Modern Vespa

Hi guys, a Vespa newbie, and non-technical person here. I just came back from a sabbatical traveling for 9 months, and unfortunately I couldn't touch my Vespa during the period.

First, when I turned the key and power button- nothing happened, also the screen remained black. Then, I tried charging the Elettrica- but the screen remained black, and the charging sound drops after like 1 minute. The same thing happens as I retried it multiple times.

I assume it's the battery, but Im not sure. Could anyone please help me point out what the possible problem is, and how to fix it? The nearest Vespa dealer/ motorcycle garage are quite far away, so I'd like to ask if there is a way for me to fix it myself? or somehow reboot it?

Thanks in advance everyone!

That thing has two batteries right? Are they both charged? What does your owner's manual say?

Also in the future, you can spend $15 and get one of those wifi outlet plugs and from your phone set it to come on for one or two days every couple weeks. Bikes are very easy to maintain from the other side of the world these days with a little consideration for them.

The Vespa Elettrica has TWO batteries, the driving battery and the service or starter battery.

The starter battery lasts according to the manual maximum 3 months in storage, ie this should be empty.

I assume that if the service battery is empty, no charging of the drive battery can be started, because the service battery controls the VMS...

The starter/starter battery is in the center tunnel under the plastic cover (as with the gasoline Vespa). Disconnect vehicle from power and remove/charge service battery (replace if necessary).

You can alternatively try to use the emergency start function:

"EMERGENCY START".
When the vehicle is started by turning the key to the "ON" position, the service battery activates the V.M.S. - Vehicle Management System, which in turn activates the traction battery.
If the service battery is dead and the dashboard is not lit, the vehicle can be started as follows:

- turn the key to the "OFF" position; raise the seat;
- press the corresponding emergency button under the seat until the click of the switch can be heard;
- turn the key to the "ON" position: now the dashboard lights up: keep the MAP button pressed until the READY status is displayed; now you can continue driving.

Charge both batteries as soon as possible.

This allows to activate the V.M.S. - Vehicle Management System - through the traction battery and to control the "DC-DC" converter to charge the service battery."
Source: Owners Manual

But if the drive battery is also empty, then this will not work (and you have to charge service/starter battery first)

Note: to open the seat without power open Glovebox and use the manual opener.

Is the starter battery a lead-acid one? If so what type? My take is that if this was discharged, and had been for more than a day or so, it'd be toast. An AGM should have lasted way more than three months though - my UK one has been known to last over a year without being touched.

I'm sure it's a Yuasa AGM and I belive with lower capacity as in PV/Sprint.

Owners manual:
"Prolonged standstill (04_11)
When the vehicle is not used for a long period of time, the service battery power decreases.
This is due to the self-discharge of the battery and the residual power consumption of the vehicle due to the continuous power supply of some components. Battery power degradation is also affected by room conditions and battery terminal cleanliness. To avoid starting difficulties and serious damage to the battery, the following should be observed and done:
- At least once a month, start the engine and run it for 10-15 minutes. This will keep the battery and the engine components in good working order.
components.
- When storing the vehicle, the service battery must be removed. The battery must be cleaned, fully charged and stored in a dry and ventilated place. Recharge the battery charge at least once every three months"

Thanks. Looks like the answer for the OP is to replace the starter battery and remember to take it out if it's left idle for more than a month.

The same system is true of electric cars. There is a 12V "service" battery which powers the electronic control system and a higher voltage "traction" battery which powers the vehicle. No 12V, no go. In fact, a weak 12V system can be the cause of all kinds of perplexing electrical problems in an EV.

Hopefully that 12V one is a LiFePO4 one - keeps its charge seemingly forever.

Not in my Nissan LEAF anyway.

The battery under the floor is the same type as on the Primavera / Sprint but a slightly lower capacity.

To the OP, swap the battery under the floorboard and all will work again.

For the future, the Elettrica charges the small lead battery when in "Ready" mode, so even if you aren't riding, try and switch it on and press and hold the start button to activate "Ready", then leave the Vespa for a few minutes. This uses the lithium battery to charge the little lead battery.

Hi all, thanks so much for the reply! Looks like from all of your suggestions, I need to replace the 12V battery under the plastic cap.

Does it matter what kind of 12V battery I buy? or is there specific ones I need to get? If yes, could you please help me understand which one?

I looked up online, and some forums mentioned the Yuasa YTX5L. Do I have to get the same exact one, or some of these pictured are okay?

Thanks a lot once again in advance, and sorry for my technical naivety. [img][/img]

First: Do you have tried to charge your service battery?

In your Picture are multiple battery brands, an maybe multiple types.

Go for Yuasa if it is available. Yuasa is a good choice, it's OEM quality for a reasonable price.


In Primavera/Sprint a Yuasa YTX7L-BS is used, it has a little bit more capacity than the Yuasa YTX5L-BS (4.2Ah) which comes with the Elettrica, so I would go for the stronger YTX7L-BS (6.3Ah). It will fit perfectly in your Elettrica as it is the same frame as Primavera/Sprint.

Its physically larger though isn't it?
Will it fit?

Yes! Same frame for Elettrica/PV/Sprint!

Both have same length (114mm), width (71mm). The YTX5L-BS is 107mm and the YTX7L-BS is 131mm high. Underneath the Elettrica Battery is a buffer you have to take out to fit the larger one.

If it's not turning over the motor what does it need to do? Does a bigger capacity help at all?

Bigger is better! 😎

Nearly same price (40-50€).

Vespa went to the level of producing a little plastic table that sits under the smaller battery - it isn't attached to anything but just acts as a spacer.

Considering the price point of the Elettrica, I think they personally should have just included the larger capacity.

YTX7L-BS is the better one to go for.

It'll last longer if neglected for lengths of time, and if used regularly will last longer overall, as it will never get as depleted between charges as the smaller one given similar conditions.

My lithium batteries say otherwise

I was on capacity…

You're right on LiFePO4 battery's they are lighter than AGM battery's.

Weight for weight about 2.5 to 3 times the capacity. And smaller.

Hi guys, thanks to the replies- but I have another issue. So I followed all of your advice, which is to replace the battery with a brand new one.

I just did that, and finally the screen lights up for the first time in two days- but the charge stays at 0% and the red light is blinking (just like on picture).

Anyone can help me figure out what's the current problem - and possible way to fix it? Thank you in advance!

Out of curiosity, if you unplug the Vespa from the mains electricity and then turn the key in the ignition as if you are going to ride the Vespa, can you hold the start button and then ride it? Or does this also show the charge at 0%?

I would try unplugging the Vespa from the mains electricity, then disconnect the battery under the floor for a minute or so, then reconnect battery under the floor, then plug it back into the mains. Hopefully this is enough to "reboot it".

what red light? (don't see one in the pic)

9 months? Generally you want to keep a lithium ion battery between 20-70% during storage. Below 20% the cells can start to degrade. At 0% they absolutely start to degrade (meaning, their ability to hold electricity starts to decrease.)

You might have to replace the big battery my guy. Which is going to be really really really expensive. google searches show people talking around the $3800 ballpark for a replacement battery.

good luck. if you want an unbiased opinion on lithium ion batteries, call Powerful Lithium in NYC. Probably one of the top 2 aftermarket ebike battery shops in the US. Really nice guys.

I wonder if Piaggio warranty battery warranty covers user neglect...

I doubt it was ridden and then parked up at 0%, and the traction battery doesn't really discharge when stored as all the instrument cluster, immobiliser etc are all run off the 12v battery.

I think it's more the Vespa is confused as to what state of charge the battery is actually in.

If it's still a problem, I imagine a main dealer can probably digitally reset the battery management system by plugging the Vespa into their computer.

There are also updates for the Elettrica that can only be applied by the dealer - so it's good for a dealer to see the bike every now and then.

Just trying to resuscitate this thread since I have a similar issue -- Elettrica won't charge after about 30 days of non-use. Multifunction display works, but even after being plugged in overnight, it won't add any miles. This is in garage heated to about 45-50 degrees F, so definitely over 0 degrees Celsius. Thought it might be the auxiliary battery so I charged that up overnight via pigtail and battery keeper, but it still doesn't seem to charge, and, in fact, charge has gone down from 9% to 5% over the course of several attempts to charge. I also switched outlets in case there was some problem with it. Any thoughts? Closest dealer is very far.

Few things I'd try:

1) are you using an extension lead to get power to the Vespa? Extension leads don't have full power if they're rolled up. Can you try a different socket / outlet?

2) Does the Vespa go into ready mode and will it accelerate? Maybe try a quick 60 second ride before you plug it back in.

3) Try disconnecting the lead auxiliary battery for 5 minutes and then re connect it.

See also posts above!

The charging process for the traction battery does not start if the 12v starter battery is too weak...

Solution:
1. Charge the 12v starter battery (is not charged via the normal charging process) or alternatively use emergency mode to charge the starter battery (see operating instructions)
2. start the charging process again

First check the charge status of the 12 V starter battery with a multimeter (then we know immediately whether a low charge status can also be the cause here)

As you keep trying to tell people with somewhat limited success, it is always a good idea to RTFM.

Thanks, all, for the suggestions.

(1) Starter battery is showing 12.5 volts on multimeter.
(2) I've plugged charging cable directly into outlet -- no extension cord used. Multiple outlets tried with direct plug in.
(3) I disconnected starting battery for five minutes and then plugged back in.
(4) I also tried emergency button under seat.

Still not charging traction battery, which is at 5%. I'm thinking it might be auxiliary battery? I would have thought that 12.5 volts would be enough, but maybe not?

Also, to answer Jake's question, it will go into ready mode and accelerate. Haven't taken it out for a spin but I did move it under eco power in the garage.

I don't know where the limit is, but I would charge the starter battery first to at least rule this out as a problem. If the traction battery does not start charging despite the starter battery being full, you will need to visit the dealer…

Still under warranty?

Does it keep 12.5 volts under load, though?

I figured that ancillary battery was probably the culprit so I replaced ancillary battery with brand new fully charged battery throwing off 12.9 to 13 volts. Put bike in ready mode briefly just to make sure it works. The traction battery still won't charge. Stuck at 4% even after leaving it plugged directly into outlet (no extension cord) for 30+ minutes. Would welcome other theories, but am now thinking the traction battery charger might have somehow failed. Still under warranty but dealer is more than an hour away and I'm not sure bike fits in the minivan.

Sorry, no additional ideas (from my side) to get your bike running…

If it is still under warranty, contact your dealer! European warranty includes a mobility guarantee/roadside assistance (Piaggio covers transport of bike to dealer if under warranty and it does not work), not sure it is the same in the US. If not maybe the AAA or your insurance company covers transport?

Good luck! Please keep us updated.

Just wanted to update everyone since folks had a variety of helpful suggestions. Ended up having to return the Elettrica to the dealer and he said something about the software being corrupt? So it had to be reprogrammed somehow. In any event, it charges up fine now, but it seems like something the dealer would have to do.