Modern Vespa

Makes me wonder if you have ever ridden an MP3.

No, I haven't. I've only seen pictures and they look like they have 3 wheels.

Sure, an MP3 has three wheels, but it doesn't ride like a tricycle such as a Harley trike or a Can Am Spyder.

When you are on it, it rides just like a two-wheeler.

So I think of it as a motorcycle with a dual front wheel.

I reply Vespa, it is a type of motorcycle and it is also known as a scooter.

This is a good question. And my truthful answer is that I call my various motorized rides "bikes". By that I mean my Vespas, my Buddys, my Ural sidecar bike, my Suzuki 650 Savage, my Honda 50cc Cub, my MP3, and so on. If someone asks what kind of bike, I tell them exactly what make and model it is. And as others have noted, the U.S. state where I live and register them, calls all of them motorcycles. (Oregon has a separate definition for "mopeds" - they have pedals, engine under 50cc and are not capable of speeds over 30 mph on level ground- and "scooters" which are those little things that you stand on and are likewise restricted in engine size and speed)

Never stood on the seat of a Vespa? Look Mom, no hands!

I call 'em all "bikes" as well, including bicycles. I sometimes have to clarify what TYPE of bike I'm referring to, depending on the convo and audience.

As for Vespas and such being called motorcycles...if Harleys and other liter+ bikes are called scooters by their riders, they have no room to get their feathers ruffled.

I always thought to be a motorcycle it did not have a step through.
It definitely is not a moped, also for a vehicle to be classified as a moped it isn' about the size of the engine as much as does it have pedals and can it be pedaled by a human if and when required.
All scooters are motorcycles but not all motorcycles are scooters.

Motorcyclists mostly know the answer. I don't really care much for the opinions of the non riding public when it comes to that.

And then there's also calling motorcycles -bikes - and yes, quite a few among riders call their own motorcycles - mopeds - as well.

According to most DMVs, yest they are.

I'm a lifelong motorcyclist and at this point I consider anything with two wheels and a motor to be a motorcycle.

Now the question is...do Vespa/Moped riders really WANT to be classified as motorcyclists? Some wear the MOD badge proudly

On the King Size side of the spectrum, there was the short-lived Craig Vetter Defiant kit, which utilized a complete Sportster chassis, including gas tank, from the steering stem back beneath the main body, and the the bike's entire fork assembly, brakes, and wheel at the front end.

It was not a twist-and-go machine however, it used the Sportster's clutched five speed.

If anything blurred the line between scooter and motorcycle, this surely did a good job of it. Outwardly, it's definitely a scooter that provided a visual disguise for a true motorcycle.

I always questioned the use of an 883 Sportster as the de facto donor machine for this kit when so many first generation Yamaha 1200 V-Max's were available.


Vetter Defiant

Vetter Defiant

Vetter Defiant

I also have mixed thoughts about it. IIRC, it was a frame kit and prolly prolly came with a few other doodads and you transferred parts from a donor Sportster. I don't really the cost but it wasn't outrages. I think they are not in biz any longer so you don't have any pressure to buy one to see how it ride. 🙂

Miguel

Love the design! That your Vetter Defiant? Miguel

It's cool, love the art-deco streamliner style!

A tricycle has one wheel in front, just like a real grownups motorcycle.

In the UK on registration document it is scooter.
Under taxation class it is bicycle.

It's all relative, and it's all about the frame.

Let me park one Vespa in between my two BMW GS motorcycles that could be ridden around the world. My Vespa isn't much of a motorcycle is it?

Let me park the other Vespa in between my Triumph Bonneville that invokes 50s and 60s retro motorcycle vibes, and my Kawasaki Z900RS that invokes 70s and 80s motorcycle nostalgia. My Vespa isn't much of a motorcycle, is it?

Now let me park it between a pair of ebikes that don't need government papers, insurance, or fuel to burn... framed like that, I guess it's a motorcycle.

Maybe you go out on a date with a girl who rides an ebike, you wanna tell her you ride a motorcycle, cause y'know, "according to the government" - oh la la!

Maybe your next date is with a really nice girl, like my friend Cat who rode her Kawasaki Vulcan 1700 Vaquero across Canada a few times, you both arrive with helmets in hand, she asks what do you ride? Are you really going to say a motorcycle?

It's a Vespa, or a scooter, and that's okay, just own it. Some will think it's cool, some won't, who cares?

I know folks who call their Harley Road Kings scoots.

I need a motorcycle licence to ride my Vespas because they are all over 50cc, but I tell people I ride a scooter or a Vespa.

No. I think that the one in my photos may be the only example ever built and is Vetter's original prototype.

I don't know if any of the kit versions were sold.

I did have a minor hand in the project, though, as Craig Vetter had me do some concept styling illustrations for various body versions of it.

I'll try to find some examples of them.

what would you call this?

it's an conversion kit from NMoto.com for a BMW C 400 X

I do find it a little interesting that I specified "gut reaction" to whether or not YOU think a Vespa is a motorcycle, and still got largely responses about what the law of the land considers it to be. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer here.

I really admired nmoto. They have sold out on all their BMW conversion bikes. They are working on other bikes base on a non BMW platform. IIRC, they will launch in 2024.

Miguel

Ok...my 'gut reaction' is that my Vespa GTS is
not a motorcycle in spite of the legal verbiage otherwise in most jurisdictions.

But then, this is coming from a mainly 'motorcycle guy' who happens to also like step-through, twist-and-go, machines that are drop-dead gorgeous to look at and damn fun to ride.

I don't think that I'll ever be without a Vespa, or a couple of motorcycles either.

In 1964 Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart, when asked for a definition of pornography, said "I know it when I see it." I think we all know a motorcycle when we see one.

You could also ask, "Is a Harley a scooter?" Except you never would.

You might in 1962 when they made this.

Boom! When you're right, you're right!

Blue is the fastest colour😉

Not a motorbike. Not a scooter. It's a Vespa.

Point taken, but Markus Meyer might like a word....

Mopeds have pedals. Everything else that I ride with two wheels I refer to as scoots. Any Vespa, 2T or 4T are classified on the title as MC.

Ok, my "gut", as well as muscle memory in my clutch hand and shifter foot, tells me that my Vespa is not the same as a motorcycle. But when I see a mixed group of "bikes" parked together I see motorcycles, scooters, and mopeds.

That really muddies the waters!

lol love it The exception that proves the rule.

Is this a bicycle?

I've always liked the appearance of the old Harley 'Topper' scooter, and would be very interested in one if Harley had the cajones to bring back a modernized version of it with 250-400cc's...oh, and didn't want $20,000 for one.

As long as we are talking about the good old days - I'd like one of these. I am willing to call it whatever you choose.

There are so many exceptions in this area that they...mmm...make a new rule? Anyway, these good folks here do call their Vespa a scooter, apparently ignorant of the limitations of one

Yes there are, this is the guy I'm currently following:

https://www.youtube.com/@Vespanda

But I don't see anyone on MV doing this kind of thing, whereas on the GS forums it's more just like "oh look, another middle aged white man riding around the world on my GS. Right, so anyway..."

Soooo, let's not get toooo carried away with trying to 'normalize' the popularity of the 'All Terrain Vespa' lol

"All terrain" isn't part of what defines a motorcycle. If you want to crack open that can of worms, check for the ADVrider thread about "what is an adventure bike?"
Spoiler alert: it got MESSY!

Quite the opposite, I'd say. It does seem 'normal' to go around the world with almost anything nowadays. If not Vespa brand in particular, scoots, mopeds, small street bikes, definitely.

Mayby exactly because there's not much novelty to do so with a GS?

This said, although especiallly the 'real GSs', big boxers are indeed munching plenty of miles collectively, a large majority of those seldom go off-road