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Anyone have any comments or suggestions when splitting the cases without dropping the engine.

I have seen it done in pics but never done it myself.

Would love any tips or tricks from folks that have been-there/done-that.

(This is on our friend Armando's purple P125.)
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Don't forget to remove the two outboard cylinder studs & loosen the other two to raise the cylinder slightly if you don't need to pull it off anyway.

I've done it once and was easy, I don't recall any special tricks other than the usual jiggling the kickstart. On some bikes if the main pivot bolt is installed from the 'back' side it helps remove the cylinder if you remove the nut, slide pivot bolt back a bit so you can tilt the motor out a bit.
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V oodoo wrote:
On some bikes if the main pivot bolt is installed from the 'back' side it helps remove the cylinder if you remove the nut, slide pivot bolt back a bit so you can tilt the motor out a bit.
TY. Noted!
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I was bummed I forgot to install my main pivot bolt this way on the PX last time, it's a handy thing to have it flipped this way.
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Not always needed, but I've also removed the airbox/carb, exhaust, tire and rear shock bolt so the motor can really hinge back.

That allowed me extra room for the clutch/castle nut
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Yep, ^^^ that's gonna help. And if you really want easy and don't need to get at the clutch, then just lay that thing over onto a couple of fat pillows. Just put a baggie under the gas cap to avoid leaks out the vent, but now you may not even need to drain the oil!

What is it that you gotta fix?
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MJRally wrote:
Not always needed, but I've also removed the airbox/carb, exhaust, tire and rear shock bolt so the motor can really hinge back.

That allowed me extra room for the clutch/castle nut
This is how I pull the cylinder, then tilt it back down to split the cases. I don't mind the extra work to avoid removing cylinder studs, because I've had too many issues with them coming loose over the years.
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pull the exhaust, chock the front wheel and get it blocked up in the middle.

yank off the carb and carb box so it doesn't catch on the lip of the body. bring the body up, pull off the rear mudguard, spare and then yank the tire. roll around to the other side and and pull the shock bolt and it'll drop down. from here you can remove the shock if you feel like it.

I like to pull the swing arm bolt and tilt the engine to pull the barrel, but removing the studs is fine too.

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
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greasy125 wrote:
pull the exhaust, chock the front wheel and get it blocked up in the middle.

yank off the carb and carb box so it doesn't catch on the lip of the body. bring the body up, pull off the rear mudguard, spare and then yank the tire. roll around to the other side and and pull the shock bolt and it'll drop down. from here you can remove the shock if you feel like it.

I like to pull the swing arm bolt and tilt the engine to pull the barrel, but removing the studs is fine too.
I was about to post pretty much the same
On a P125 he MIGHT be able to get away with only removing the carb cover, or maybe that and the float bowl cover(?).

And crack the wheel nut while it's on the floor first
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Ray8 wrote:
I was about to post pretty much the same
On a P125 he MIGHT be able to get away with only removing the carb cover, or maybe that and the float bowl cover(?).
depends on how good (or bad) the motor mounts are! he he he
Quote:
And crack the wheel nut while it's on the floor first
that's what air tools are for!
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Here is the perfect example !
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Lots of good stuff thanks all!
vooodooooooo wrote:
What is it that you gotta fix?
Splitting the Purple Nurple (P125 that we bought for a Armando) to sort the kick start cog (was either forgotten or was put on backwards?). The bike was a fresh rebuild and paint that never got back on the road. So, we will also give a hairy eyeball to everything else once we split it.

Also, thought was to pressure test the engine in frame first and then smoke test if leaky. If the clutch-side is suspect we will just drop the whole shebang. If pressure test is good then we will take apart in frame.

Again thanks folks.
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for me, if the engine is dirty i will remove the whole thing from the frame and pressure wash the heck out of it until it's squeaky clean. Then i'll immediately disassemble it. If the cases are pretty darn clean already, i usually leave the engine in the frame. I'll also leave the airbox in place, but i will disconnect the rear shock, fuel hose, oil line, and selector box (the stator just gets dangled out of the way). Then i'll slip off the head, unscrew the 4 cylinder head studs, then pop the cylinder out. The 200 cylinder and head are a bit larger diameter than the 150, so there isn't as much room to work with. It's been a while since i've opened up my T5 engine, but from what i remember, you could remove both the cylinder and head without even pivoting down the back of the engine.
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Wait.
Just the kickstart cog. Fresh rebuild. Leak tests(?)...

Do the no drop at all method Voodoo suggested.
Don't forget to drain the oil Facepalm emoticon
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Yes it was bought after sitting for a few years PO was a known scooterist who did a "complete rebuild" when it was painted. Hence the thought of doing a quick looksie/fix with the engine in frame.

Will report what we find. Vespa surgery scheduled for July 29/30.
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whodatschrome wrote:
for me, if the engine is dirty i will remove the whole thing from the frame and pressure wash the heck out of it until it's squeaky clean. Then i'll immediately disassemble it. If the cases are pretty darn clean already, i usually leave the engine in the frame. I'll also leave the airbox in place, but i will disconnect the rear shock, fuel hose, oil line, and selector box (the stator just gets dangled out of the way). Then i'll slip off the head, unscrew the 4 cylinder head studs, then pop the cylinder out. The 200 cylinder and head are a bit larger diameter than the 150, so there isn't as much room to work with. It's been a while since i've opened up my T5 engine, but from what i remember, you could remove both the cylinder and head without even pivoting down the back of the engine.
that is the approach i take about every time. Take the entire engine out and power wash it with hot, soapy water. Local car wash works well for this. If anyone knows me well, i don't work on or build dirty engines.

Unless i'm doing clutch work, not much more work to drop the entire engine. Easier to work on and the job is much more complete.
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GickSpeed wrote:
that is the approach i take about every time. Take the entire engine out and power wash it with hot, soapy water. Local car wash works well for this. If anyone knows me well, i don't work on or build dirty engines.

Unless i'm doing clutch work, not much more work to drop the entire engine. Easier to work on and the job is much more complete.
I can 100% admit I don't like working on something covered with grease and road grime.
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To update this thread. Before splitting the case in the bike we pressure tested the engine and it failed miserably (Somewhere in Tennessee Chandlerman smiled.)... so we pulled the engine out of the bike.


One word. Dayumn. Lots and lots of issues and shennanigans with this "resto". No kS cog or spring. New seals dry as the saharan desert (put some 2t or grease on them things when you install peeps). Seals weren't seated correctly. Found a bearing not seated correctly.

All and all a giant gong show. It was however a great hang. Mark came down, Amrando's son Armandito came over, their moto-mechanic friend Mike came by. Lots of BS and hamburguesas and beers. Oh and sweat. It was like 102 by 10:00am. Pshaw!

Mark is sorting the engine in Dallas as he is off for a few days. Hoping to install Sat or Sun.

Only pic I took...
Any chance we had the right sized kS cog on hand? Absolutely not! :-)
Any chance we had the right sized kS cog on hand? Absolutely not! :-)
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Birdsnest wrote:
To update this thread. Before splitting the case in the bike we pressure tested the engine and it failed miserably (Somewhere in Tennessee Chandlerman smiled.)... so we pulled the engine out of the bike.


I thought I felt either a good disturbance in The Force or gas over the weekend. Now I know.

I replaced the bad gear and cruciform in my P200 motor over the weekend and got it all buttoned up. The worst part of pressure testing bikes with SI carbs is that you have to remove the carb to install the blanking plate.

I think I'm about to have to pull the head on my VBB, so am now contemplating if it's possible/feasible to pressure test with the carb on. I'm kind've thinking it should work on a premix motor. More to come on this...

As to that motor...how in all that's holy does someone realize they left out the kick start gear, then just shrug and say, "Ship it!"

The other issues could just be incompetence, but having had my successful pressure test celebration ruined by seeing the kickstart gear on the floor, I know how frustrating it is--but I'll guarantee whoever built that motor didn't even know what a pressure test was to not do it.

Glad y'all are working through it, 102F and all. (It was 99F and probably almost as humid here this weekend. Great reason to have an insulated & air conditioned workshop )
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I always seem to break stuff when I work on the engine in the frame (especially piston rings) and it takes longer overall.

One thing I keep having to learn: Only have the exact number of washers and hardware that belong/came off the engineā€¦no other hardware within a 15 foot radius. If a washer is unaccounted for, don't grab another one. If you can't hold that exact washer in your hand, it's in the engine case.
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orwell84 wrote:
If you can't hold that exact washer in your hand, it's in the engine case.
This. A thousand times this...
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chandlerman wrote:


I thought I felt either a good disturbance in The Force or gas over the weekend. Now I know.

Come on... equal chance that was probably just the Chipotle.
vw man wrote:
If you can't hold that exact washer in your hand, it's in the engine case.
Facts is facts.
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Giant Gong Show..... ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon

At least there was lots of BS and hanging out going on. Sounds like fun, even though it was crazy hot...
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