Vespa in between my Triumph Bonneville that invokes 50s and 60s retro motorcycle vibes, and my Kawasaki Z900RS that invokes 70s and 80s motorcycle nostalgia. My Vespa isn't much of a motorcycle, is it?

Now let me park it between a pair of ebikes that don't need government papers, insurance, or fuel to burn... framed like that, I guess it's a motorcycle.

Maybe you go out on a date with a girl who rides an ebike, you wanna tell her you ride a motorcycle, cause y'know, "according to the government" - oh la la!

Maybe your next date is with a really nice girl, like my friend Cat who rode her Kawasaki Vulcan 1700 Vaquero across Canada a few times, you both arrive with helmets in hand, she asks what do you ride? Are you really going to say a motorcycle?

It's a Vespa, or a scooter, and that's okay, just own it. Some will think it's cool, some won't, who cares?
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UTC quote
JRoss4000 wrote:
It's a motorcycle in Ohio too. But I would always call it my scooter. No step-thru bike is a motorcycle imo
I know folks who call their Harley Road Kings scoots.
@pigletpilot avatar
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Molto Verboso
Gina, 1965 Vespa 180SS, Bella,1968 Vespa 150 Super, Mia, 2017 Vespa Primavera 70th Anniversary 150ie, Gabriella, 2017 GTS300 ABS
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
I need a motorcycle licence to ride my Vespas because they are all over 50cc, but I tell people I ride a scooter or a Vespa.
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UTC quote
Miguel wrote:
Love the design! That your Vetter Defiant? Miguel
No. I think that the one in my photos may be the only example ever built and is Vetter's original prototype.

I don't know if any of the kit versions were sold.

I did have a minor hand in the project, though, as Craig Vetter had me do some concept styling illustrations for various body versions of it.

I'll try to find some examples of them.
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UTC quote
what would you call this?

it's an conversion kit from NMoto.com for a BMW C 400 X
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
OP
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Hooked
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UTC quote
I do find it a little interesting that I specified "gut reaction" to whether or not YOU think a Vespa is a motorcycle, and still got largely responses about what the law of the land considers it to be. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer here.
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UTC quote
SteelBytes wrote:
what would you call this?

it's an conversion kit from NMoto.com for a BMW C 400 X
I really admired nmoto. They have sold out on all their BMW conversion bikes. They are working on other bikes base on a non BMW platform. IIRC, they will launch in 2024.

Miguel
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UTC quote
Trenchleton wrote:
I do find it a little interesting that I specified "gut reaction" to whether or not YOU think a Vespa is a motorcycle, and still got largely responses about what the law of the land considers it to be. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer here.
Ok...my 'gut reaction' is that my Vespa GTS is
not a motorcycle in spite of the legal verbiage otherwise in most jurisdictions.

But then, this is coming from a mainly 'motorcycle guy' who happens to also like step-through, twist-and-go, machines that are drop-dead gorgeous to look at and damn fun to ride.

I don't think that I'll ever be without a Vespa, or a couple of motorcycles either.
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UTC quote
In 1964 Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart, when asked for a definition of pornography, said "I know it when I see it." I think we all know a motorcycle when we see one.

You could also ask, "Is a Harley a scooter?" Except you never would.
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UTC quote
GBaby wrote:
You could also ask, "Is a Harley a scooter?" Except you never would.
You might in 1962 when they made this.
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UTC quote
znomit wrote:
You might in 1962 when they made this.
Boom! When you're right, you're right!
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UTC quote
JBacklund wrote:
Sometimes my answer is "a Vespa".

Sometimes my answer is "Mongo".
Blue is the fastest colour😉

Not a motorbike. Not a scooter. It's a Vespa.
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UTC quote
adri wrote:
Let me park one Vespa in between my two BMW GS motorcycles that could be ridden around the world. My Vespa isn't much of a motorcycle is it?
Point taken, but Markus Meyer might like a word....
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UTC quote
Mopeds have pedals. Everything else that I ride with two wheels I refer to as scoots. Any Vespa, 2T or 4T are classified on the title as MC.
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UTC quote
Trenchleton wrote:
I do find it a little interesting that I specified "gut reaction" to whether or not YOU think a Vespa is a motorcycle, and still got largely responses about what the law of the land considers it to be. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer here.
Ok, my "gut", as well as muscle memory in my clutch hand and shifter foot, tells me that my Vespa is not the same as a motorcycle. But when I see a mixed group of "bikes" parked together I see motorcycles, scooters, and mopeds.
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UTC quote
grahamlml wrote:
In the UK on registration document it is scooter.
Under taxation class it is bicycle.
That really muddies the waters!
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Atypical Canadian
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UTC quote
fledermaus wrote:
Point taken, but Markus Meyer might like a word....
lol love it The exception that proves the rule.
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UTC quote
Is this a bicycle?
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UTC quote
znomit wrote:
You might in 1962 when they made this.
I've always liked the appearance of the old Harley 'Topper' scooter, and would be very interested in one if Harley had the cajones to bring back a modernized version of it with 250-400cc's...oh, and didn't want $20,000 for one.
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UTC quote
JBacklund wrote:
I've always liked the appearance of the old Harley 'Topper' scooter, and would be very interested in one if Harley had the cajones to bring back a modernized version of it with 250-400cc's...oh, and didn't want $20,000 for one.
As long as we are talking about the good old days - I'd like one of these. I am willing to call it whatever you choose.
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UTC quote
adri wrote:
lol love it The exception that proves the rule.
There are so many exceptions in this area that they...mmm...make a new rule? Anyway, these good folks here do call their Vespa a scooter, apparently ignorant of the limitations of one

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Atypical Canadian
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UTC quote
RRider wrote:
There are so many exceptions in this area that they...mmm...make a new rule? Anyway, these good folks here do call their Vespa a scooter, apparently ignorant of the limitations of one

Yes there are, this is the guy I'm currently following:

https://www.youtube.com/@Vespanda

But I don't see anyone on MV doing this kind of thing, whereas on the GS forums it's more just like "oh look, another middle aged white man riding around the world on my GS. Right, so anyway..."

Soooo, let's not get toooo carried away with trying to 'normalize' the popularity of the 'All Terrain Vespa' lol
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
adri wrote:
But I don't see anyone on MV doing this kind of thing, whereas on the GS forums it's more just like "oh look, another middle aged white man riding around the world on my GS. Right, so anyway..."

Soooo, let's not get toooo carried away with trying to 'normalize' the popularity of the 'All Terrain Vespa' lol
"All terrain" isn't part of what defines a motorcycle. If you want to crack open that can of worms, check for the ADVrider thread about "what is an adventure bike?"
Spoiler alert: it got MESSY!
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UTC quote
adri wrote:
Yes there are, this is the guy I'm currently following:

https://www.youtube.com/@Vespanda

But I don't see anyone on MV doing this kind of thing, whereas on the GS forums it's more just like "oh look, another middle aged white man riding around the world on my GS. Right, so anyway..."

Soooo, let's not get toooo carried away with trying to 'normalize' the popularity of the 'All Terrain Vespa' lol
Quite the opposite, I'd say. It does seem 'normal' to go around the world with almost anything nowadays. If not Vespa brand in particular, scoots, mopeds, small street bikes, definitely.

Mayby exactly because there's not much novelty to do so with a GS?

This said, although especiallly the 'real GSs', big boxers are indeed munching plenty of miles collectively, a large majority of those seldom go off-road
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