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LarryMK wrote:
so way too many posts on this. I do not like gin or vermouth. I prefer a vodka martini, the same as James Bond, I do not like vermouth so it is basically chilled vodka in a martini glass with some olives, ...
I too enjoy a vodka martini with a few olives. One of the things that I never understood about my late beloved father was his enjoyment of gin and dry vermouth.
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rgk wrote:
I too enjoy a vodka martini with a few olives. One of the things that I never understood about my late beloved father was his enjoyment of gin and dry vermouth.
good olives are key. I like pimento olives, blue cheese olives and now we have a couple of restaurants near us that serve goat cheese olives that are really good.
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LarryMK wrote:
I guess it is not technically a martini as no vermouth, I used to drink a classic vodka martini but decided I dont like the taste of vermouth. Also not a big gin drinker.
rgk wrote:
I too enjoy a vodka martini with a few olives. One of the things that I never understood about my late beloved father was his enjoyment of gin and dry vermouth.
I'm definitely not saying everyone should like gin and/or vermouth. But if you like neither of these, then you're just not drinking a martini.
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jess wrote:
I'm definitely not saying everyone should like gin and/or vermouth. But if you like neither of these, then you're just not drinking a martini.
I guess according to Webster a true martini is gin and dry vermouth, but they also have a definition for vodka martini, at least on the internet
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LarryMK wrote:
I guess according to Webster a true martini is gin and dry vermouth, but they also have a definition for vodka martini, at least on the internet
Which, at least, contains vermouth (though I still object to calling this a martini).
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For the record, I also object to calling chilled gin (with no vermouth) a martini.
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jess wrote:
For the record, I also object to calling chilled gin (with no vermouth) a martini.
you are a purist
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LarryMK wrote:
you are a purist
Sort of. I also like a dirty martini once in a while, and a true purist I'm sure would object to that.
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jess wrote:
Sort of. I also like a dirty martini once in a while, and a true purist I'm sure would object to that.
my wife does like the dirty also but just dirty, vodka, and olives so not a martini, but still tasty. A bit too salty for me though.
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Olives are OK in a martini but I prefer a lemon twist, especially in a gin martini.
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bluside wrote:
Olives are OK in a martini but I prefer a lemon twist, especially in a gin martini.
I'll accept that. Not my personal preference, but it's a legitimate variation on the martini.
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Calling a drink without gin and vermouth a martini is like calling a bottle of wine a beer. You kind of can do that for yourself I guess, but in conversation it gets weird.
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bluside wrote:
Olives are OK in a martini but I prefer a lemon twist, especially in a gin martini.
For most gins I prefer an olive. But for some reason, Tanqueray tastes better to me with a lemon twist. Maybe it has more citrus notes? IDK.
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mpfrank wrote:
For most gins I prefer an olive. But for some reason, Tanqueray tastes better to me with a lemon twist. Maybe it has more citrus notes? IDK.
My favorite gin (Monkey 47) has quite a bit of floral and citrus notes already in it, so I'm not sure a lemon twist would offer much.

On a recent trip to Porto, my wife and I (and DougL) visited Scoundrel's Distilling, specifically the "gin school" seminar. We got a chance to make our own gin from their wide assortment of on-hand botanicals, and I made a predominantly citrus-based gin (with some, but not a ton, of juniper as well).

It was a blast.
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jess wrote:
My favorite gin (Monkey 47) has quite a bit of floral and citrus notes already in it, so I'm not sure a lemon twist would offer much.

On a recent trip to Porto, my wife and I (and DougL) visited Scoundrel's Distilling, specifically the "gin school" seminar. We got a chance to make our own gin from their wide assortment of on-hand botanicals, and I made a predominantly citrus-based gin (with some, but not a ton, of juniper as well).

It was a blast.
My favorite commercial gin is Bombay (not Bombay Sapphire, though I do like it, too).

I also infuse my own gin. I find that I don't like the floral notes as much, or too much citrus. Here is the label with the ingredients:
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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Ok, I am tired of all this dithering around. Here is how it's done.

- Fill a liter-sized jar or shaker with small cubes of ice. Bigger jar for 4 or more.
- 100ml Bombay gin per martini
- 20ml good dry vermouth (5:1 ratio) per martini. I like Noilly Pratt but I am not religious about it.
- Stir it (don't shake it, Bond was an idiot) 30 times, not too quickly. I prefer a wooden chopstick.
- Strain it (your choice of method) into martini glasses, garnish as appropriate (I like a twist, mrs Jimjar likes 2 olives)
- enjoy

You will never hear a complaint. Also I have never had a bartender around the world disagree.
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jess wrote:
For the record, I also object to calling chilled gin (with no vermouth) a martini.
well, duh. that's because it's colloquially known as a wake up call. it's also traditionally served neat in a high ball glass, to the rim, with no garnish.

look, I don't make the rules. you gotta talk to finger tight jimmy about that.

also, this may be a regional thing.
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jess wrote:
I'll accept that. Not my personal preference, but it's a legitimate variation on the martini.
Considering I don't really like olives unless in certain food dishes the only way I'd drink a martini is with a twist but it has to be a good London Dry Gin. I prefer a good botanical gin for a G&T. Canard's Queen Victoria makes an excellent G&T.
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I will accept all that has been said about what a "real"martini is. But I have found that when I am in a restaurant if I want my drink to be the way I like it, I have to order, "a Vodka martini, no vermouth, with whatever olive I would like". Then I usually get what I want, although with service the way it is nowadays, it is amazing how often they screw up that simple order.
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LarryMK wrote:
But I have found that when I am in a restaurant if I want my drink to be the way I like it, I have to order, "a Vodka martini, no vermouth, with whatever olive I would like".
I would like to be able to order a martini and not have to be asked "Vodka or gin?" for the millionth time. This is actually the primary reason for my objection to the misuse of the term "martini".

Realistically, if someone asks for a martini (without any other descriptors attached), the chances that they want a GIN martini are nearly 100%. Still, you just know there's some guy out there that orders a martini (with no descriptors) and is then pissed when it arrives and is full of gin.

(Fuck that guy).

Choosing a different name for chilled vodka would go a long way toward eliminating this ambiguity. In fact, there is already a term for a "vodka martini": it's called a kangaroo. Sadly, this term is not widely recognized.

Sigh.
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Kangaroo

Cocktail Party app
https://cocktailpartyapp.com › drinks › kangaroo
what is a kangaroo drink from cocktailpartyapp.com
Ingredients · 2¼ parts Vodka · ¾ part Dry vermouth · 2 dashes Orange bitters or Lemon bitters · 1 piece Lemon peel or Orange .

So while a great name not exactly what I drink
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LarryMK wrote:
Kangaroo

Cocktail Party app
https://cocktailpartyapp.com › drinks › kangaroo
what is a kangaroo drink from cocktailpartyapp.com
Ingredients · 2¼ parts Vodka · ¾ part Dry vermouth · 2 dashes Orange bitters or Lemon bitters · 1 piece Lemon peel or Orange .

So while a great name not exactly what I drink
aka Vodkatini
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jess wrote:
I would like to be able to order a martini and not have to be asked "Vodka or gin?" for the millionth time. This is actually the primary reason for my objection to the misuse of the term "martini".

Realistically, if someone asks for a martini (without any other descriptors attached), the chances that they want a GIN martini are nearly 100%. Still, you just know there's some guy out there that orders a martini (with no descriptors) and is then pissed when it arrives and is full of gin.

(Fuck that guy).
THIS...This I can understand and get behind.
I'm one of those evil, chaotic people who order a Whiskey Sour and ask them to use scotch instead of whiskey just to watch the world burn. 😉
HOWEVER: I fully expect the bartender's scornful side-eye. If I forget to ask or they forget (or refuse) to use scotch instead of Irish whiskey, I don't mind...as long as a specific brand/quality wasn't discussed and as long as they didn't use american so-called "whiskey."

I fully embrace the bastardization of my drink order. No need to inflict that on unsuspecting people.


On a less-serious note...I think a certain scooterist would take issue with y'all's choice of gin.
...But does Deadpool drink Aviator martinis?
...But does Deadpool drink Aviator martinis?
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LarryMK wrote:
So while a great name not exactly what I drink
No, but it is functionally identical to the "vodka martini" you are using as a starting point.

What you actually want is vodka, up. I think most bartenders would understand that specification.
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jess wrote:
No, but it is functionally identical to the "vodka martini" you are using as a starting point.

What you actually want is vodka, up. I think most bartenders would understand that specification.
That is true but I like it in a chilled martini glass, stays colder, and also makes me look "cooler and more sophisticated". Also in many restaurants halfway thru the drink the bring you a new chilled martini glass to keep your drink nice and cold.
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I think what you're looking for is traditionally known as a "Larry".
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LarryMK wrote:
That is true but I like it in a chilled martini glass, stays colder, and also makes me look "cooler and more sophisticated". Also in many restaurants halfway thru the drink the bring you a new chilled martini glass to keep your drink nice and cold.
In my 50 or so years of drinking cocktails I've never had that happen.

I have had martinis served with a sidecar placed in a bowl of ice to keep it cold.

(This one is from Musso and Frank's Grill in Hollywood.)
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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mpfrank wrote:
In my 50 or so years of drinking cocktails I've never had that happen.

I have had martinis served with a sidecar placed in a bowl of ice to keep it cold.

(This one is from Musso and Frank's Grill in Hollywood.)
i have also had a sidecar delivered and it was also at Musso and Frank's and also a couple of steakhouses in Scottsdale. A few places leave the martini shaker with the ice and some more vodka. But also a few places will deliver a new chilled glass. All are nice touches.
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Quote:
Also in many restaurants halfway thru the drink the bring you a new chilled martini glass to keep your drink nice and cold.
I have had a lot of martinis but I have never had this happen. Nor do I want it to….by the time the waiter gets around to this I want him to bring me my second!
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Jimjar wrote:
I have had a lot of martinis but I have never had this happen. Nor do I want it to….by the time the waiter gets around to this I want him to bring me my second!
I only have one but I can see your point
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All this martini talk is making me thirsty. And it's Friday evening.

Nothing fancy here, just Bombay Sapphire with the residue of Gallo Extra Dry Vermouth left on the ice cubes. Shaken, because I like the gin to be bruised.

Served in a relatively vintage-sized 4oz martini glass.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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Isn't anything you put in one of those triangulary martini glasses by definition a martini?

Just like you know, if I put a hunk of chicken in a hamburger bun it's a hamburger.
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jess wrote:
All this martini talk is making me thirsty. And it's Friday evening.

Nothing fancy here, just Bombay Sapphire with the residue of Gallo Extra Dry Vermouth left on the ice cubes. Shaken, because I like the gin to be bruised.

Served in a relatively vintage-sized 4oz martini glass.
looks nice enjoy!!
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znomit wrote:
Isn't anything you put in one of those triangulary martini glasses by definition a martini?

Just like you know, if I put a hunk of chicken in a hamburger bun it's a hamburger.
znomit, one day you will go too far!
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znomit, one day you will go too far!
...But that's how you practice u-turns in limited space!
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