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108 wrote:
Cylinder stud holes leaking through the transfers?

Trying to picture it.
Confirmed not to be coming up the stud holes but an actual casting flaw/pinhole/crack right smack in the middle of 2 cooling fins. If I remember correctly, you're right it was near the transfer. Emails were sent to Racing Planet and Polini with regards to warranty. Im thinking I'll clean it well and JBWeld that for the time being just to keep moving along as I doubt they'll make me send it back to Europe
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JB weld will work, not sure if it'll hold in that area though.

That's pretty unlucky on the cylinder, but great you managed to find it before starting the engine or riding.
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Why don't you check into casting impregnation and info on using sodium silicate (waterglass) and CO² to seal up your porosity, you can even set up a vacuum to suck it into the pores. This is a cheap easy old foundryman's trick and I think should work well here.

Here's a start:
http://what-when-how.com/materialsparts-and-finishes/impregnating-materials-for-castings/

Random thought : If you set up a vacuum system just right, maybe even high temperature header paint would do the job...
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Small update. JB welded that transfer port up and leak checked and it still had a slight drop off, some Hondabond on the copper gasket made work of that but then I found ANOTHER leak on the opposite transfer port. Absolutely ridiculous for a Polini kit. Racingplanet has since refunded me the bore and I'll buy another as a spare perhaps but sort of lost faith in the brand. I JBwelded that one up too and she held 6psi for over an hour with maybe 0.5psi of a drop off. Safe to say shes sealed for now but ill check again after run in and heat cycles to verify its still sealed. Installed the Parmakit ignition and got some killer final assembly shots. My ET3/Primavera cylinder shroud has arrived from ScooterMercato and hopefully engine in this week!

https://youtube.com/shorts/bYBFtMJatsM?feature=share

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Sheesh. Lot of problems to get a running engine. But it looks great, and hopefully it runs great for a long time!
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Welp it was a monumental day folks. It wasnt without its battles. Installed the Fast Flow SIP fuel tap as I plan on running their gauge soon and had this brutal leak at the fuel filter. I couldn't for the life of me tighten it down enough until I realized there was a small casting flaw on the banjo type fitting at the carb that wasnt sitting flush against the filter. I thought I missed a gasket but a quick lapping against some sandpaper did the trick. I threw the largest jet I had which was an 88 and set the idle air screw to 2 turns out.

She fired up in 3 kicks! She sounds great and the kickstarter issue is definitely resolved with a tonne of compression. No one told me how hard it was to do all the cabling adjustments in the rear, my god. Still needs some shifter cable adjusting since my 1st gear is a bit out of alignment on the hash marks. The clutch I set with too much free play at first but after I used the SIP cable tool, was easily able to reduce the play and get a solid pull. The Polini wave spring is considerably heavier than stock but I can tell the grab is immense. This is probably as stiff as I'd wanna go personally before spending the big dollars on upgraded stuff.


She currently has no lights since I went 12v and am waiting for some bulbs. I went with a generic BGM conversion harness from ScooterMercato so that'll go in sometime soon. I'll work on getting at least the lights up for this weekend but may take her on the road this weekend during the day.

Helps to be able to stand and peer under the skirt to do the cable adjustments

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Treated myself from SM when I needed to order the 130cc shroud. Couldn't just order $20 worth of goods without getting something nice for her.

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Rad.
Sounds good. Looks Good!
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The merc silver looks so great…

So awesome it's fired up!

Yeah cable adjustments general suck on a smallframe. Lol

Spend a lot of time lying on the floor to take the stress out.
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108 wrote:
Yeah cable adjustments general suck on a smallframe. Lol
When I had my smallie I believed pretty much everything besides riding it sucked! ROFL emoticon

Good ya and very nice machine!
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Bike looks and sounds great!

I do all my initial cable adjustments by pulling the tank and carb, then laying the bike over on a blanket on its side. I'm working on the floor, but I think I'd do it like that with a stand, too.

I think you'd have had a first kick start with a little bit of goosing the throttle, but regardless, you're going to be ripping around the Great White North in no time.
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Got some decent runs on her and wow shes a thirsty girl. Before a ride I checked my tank and it was maybe 1cm above the fuel tap. 5 mins in and it burbled and died. Flicked to reserve and was like I should make it to work. 8km later it did the same thing and it was bone dry, luckily was right outside of a gas station. Hopefully downjetting will solve some issues. Jetted initially at an 88 but had some 4 stroking on the mid to 3/4 throttle. Top end wasnt popping but it was lower on power than I'd have liked. Ended up at an 84 and it's quite crispy now with very little 4 stroking on the low end. I think for an SHBC19 carb this is as best as it's going to get to.

Clutch is a weird one, the 4 plate Surflex and Polini Wave spring is quite stiff. More stiff than I'd like. If I adjust it with 2mm of freeplay, it drags and when I drop it into 1st, it dies. If I adjust it so it doesnt die when I drop it into first it has zero freeplay. Im hoping im not roasting my plunger or welding it to the pressure plate but I've put 150kms on it so far with no issues as of yet. Do I go Egig 1 finger clutch w/ the SIP cover?

Lastly, the top end performance for me just isn't there. I know I went with a more touring set up but compared to my other scoots, I dont know why im not satisfied with the up top power. Im not sure if thats a squish band/conservative compression ratio issue or what. Last thing I wanna do is split the engine/redo the top end right now so i was thinking of going with a CP23/24 carb and a more expansion-y type of pipe. Was in talks with Erich at Egig and he mentioned if I stay with rotary induction that I should be fine with a Python S. I havent seen many people stateside run this pipe so I'm curious. Also wondering if that carb will be sufficient. I'm one click away from an SIP order so fill my boots with suggestions friends.

PS: that red seat ruins my inner thighs with its stiff sidewalls and crazy vibration holy lol. It'll be up for sale soon, thinking of going with a Nisa sport seat.

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If you're not running a PK style clutch cover with the pinion gear, then get a Crimaz cover post haste. It'll make a huge difference.

I tried the egig one finger and had terrible slipping issues. Finally went to a Fabbri racing clutch and love it, but I'm putting out more power than you are, so YMMV.

The fuel consumption seems excessive. I'm running a **182** main and even I don't have that many fuel consumption issues.

Regardless, that bike is freaking gorgeous and it makes me happy just knowing your're putting miles on it.
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Yeah the carb will be holding you back.

Something bigger will definitely help out.

The 19 manifold is tiny too, most likely need to change that.

With the clutch, I never got 2mm of free play at the handlebar lever, ever, to get good clutch disengagement.

It's definitely not like a normal motorcycle.

I've taken the clutch cover off several times to check and everything seems to be in top condition still, so not worried.

The crimaz cover will definitely help because of the throw at the cover when you pull the lever, learned that the hard way.

Oh and most likely you need to modify either the cover of your brake plate.

I ended up grinding both. Easier to just grind the brake plate, but I didn't want to go so thin on the posts where the brake pads attach. Not that it makes a difference in the end.

The one finger clutch is great, it's perfect because of the balance of the springs and the number of friction plates. Not sure if you need to change the basket to accommodate the height of the plates. That means splitting the cases.

For your kit, there's a lot of exhaust options… too many actually!

VMC have a host of sexy ones aimed at 130cc.
Something more exotic?
Something more exotic?
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Thanks 108 for the suggestions, I gotta see your scoot the next time I'm in HK visiting family.

Small update, encountered my first ever soft seize. Serves me right for not having a CHT gauge and tuning by sound haha. Was going a solid 80kmh+ up a mild bridge and when I was coming down the bridge it had a small hiccup and instant lock up. Skidded a bit and then clutched it to save it. Pulled off to a little breakdown dug out area and threw it in N and prayed as I gently kicked it over. Luckily for me it rolled over easily and I nursed it home being kinda worried. It sounds the same and had no other issues going home but I'll definitely be upping the jet 1 size tomorrow to an 86 from an 84. I originally had an 88 in it during first start and it definitely 4 stroked way more so maybe 86 is the ticket. Put a tiny shredded up flat spot on my new Michelin S83s Crying or Very sad emoticon . Im going to boroscope thru the spark plug hole tomorrow at work and see if theres any major damage but whats the play here, just upjet a bit and keep sending it? With a soft seize is it typical to run it and out of sight out of mind or do y'all hone it out and check ring gaps all over. The fact it cooled down within 15-20 seconds enough to kick over has me somewhat relieved but theres no doubt that SOME damage was done.

Last week I put quite an order through a Canadian distributor who has a Racing Planet account (shout out to Scootertuning!).

Egig Python S (You can thank me for getting RP to add that to their catalog
Polini CP 24mm EVO carb & filter
Polini intake mani

Then I made a custom order from SIP via ScooterMercato
Nisa seat
SIP digital speedo sensor wire
Crimaz anti dive kit

First leak I've noticed is that my OG clutch cover panel is leaking a drop every few days out of the actuating lever so I think thats toast. Going to get my hands on that new FLT clutch cover or the Crimaz one and go with the PK style clutch. These 4 plate standard style clutches are a pain and I can see why everyone complains. Depending on the time of day itll grab and I can feel the warping/uneven disengagement and then sometimes in traffic itll clear up. This was with a brand new basket and everything so it's clearly not separating properly.


A photo or two to keep the journal alive.

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Took a 20 min ferry ride to Bowen Island which is a tiny island between Vancouver and Vancouver Island.

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Was accompanied with some friends who rode my 70cc Prebug BWS/Zuma and a stock pearl white ET2.

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Bummer on the seize. Glad you were able to get it home. Bike still looks amazing.

I'd say check for good fuel flow and possibly an air leak on the carb manifold by spraying it with carb cleaner while running.

Given that the 88 main was too much (define "too much" here, btw. Like "not rev out cleanly riding in 2nd" too much or "less rev-y than an 86 on the stand" too much?), two jets above "soft seize" seems like still "not enough" to me unless there's an external factor like a leak.

I've soft seized worse than that, to the point I was pushing home, but was able to get back on the road after I cleaned up the piston, cylinder, and rings. Still, count yourself lucky.

The one-finger clutch is also good. I have one on the shelf because it wasn't strong enough for the Smallstate. It needs plates, but if you wanna deal, PM me--it's not doing any good sitting on my shelf.

The Crimaz/PK clutch cover with the pinion plunger was a real game changer for me. I'd put that at the top of my list, especially if you do much riding in traffic.
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Hit me up anytime you're in HK! Would be fun to link up and exchange notes. Come see the egig 170 and the other 3 smallies I know in existence here.

Damn… sucks on the seize, glad rider is ok and it's great you weren't stranded.

I took a pair of SHBC carbs apart from the intakes from a PK haul when I was back in the UK.

Can't say the pair of spring clips and felt washer filled me with confidence when seeing it. Interesting design for the era, but not sure how it's suppose to be airtight.

The iron cylinder will be more forgiving. Hopefully the scope will shed some light on if it's scored the cylinder walls.

But if possible, I'd leak test again to check if anything has popped.
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Time for the winter time upgrades and tear downs. I most definitely have an air leak that's reared its ugly head. When it's cold it's okay and as soon as it warms up the idle starts creeping up and I can't tame it. Most definitely need to pressure test again. I'm wondering if the JB weld let go or the pesky flywheel crank seal is the culprit. Anyways I'm gonna yank the motor to install these goodies. Chandlerman to the rescue. Picked up a nice used egig clutch and I'm about to order a Crimaz clutch cover off SIP soon. That should hopefully solve my clutch drag issues. He also shipped me a Honda Dio crank so I didn't have to import two boxes from the states . Scootertuning in QC made a custom order off Racing Planet for the CP24 Evo carb for a Vespa and I ordered the Polini 2 bolt intake mani so that'll go hand in hand.

And the piece de resistance. An egig Python S . Don't hear too much about this pipe but it looks gorgeous. Erich said for my moderate build it should be adequate since I'm still on rotary. I think the carb and this combo with a nice one finger clutch will be a good starting point for next spring.

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So nice..!

I'm installing a python on the Parmakit.

But still haven't finished off the engine build… it's almost been a year 😭.

The One finger clutch is great!
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I was glad to see the One Finger Clutch find a good home since it wasn't up to my needs. It really is a nice piece of kit and deserved better than sitting on my shelves.

Air leaks seem to constantly bedevil smallies. I don't know if I've been lucky, or if ditching the stock intake manifold for a plain rubber boot has kept me safe on that account. I know that SoCal has consistently struggled with his, too.

You'll get the air leak under control. A bike that sweet deserves to be ridden, not fussed over.
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Christmas came early this year. It's shocking how fast you can punch past your budget on winter parts. The Canadian dollar has slumped against the Euro and USD which made it hurt even more.

Any tips on removing the headset and rewiring the whole thing? I have a BGM 12v conversion harness along with some FA Italia/SIP cables to throw into this thing. I didnt buy the tool for the collar but figured a chisel and hammer would do for now.

Has anyone used this janky Polini airbox before? I bought another smaller foam pod filter that I think I'll throw on the CP24 instead.

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Gets expensive quick…!

I rewired my 50s with an SIP harness, I didn't take the headset/handlebars off completely, just dangled against a towel on the front.

Fork was never loosened or removed.

I always start at the fuel tank, feed the wiring through the tunnel, with the rear/foot brake removed from the frame you can see the wiring pass, then with the horn off, you can pass it towards the handlebars. Didn't use any tools besides just pushing it through and grabbing everything with pliers. I found thin wires taped to the end never worked for me.

I think the Polini will be better than the foam pod.

Past experience is that jetting is a bitch especially when the foam gets soaked in fuel. Which then you end up cleaning it every 2-3weeks. But does look kinda cool, not that anyone can see it… lol
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Winter time rebuilds. Tore the motor out and pressure checked right away. Somehow held 6psi with no issues so the JB Weld is definitely holding up. It would appear my hunting idle may be from the 19.19 carb and intake mani connection like CM and SoCal, you're absolutely right. Where else could it be from? The gauge dropped maybe like half a PSI over a few mins so I consider that within spec…

Next I tore off the cylinder and inspected the bore. Seems pretty good considering the soft seize. The lines appear to be where the ring gaps coincide?

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Next tackled the clutch. Surprising to me, the woodruff key was slightly sheared which was concerning. The ears on the clutch plate ears also showed some signs of hammering which makes sense since I had the dragging clutch issue and it made going into 1st a bit "thunky".

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A part of me wanted the cylinder to be in poor shape and leaky so I could splurge on a VMC CP58… but the responsible and frugal portion of me says run it another summer session. I also don't like the fact that out of the box the squish wasn't ideal. The other rational portion of me says to just do it since the motors pulled and I'm already in there.

Going to install the Egig clutch tomorrow along with the Crimaz cover. (chandlerman should I take out some springs or leave it as is?) I think I have some spare woodruff keys hanging around. Wonder if I can get by reusing the same flat tab washer and just bend it in a different spot.
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Looks like the clutch wasn't torqued down enough and ended up shifting around. Should be aiming for mid 60nm for that m10 nut because of the extra power generated.

The key does look a little short too, but the taper is actually doing most of the heavy lifting. So good tight mating surfaces is important, worth using valve grinding compound on the parts.

Try to track down a domed washer for the egig clutch… you'll be aiming for 70-75nm for the egig clutch on stock m10 secondary gear stack add red loctite for the nut. Don't use the tabbed washer.

The CP58 would've been a fun experiment, but not sure about the cooling on that kit.
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As you're saying, bore damage looks like it will run for a long time yet. Ring gaps should be on the boost port side.
Piston crown colour is only a bit lean, could have been just lean at high rpm. The 19.19 isn't much good for jetting in well on higher rpm. The new carb will do a much better job.

If running the old cylinder again, I would skim the head as far as it will go (belt sander), then if enough came off the head, lift the base gasket to set the squish to 1.0mm.
If the base gasket ends up at 1.0mm, it will actually notice when riding it.
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Catching up here, I'd leave all the springs in the clutch if you haven't already installed it unless your output is under 20HP. The egig is only good into the mid-20's HP-wise, but with the XL2 clutch cover, I found it was so soft I wouldn't remove springs in any case.

And, like Jack, my first thought seeing the piston crown was "lean," but if that's with the old carb & manifold, I wouldn't lose sleep over it (yet).
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Am I going nuts here? I can't get the clutch back into the outer basket. The video online shows Erich torquing down the inner basket first with the special holder and building the clutch around it after he uses a special compressor tool. But does the original way of installing the compressed clutch pack no longer work?

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Jordanaitor wrote:
Am I going nuts here? I can't get the clutch back into the outer basket. The video online shows Erich torquing down the inner basket first with the special holder and building the clutch around it after he uses a special compressor tool. But does the original way of installing the compressed clutch pack no longer work?
Doesn't work, you have to assemble in the crankcase…

All the bigger fabbri style clutches need to be assembled in the engine.

You need the clutch puller tool with a longer bolt and a large socket (something like a 35mm) to compress the springs as you put the plates in.

I ended up buying the fabbri tool, because I can see myself using it a lot in the future.

Do you have the clutch basket tool? It'll be hard to reach the right torques without it… a screwdriver will find it tough to stop it spinning.
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Just found MJRallys post with the same issue and having the build it inside the cases. Welp time for another tool purchase. Do I also need to split the cases and shim the tree and kickstart quadrant as well when using this clutch? Or is it really a 50/50 on whether or not thats required?
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Jordanaitor wrote:
Just found MJRallys post with the same issue and having the build it inside the cases. Welp time for another tool purchase. Do I also need to split the cases and shim the tree and kickstart quadrant as well when using this clutch? Or is it really a 50/50 on whether or not thats required?
Could be a huge chance you'll need to shim the tree and lift it towards the clutch. But depends on the primary basket. Could be a chance you won't need to.

You can try install the clutch spider first and see before splitting the cases.

70nm will make the spider ride up the tree so there could be a chance it hits.

The Parmakit engine I was working on didn't hit at stock torque of 55nm. But 70nm made it foul… I ended up grinding the primary basket instead of splitting the cases.
Yeah you can combine the clutch compressor and a big socket
Yeah you can combine the clutch compressor and a big socket
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Thank you so much for that image. Makes total sense now. I had no clue how people were combining a 32mm socket and the clutch compressor to make a "pusher". I'll torque the basket down once my clutch basket holder comes in and see if it conflicts. I just watched Erich's video in English now and it makes more sense. I'm assuming if I'm too lazy to split and grind it like you it's the Cush drive spring indentations that conflict? Nothing a grinder can't solve.

Sounds like an SIP order is in the world again. I might buy some Polini base gasket spacers and play around with opening up these transfer durations and get this squish down too.

Going to order the Crimaz crank/clutch nut combo to hold this extra torque as well. Anything else engine wise I could get while I'm in there?
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Probably the crimaz nut combo/domed washer is most important besides the holding tool.

I didn't think your piston top was that bad. Personally I'd keep with the 1.25mm squish. But I'd make sure the timing was correct… yours is a variable ignition which makes it 23-24 btdc (can't remember what you had it at, if you mentioned before).

The exhaust might thank you for raising the transfer and exhaust ports, but I wouldn't sweat it.

Might be a good time to buy gasket set and shims just in case. Unless waiting is your thing… lol

Ps. Forgot to mention, you probably want to coat your exhaust with high temp coating before you assemble. Haven't tried this myself (I clear coated the whole exhaust), but in retrospect, I would coat the end that attaches to the cylinder in black high temp paint (it's easier to touch up if needed) and it will definitely get scratched by the wheel flinging stones and dust at it. And clear coat the rest. The one I used isn't bad, but it takes about 20 heat cycles before it hardens properly, by that time, the coating has a bunch of stones and dust stuck on. And rust patches had formed.

But glad I did it, kept the steel patina I wanted.
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Jordanaitor wrote:
Just found MJRallys post with the same issue and having the build it inside the cases. Welp time for another tool purchase. Do I also need to split the cases and shim the tree and kickstart quadrant as well when using this clutch? Or is it really a 50/50 on whether or not thats required?
I didn't have to shim the tree to make it all work with that clutch in my OG smallstate cases. Installation was such a nightmare to deal with that I finally just ground back the inside of the case a little bit over the clutch to fit it in. A couple millimeters was all it took. Then it was finicky, but quite do-able with the clutch assembled.
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Cerakote'd the exhaust header and fan cover. This stuff is extremely durable and goes on thin. I'm thoroughly impressed with its finish. Plus it'll take temps up to 1800f.

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

VHT ultra high temp clear on the Python. It's a satin finish that really shows once it's cured. I baked it in stages as high as it would go with a heat gun.

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External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

Now the fun stuff I guess. I figured while I'm in there it's time to play around. I removed the piston and she definitely has some wear marks. I'll wet sand those out and send it again. Polini waranteed the whole kit anyways due to the air leaks so I may as well experiment with it. My local shop once again came in with the save and made an SIP order for me. Ordered the stronger Crimaz nuts for the primary and clutch, and 1,2 and 3mm cylinder spacers. I'm settling on the 2mm for now which seems to be what SIP and the et3.it forums suggest. The 2mm spacer plus the aramid fiber gasket measures out to be around 2.3mm in total. Since I had about a 1.8mm total squish with the 0.5mm copper gasket, I'm going to ask the machine shop to deck off 2.5mm off the cylinder. Should net me around 1.3-1.5 total squish. And if push comes to shove I can forgo the copper cylinder gasket and make it a bit more potent.

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DIY timing wheel to get my base numbers for the transfers, exhaust, and blow down.
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Exciting times!

Exhaust looks great, that's exactly what I would've done with take 2.

Wonder how durable the cerakote is, the rear wheel dust and stones are aggressive… most of my heat temp clearcoat has come off on the header pipe section.

Interested in what timing you end at with the spacer and decking.

This should go like a rocket! If the exhaust port is anywhere near 185deg
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Port timings measured by a degree wheel are extremely difficult to do accurately. Very easy to be 5 degrees out, even with the greatest of care.
If the cylinder ports are measured from deck and PBT as well, run the calculations and compare.

Do you know the suggested port durations from the exhaust manufacturer?
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Numbers are 120-125 / 170-178 for the Python S.

But below is a dyno of 125/185 from Egig himself. (Red and black line)
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That thing's going to be a neck snapper with the barrel lifted 2mm.
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Every machine shop turned me down today saying that 100thou or 2.5mm was too much to take off the top of the jug and that it would compromise the first heat sink fin.

I managed to get an appointment with a local 2 stroke snowmobile/motorcycle repair shop that said it was no issue so we'll see how that goes.

Has anyone run the FRT floating clutch bracket yet? I wish SIP would carry this but its been nearly 6 months now with no dice. All the shops in Italy wont ship to North America. Might have to order from Adie at Greenlight in the UK and bring it home.

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Jordanaitor wrote:
Has anyone run the FRT floating clutch bracket yet? I wish SIP would carry this but its been nearly 6 months now with no dice. All the shops in Italy wont ship to North America. Might have to order from Adie at Greenlight in the UK and bring it home.

Nah, not yet, wanted to order one, probably from 10pollici but I don't think it'll bring huge benefits, just be a nice to have.

Adie is a top guy, I brought the PK I have from him.

If the machine shop is good, you can take material from the bottom of the cylinder.
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Jordanaitor wrote:
Every machine shop turned me down today saying that 100thou or 2.5mm was too much to take off the top of the jug and that it would compromise the first heat sink fin.

I managed to get an appointment with a local 2 stroke snowmobile/motorcycle repair shop that said it was no issue so we'll see how that goes.

What port timing are you aiming for by taking 2.5mm off the top?
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