OP
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:01:59 +0000

Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:01:59 +0000 quote
Sorry if I should put this in the other thread, but it does seem a bit different. As you know I have had breakdowns recently. Bike just dies after being ridden for 20+ miles. Seems to happen when hot. Has happened twice. I have been told it's most likely the fuel pump/heat (I am just awaiting on the dealer to come get it sometime this week)......In the meantime as I am awaiting them - I have had zero breakdowns. My ride to work is about 10 miles each way......but I have been aware of not really going too far. I work in NYC which is about 25 miles away and that is when it happened......at the end of the ride when bike is hot.

I have been testing the bike by letting it idle (fan goes on/off) and it does idle.....but after about 40 minutes or so- it just stalls out etc while idling. Then doesnt start again until cool.

Is that normal for it to stall out if left to idle for so long??? I am wondering if my woe has corrected itself or something or if the stall while idling is just a sign that there is indeed something wrong.

I guess I would rather not give the bike back to the shop, but if there is indeed something wrong with my fuel pump (again) I of course want to get it replaced.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:21:38 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: Fri, 14 Sep 2012 00:46:39 +0000
Posts: 11667
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: Fri, 14 Sep 2012 00:46:39 +0000
Posts: 11667
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:21:38 +0000 quote
Not normal IMO.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:45:03 +0000

Ossessionato
1991 Vespa T5 Pole Position, 2008 Vespa S 125, 2023 Piaggio MP3 300HPE Sport
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Location: Staffordshire England
 
Ossessionato
1991 Vespa T5 Pole Position, 2008 Vespa S 125, 2023 Piaggio MP3 300HPE Sport
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:45:03 +0000 quote
To be honest, I've never left mine idling for that long?
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:54:38 +0000

Ossessionato
BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
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BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
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Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 13:54:38 +0000 quote
RocklandDad wrote:

I have been testing the bike by letting it idle (fan goes on/off) and it does idle.....but after about 40 minutes or so- it just stalls out etc while idling. Then doesnt start again until cool.

Is that normal for it to stall out if left to idle for so long??? I am wondering if my woe has corrected itself or something or if the stall while idling is just a sign that there is indeed something wrong.
IMHO, I wouldn't base too much of a diagnosis on 40 minutes of idling. I think it's unpredictable what could happen. (I wouldn't be surprised if any of my small engines stalled after idling that long.) If I suspected the fuel pump on "hot" days I'd be more inclined to track the ambient temperature and the miles I'd ridden *.

Again, in my opinion, your problem is your fuel pump. I could be wrong.

* and perhaps the amount of fuel in the tank, as I've read that fuel has a cooling effect on the pump and stalling is more likely if there's only a little fuel remaining.
OP
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 14:32:54 +0000

Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 14:32:54 +0000 quote
JKJ-FZ6 wrote:
IMHO, I wouldn't base too much of a diagnosis on 40 minutes of idling. I think it's unpredictable what could happen. (I wouldn't be surprised if any of my small engines stalled after idling that long.) If I suspected the fuel pump on "hot" days I'd be more inclined to track the ambient temperature and the miles I'd ridden *.

Again, in my opinion, your problem is your fuel pump. I could be wrong.

* and perhaps the amount of fuel in the tank, as I've read that fuel has a cooling effect on the pump and stalling is more likely if there's only a little fuel remaining.
Tank's full......Yeah, my dealer said he is pretty confident it's the fuel pump - I just wish he thought that originally rather then the ECU that "fixed" it but when it happened again he seemed pretty confident that is what the deal is.

Looking forward to getting it taken care of this week.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:01:29 +0000

Addicted
2015 Sprint 150, 2018 GTS 300
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Location: SoCal
 
Addicted
2015 Sprint 150, 2018 GTS 300
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:01:29 +0000 quote
I've let mine idle for long periods of time to test the fan, never stalled out.
My guess, fuel pump, charcoal canister or valves.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:03:38 +0000

Addicted
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Addicted
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:03:38 +0000 quote
CaliforniaCruising wrote:
charcoal canister or valves.
My guess.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 18:57:47 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
GT 2.4
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Location: NWAOK
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GT 2.4
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 18:57:47 +0000 quote
You might want to do some research as to the advisability of letting an engine idle for 40 minutes. It can cause excess wear, shorten the life of the cat, and likely drains the battery. With a single cylinder, it's not surprising that it stalls if you let it idle for an excess amount of time.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 19:44:08 +0000

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Piaggio Beverly 300 ie - 2012
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Location: Belgium
 
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Piaggio Beverly 300 ie - 2012
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 19:44:08 +0000 quote
RocklandDad wrote:
(...)
I have been testing the bike by letting it idle (fan goes on/off) and it does idle.....but after about 40 minutes or so- it just stalls out etc while idling. Then doesnt start again until cool.

Is that normal for it to stall out if left to idle for so long???
(...)
No, that is not normal.
If your cooling works as it should, and apparently it does considering your fan goes on and off, the engine should keep on running on idle for hours, until it runs out of fuel.
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 20:29:40 +0000

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GTS 300 hpe
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Location: NYC
 
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 20:29:40 +0000 quote
Extensive idling is not great for an engine and 40 minutes is a mighty long time.

The motor of your Vespa is engineered to operate under load, meaning with you riding. Neither the engine cooling nor the lubrication perform at their peak while idling.
OP
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 21:12:43 +0000

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Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
Hooked
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 21:12:43 +0000 quote
Motovista wrote:
You might want to do some research as to the advisability of letting an engine idle for 40 minutes. It can cause excess wear, shorten the life of the cat, and likely drains the battery. With a single cylinder, it's not surprising that it stalls if you let it idle for an excess amount of time.
I understand that, I was just trying to repeat/duplicate a failure that happened recently before I allow my dealer to come pickup the bike and replace the fuel pump. It's not something I do often, just did it twice as a test.
OP
Tue, 12 Sep 2023 21:13:36 +0000

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VESPA GTS 300
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Hooked
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Tue, 12 Sep 2023 21:13:36 +0000 quote
giallo wrote:
Extensive idling is not great for an engine and 40 minutes is a mighty long time.

The motor of your Vespa is engineered to operate under load, meaning with you riding. Neither the engine cooling nor the lubrication perform at their peak while idling.
I know……was just trying to duplicate the failure prior to allowing the dealer to come and get it.
OP
Thu, 14 Sep 2023 23:38:44 +0000

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VESPA GTS 300
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
Hooked
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
Thu, 14 Sep 2023 23:38:44 +0000 quote
The verdict is fuel pump. This is what I was told

"Yeah so when the pump is faulty and the bike gets hot, the pump expands and essentially starves the bike of fuel. Thats's why you need to wait for it to cool down before it starts again. That's whats happening here and we see it happening in other bikes as well with the same condition as yours"

Damn! This will be my third fuel pump at 7200 miles!!! factory one went caput at 400 miles…….

Anyway - hopefully this is it!
Thu, 14 Sep 2023 23:39:46 +0000

Ossessionato
2019 GTS300 Supertech E3 50,000km
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2019 GTS300 Supertech E3 50,000km
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Thu, 14 Sep 2023 23:39:46 +0000 quote
RocklandDad wrote:
The verdict is fuel pump. This is what I was told

"Yeah so when the pump is faulty and the bike gets hot, the pump expands and essentially starves the bike of fuel. Thats's why you need to wait for it to cool down before it starts again. That's whats happening here and we see it happening in other bikes as well with the same condition as yours"

Damn! This will be my third fuel pump at 7200 miles!!! factory one went caput at 400 miles…….

Anyway - hopefully this is it!
valves also expand with heat. I'm not confident that they have checked them (only because you problem persists after multiple pumps)
Thu, 14 Sep 2023 23:49:29 +0000

Ossessionato
BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
Joined: Thu, 06 Jun 2013 13:22:21 +0000
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Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
 
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BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
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Thu, 14 Sep 2023 23:49:29 +0000 quote
RocklandDad wrote:
Damn! This will be my third fuel pump at 7200 miles!!! factory one went caput at 400 miles…
Hopefully they can replace it with a "new and improved" one that lasts much longer.
OP
Fri, 15 Sep 2023 01:45:24 +0000

Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
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Location: Pearl River, NY '
Fri, 15 Sep 2023 01:45:24 +0000 quote
SteelBytes wrote:
valves also expand with heat. I'm not confident that they have checked them (only because you problem persists after multiple pumps)
Thanks for the tip. I have just emailed and brought this up to them and asked them to look at the valves too
OP
Fri, 15 Sep 2023 14:45:03 +0000

Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
Joined: Fri, 25 Feb 2022 21:33:38 +0000
Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Posts: 275
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Fri, 15 Sep 2023 14:45:03 +0000 quote
SteelBytes wrote:
valves also expand with heat. I'm not confident that they have checked them (only because you problem persists after multiple pumps)
Just spoke with them - He said they know to look over the valves, but at my suggestion he will mention to the techs.
Fri, 15 Sep 2023 21:47:46 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
LX190 Friday afternoon special, Primavera, some pushbikes
Joined: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 21:16:28 +0000
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Location: Hermit Kingdom
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
LX190 Friday afternoon special, Primavera, some pushbikes
Joined: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 21:16:28 +0000
Posts: 9467
Location: Hermit Kingdom
Fri, 15 Sep 2023 21:47:46 +0000 quote
I wonder if 40 minutes of idling is going to kill a good fuel pump.
OP
Sat, 16 Sep 2023 12:43:37 +0000

Hooked
VESPA GTS 300
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
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Posts: 275
Location: Pearl River, NY '
Sat, 16 Sep 2023 12:43:37 +0000 quote
znomit wrote:
I wonder if 40 minutes of idling is going to kill a good fuel pump.
I won't do that. That was just to duplicate what happened a few times prior to replacing the pump to make sure that is what it is.
OP
Thu, 21 Sep 2023 23:21:06 +0000

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Location: Pearl River, NY '
 
Hooked
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Location: Pearl River, NY '
Thu, 21 Sep 2023 23:21:06 +0000 quote
Picked up my bike with the new fuel pump today at 11:30. Was on it until 6pm pretty much non stop. No issues. Two of those hours towards the end were in bumper to bumper traffic getting out of NYC with the fan going on and off all the time. Seems to me that it was the fuel pump since the conditions for heating up etc couldn't've have been any worse and the ride all in was 40+ miles. Feels good to have my bike back
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