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Hello,

I am fed up with the lights flickering at iddle.

Would that item fix the issue ?

https://www.scooter-center.com/en/voltage-regulator-4-plug-bgm-pro-12v-ac/dc-universal-bgm6690

My Px200 has no battery, so all the DC power could be used to power the lights ?
I have a regular 80W stator.
I am aware that I will have to replace the horn for a DC model.

Also could I replace all lights by LEDs as the power consumption will be lower compared to halogen/filament bulbs?

Thanks !
@mjrally avatar
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73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 06 PX150, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special, 90 V5N 50, 01 ET2, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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This won't produce enough DC amperage to power all your lights. Just the bare minimum to charge a battery.

You'll need to swap to a DC wired stator, make your own DC stator or buy a Vape kit with the DC rectifier.
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Thanks for your answer.

I did not know I could modify the stator for it to produce DC power !
I'm going to look for a how to on the net !
Thanks
@mjrally avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 06 PX150, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special, 90 V5N 50, 01 ET2, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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Search for "floating ground" or "DC conversion" etc. Chandlerman did a write up on how to do it.
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You'll want a regulator rectifier. This one it better quality that the BGM. https://www.trailtech.net/en-us/shop/accessories/motorcycle-parts/electrical/electrical-components/dc-regulator-rectifier-150-watt-full-wave-w-relay/

I use the wire diagram at the bottom of the page.
https://cdn1.polaris.com/globalassets/trail-tech/2020/home/pdf/010-elv-116.pdf?v=8351f534

A capacitor might still give you flickering lights at an idle, so you'll want to install a 12v battery in the mix. Floating the ground it pretty simple on the T5 and PX AC stators. If available for a T5, i'd buy a new 120 watt Piaggio stator and float the ground in that instead of your stock 80watt (but that's only if a higher powered stator is available for a T5). It can get a little tricky when it comes time to modify your T5's AC wire harness over to full wave DC though. You'll also have to swap out your DC headlight switch for and AC version. The other option is to modify the horn button on your existing AC switch so that i can be used with DC power. Oh, and you'll need to swap out your AC horn for a DC flavor. Of course the VAPE kit is also an option too. You will still have to sort out your headlight switch though.
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Thanks

I might go for a vape full DC then, expensive but seems good quality item !

I see there are 2 versions of the DC, fixed timing as OG or variable.

I have a 210cc iron kit from Polini (the new one with the head included) that I have to put on the bike after legal inspection of course 😁 + a Polini box exhaust, I guess the variable timing should be a +, especially on low torque !
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Personally I'd stay static with an iron kit…
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Variable timing will give you a little extra power on the low-mid range, but less noticeable on the 210 than a smaller displacement motor that doesn't have as much pure torque.

I started running variable timing when I was still on cast iron cylinders and don't know that it ever caused (or avoided Razz emoticon ) a seize as a result.

If you decide later you want to swap between static & variable timing, you can buy just the CDI, which is where the magic happens, so it's not a big commitment either way.

With DC, as others have noted, you'll still need a battery to really get rid of flicker, regardless of what the SIP web site says. I have two DC Vapes with batteries and two without. Other than the flicker factor, there's really no difference in overall electrical performance.

If you run LED lights, you may find that the LED's start to strobe at less than about 1,300 RPM's without the battery.
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I've used and installed both. I'd buy the road/static version from now on.

It still has enough retarded timing for really good power off the line.

Unless you go up and down the rev range of 5000-8000rpm every few seconds of riding, you won't benefit from the sport ignition.

I'm with CM, if you decide you want to change, you can.

And +1 on the flicker. Battery is the only way to go.

Edit: grammar mistake.
⚠️ Last edited by 108 on UTC; edited 1 time
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A friend is using capacitors instead of a battery, even on stock ignitions converted to full wave DC. No flickering with LED headlights…
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Mmhh... Seems I have to add a battery. I could of course, but then will I have to modify the wiring loom ? I just finished rebuilding the scooter... I know I should have ask before, but I did not know about the lights flickering, especially when turn signals are on, on idle only.

I may live with that for a while, then I don't know !

I may purchase a "stopped in the middle restauration" VBB2t in my area (discovered a few hours ago). I should close the deal tomorrow, I think I am going to save the money from the DC conversion to buy parts for the knew one.
3 vespa restaurations in 18 months... Facepalm emoticon
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ColinBelgium wrote:
3 vespa restaurations in 18 months... Facepalm emoticon
Can't say you weren't warned! Razz emoticon
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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ROFL emoticon
So true
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Running an unaltered VAPE ignition with the VAPE DC rectifier (plus battery), in theory is the enough to power all lights at 12V consistently?
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Lucky
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GickSpeed wrote:
Running an unaltered VAPE ignition with the VAPE DC rectifier (plus battery), in theory is the enough to power all lights at 12V consistently?
It is. Even without a battery, it's fine. It only flickers under about 1,300 RPM's. It keeps a battery charged just fine, too.
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chandlerman wrote:
It is. Even without a battery, it's fine. It only flickers under about 1,300 RPM's. It keeps a battery charged just fine, too.
Okay. I have done just that on a bike here, full DC Setup. Just on the road. If you could give some insight , it will be helpful-

I went out on a ride today, appx. 25 miles at 50 mph. Measured that battery when I returned to the shop and I am at 11.2v. Doesn't seem right.


Just testing some things-

13.6 V out from rectifier. . . That's at idle as well, give or take. Not connect to the battery! Frankly, I am impressed.

Still not connected to battery, add the headlight bulb in , and v drop to approx 6v to 7v ish with high RPM's.

That doesn't seem right and hard to believe it would keep that battery at 12+ v
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That much voltage drop is definitely not right. Do you get that much voltage drop if you try connecting it with just the battery?

It's possible that the rectifier is damaged, but I'd be more focused on looking for some sort of weak short to ground or some other wiring fault.

For comparison, here's an inventory of my various DC systems...

All of them but the Sprint have a GPS speedo, which doesn't have a huge draw, but I think they're 20-30W if memory serves.

I run an incandescent 35/35W bulb in my GL with the Vape DC. LED pilot, tail, brake, turn signals, and the GPS speedo. It has a battery, which has never had an issue staying charged except when I let it sit without putting it on a tender.

I have full LED's on all my other bikes. The headlights are the brightest LED's I can get my hands on and fit the headset. On my Sprint, it's a 55W JWSpeaker LED. Other than flickering at idle (1,000 RPM's), it runs with no battery just fine.

On my Smallie, I have full LED's, the speedo, a digital CHT, and a small 12V lithium battery that I use to overcome the strobing at idle issue. I've also been running an AFR on it for the past few weeks, which adds a relatively heavy draw. The Vape still keeps up just fine, including keeping the battery charged.
@108 avatar
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Yeah sound like there's something wrong there.

I found the battery would only drop if the ride was super short, like under 3kms.

My daily rides were around 6-12kms and it charges properly.

25miles should be more than enough.
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chandlerman wrote:
That much voltage drop is definitely not right. Do you get that much voltage drop if you try connecting it with just the battery?

It's possible that the rectifier is damaged, but I'd be more focused on looking for some sort of weak short to ground or some other wiring fault.

For comparison, here's an inventory of my various DC systems...

All of them but the Sprint have a GPS speedo, which doesn't have a huge draw, but I think they're 20-30W if memory serves.

I run an incandescent 35/35W bulb in my GL with the Vape DC. LED pilot, tail, brake, turn signals, and the GPS speedo. It has a battery, which has never had an issue staying charged except when I let it sit without putting it on a tender.

I have full LED's on all my other bikes. The headlights are the brightest LED's I can get my hands on and fit the headset. On my Sprint, it's a 55W JWSpeaker LED. Other than flickering at idle (1,000 RPM's), it runs with no battery just fine.

On my Smallie, I have full LED's, the speedo, a digital CHT, and a small 12V lithium battery that I use to overcome the strobing at idle issue. I've also been running an AFR on it for the past few weeks, which adds a relatively heavy draw. The Vape still keeps up just fine, including keeping the battery charged.
when connecting the bulb to the battery, 12v, no drop. battery is not connected to anything.

here is what is interesting, since i have about 8 VAPE regulators, i put one on. at idle, delivers near 12v. with the headlight bulb, the same.

this is starting to point at a bad rectifier i think. remember, the rectifier is not connected to anything other than being bolted onto the chassis and connected to the stator. everything upstream from the rectifier is thus eliminated. i have a rectifier on the way.

Anyone need a VAPE regulator as a spare? i have several, just pay postage.
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108 wrote:
Yeah sound like there's something wrong there.

I found the battery would only drop if the ride was super short, like under 3kms.

My daily rides were around 6-12kms and it charges properly.

25miles should be more than enough.
Thanks man.
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parallelogramerist
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parallelogramerist
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I have a TrailTech volt gauge on my PK (which has a VAPE DC variable kit). Somewhere i documented the different voltages at different RPM and with different amp loads on the system. I can't remember the exact numbers, but with somewhere around a 50 watt-ish draw at an idle, my volt gauge was showing somewhere well over 12.6 volts...possibly and probably closer to 13.1 or 13.3?

I'd be interested in a VAPE regulator, but i keep switching over to rectifiers. So i'm going to pass on your generosity.
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