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Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
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As noted elsewhere, it is true "design build"…

Better to cut the hole once welded in place anyway.

Hole saws in sheet metal: suck.
At bare minimum, a center drill and some sort of clamped wood backer or it will tear, warp, bend, and gnarl.

The tighter u can make the backer, the more solid feel of the process…

Love that u r pursuing full paint.
At some point - it's gonna be the star of the garage.
@108 avatar
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Ossessionato
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CM… slightly disappointed…

This hole in the middle of the pic (for the floor runner) looks like it was made with a hammer and nail…

Expected better from you… lol

Anticipating the colour!!
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Molto Verboso
'07 GTS250, '07 LX150, '81 P200E, '78 P200E, '64 V90 and 3 Ciaos
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
108 wrote:
CM… slightly disappointed…

This hole in the middle of the pic (for the floor runner) looks like it was made with a hammer and nail…

Expected better from you… lol

Anticipating the colour!!
Yeah. I'd have expected a plasma cutter or a shaped charge... ROFL emoticon
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Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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Lucky
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ROFL emoticon to all!
charlieman22 wrote:
As noted elsewhere, it is true "design build"…

Better to cut the hole once welded in place anyway.

Hole saws in sheet metal: suck.
At bare minimum, a center drill and some sort of clamped wood backer or it will tear, warp, bend, and gnarl.

The tighter u can make the backer, the more solid feel of the process…

Love that u r pursuing full paint.
At some point - it's gonna be the star of the garage.
Even if all I do in the end is basically scribe the metal so I have a really nice mark to work against, it'll be a valiant effort. I've also had good luck in the past by using lots of cutting fluid and going really, really, really slowly.

Also, I'll clamp it from both sides so it's locked in top and bottom. That makes a big difference.
108 wrote:
CM… slightly disappointed…

This hole in the middle of the pic (for the floor runner) looks like it was made with a hammer and nail…

Expected better from you… lol

Anticipating the colour!!
It'll get there! My drill bits are getting dull again, and as CM2 notes above, poking holes in sheet metal pretty much sucks if you're anything short of a proper punch. Which I guess I could have used, but only along the edge because it doesn'
az_slynch wrote:
Yeah. I'd have expected a plasma cutter or a shaped charge... ROFL emoticon
You never know. I might have spent the rest of the evening gluing lasers to sharks and then training them to swim in 1" circles.

If all goes well, I'll be over the paint hump by Sunday afternoon. If all goes to hell...well, that'll probably be a bit longer.
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Lucky
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Progress continues. The sharks took the their laser training well, so I was able to get the hole cut for the brake pedal tonight. I also hung the plastic to make the paint booth, so I have nothing standing between me and paint but prep work.

Yay. Prep work.

Still, I'm pretty excited and hoping that I can get DTM on by the time I got to bed tomorrow night, then do any filling and sanding Saturday to shoot color on Sunday.

And since I've been left without adult supervision, unless I fall and can't get up or something, I see no reason this plan can't succeed.
The sharks did good work
The sharks did good work
Your paint booth awaits, m'Lord.
Your paint booth awaits, m'Lord.
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parallelogramerist
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parallelogramerist
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FridayMatinee wrote:
I've been better as I've gotten older.
The damage has already been done though.
I always forget to wear them when riding and I definitely should.
Pretty much every single pair of pants or shorts that i own have a pair of ear plugs hanging out in their pockets.
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parallelogramerist
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108 wrote:
May I take the liberty to incept some thoughts of the Italian variety?

Saw this a few times, thought it might be good for you seeing you're at bare metal.

These frame reinforcements are for engines that would definitely be more powerful than ours…
I've done this with great success on four of my largeframes. Pretty much anytime i do a full body and paint i'll weld in a thick rod along the whole perimeter of the frame.
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Ossessionato
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I have used these:

https://www.harborfreight.com/knockout-punch-kit-10-piece-60575.html

Then flared the holes by backing up the hole with a large socket and hammering the flare in with with a smaller socket.
Bus floor section with holes for wired/cables.
Bus floor section with holes for wired/cables.
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Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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Lucky
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Tonight I did the last-of-the-last tasks before paint, like removing the old fork lock and removing weld spatter, then went into Prep Mode.

roughed up the surface, then wiped down with soapy water, then acetone, then mineral spirits, then alcohol, then tack cloth. Sorted out the air filtration. Got ready to mix the paint, pulled out my guns, went to hook them up to the compressor...and realized I've lost my moisture separator.

It wasn't a great separator. It was prone to leaking air you pulled on it laterally and similar issues, but it would have gotten me through the DTM tonight if I could have found it.

So first thing tomorrow morning will be a run to the hardware store, followed by laying down paint. I may still be able to shoot color on Sunday, but it'll be Sunday night. Otherwise, it'll be Monday after work.

It's always something.
so, so, so close
so, so, so close
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You're a mad man! Keep slugging.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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Birdsnest wrote:
You're a mad man! Keep slugging.
I was pretty slow off the mark this morning, now it's Game On.
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Lucky
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Turned out to be a not-so-great day in the paint shop.

First, my DTM Epoxy primer decided to kick while most of it was still in the gun. That led to my second discovery of the day, namely that my paint gun cleaner had evaporated.

So I got to clean paint that had turned the same approximate consistency as toothpaste out of the gun. That took. a. while.

So now I'm feeling a little (paint) gun shy about jumping back in until I can get some paint gun cleaner. I have plenty of acetone, but I'm not sure how confident I'm feeling about that if things go south again.

We'll see how I feel in a bit.
It was going great until it wasn't
It was going great until it wasn't
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
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That's painful CM. I spend way more time looking for tools and stuff I know I have than actually using the stuff.
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Lucky
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Ginch wrote:
That's painful CM. I spend way more time looking for tools and stuff I know I have than actually using the stuff.
Same, same.

After some lunch and a little break, I decided to get back on the horse.

I mixed another batch, being super-careful to not go crazy with the hardener, 4:1 as per the directions. I did half as much and...it still kicked early on me.

Sooo...clean the gun, and try again, this time 5:1. It kicked early on me AGAIN. Clean the gun. Again.

And then I pulled out the year-old leftover Summit Racing DTM I had from the VBB.

Mixed it up and shot a batch and it went on as dead perfect as any of my paint goes on. So I did the exterior parts (top of the frame, headset, tank, door, mudguard) so they're all in white and am declaring adequate progress for the day.

Tomorrow, I'll shoot a test batch of the top coat to see if it behaves any better (and make sure I like the color). If it behaves, great. I'll get on with the filling and sanding, then shoot paint tomorrow or Monday night. If not, then I'll be picking a new color from the Summit Racing single stage palette.
Primer looks a little thin on the front of the legshield.  Looked okay IRL.
Primer looks a little thin on the front of the legshield. Looked okay IRL.
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I've never had primer do that to me but I've had brand new paint that was bad and just ran right off the part. Scary having it gel up in the gun. I probably would've drowned myself in the creek behind the shop and taken the gun with me. Glad your other primer worked out.
On another note, looks like your tire of choice is the K58. Sounds like they get good milage but was wondering about the grip in the twisties. I don't ride in the rain but looking for a good all rounder that's grippy enough in the canyons. What do you think? Thanks.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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The K58's are good tires. Really sticky, but short-lived. Mine are actually K58S'es, which are the Snow version. I used them in Chicago winters and they are noticeably stickier than any other tire in serious cold.

I didn't really thrash them out much, because you're usually happy just to be keeping the rubber side down riding in winter conditions, but they are definitely good foul weather tires all around.

As to today's progress, having paint kick in the gun was definitely no bueno. I spent more time cleaning guns than anything else yesterday, which put me behind schedule for getting filler and sanding work done yesterday.

Undeterred, I got back out this morning and did all the filler work, then did a metric fuck-ton of sanding to knock down orange peel that was almost like a popcorn ceiling in places, then shot the last of the DTM over the top of that.

Other than two magnificent drips on the left side of the frame, it all went on and looks great.

Once the primer is hard enough to sand, I'm going to knock those drips down and power on with the first color coat. If it goes on good, then I'll probably finish up tonight. If it doesn't, then it'll get sanded and re-coated over the next couple evenings.

I think my 1.8 gun is officially dead, though. It will only spray out the top half of the cone, despite doing all the cleaning I could possibly do to it. It needed to be replaced anyway, because it leaks a little bit of air at the attachment, but I don't like having the decision made for me like that.
It may look the same, but it's mostly better
It may look the same, but it's mostly better
if you're gonna drip, drip big
if you're gonna drip, drip big
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I always have a much harder time spraying epoxy primer than paint. Paint issues are all on my suckiness as a painter but with primer it's always gun problems.

Part of it is re-using cheap guns. Cheap guns are tough to clean because they are held together with plumbers tape and putty. They just fall apart with the cleaning required to get epoxy primer out of the gun or they just never get totally clean. My last round of priming, my cheap gun clogged pretty fast but I was able to get it done with a wonky pattern. Epoxy just wants to stick to something and turn to stone. So far what's worked best for me is reducing it enough to spray and doing more coats to make up for it. Alligator epoxy sucks to sand especially if you are beyond the recoat window and have to get it peel free enough to shoot again.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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I went out and took a look at it a little while ago. I doubt it's going to cure enough to sand tonight, which is annoying because I want to try this paint and make sure it's not going to cause any issues. Otherwise, Summit Racing will be getting cash from me for paint and at least one gun.

The paintwork itself is pretty good (not counting massive drips), at least by my standards. Almost no orange peel at all, but I still want to hit it with 600 grit to really even it out.

Maybe the mudguard or engine door will be good-to-go in a few more hours. Small, easy to prep, and then I can do a small batch just to test.

Also, make sure I actually like the color I picked.
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
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UTC quote
chandlerman wrote:
The K58's are good tires. Really sticky, but short-lived. Mine are actually K58S'es, which are the Snow version. I used them in Chicago winters and they are noticeably stickier than any other tire in serious cold.
My K58's (not snow type) lasted well. Not sure how long but at least as long as the old Sava/Mitas I used to run. Had grip in spades... in fact on a ride where two out of the ten of us ended up in hospital with broken bones due to extreme slippery conditions, these tyres were what eventually gave me the confidence to ride in the wet again. Now I'm using the K47 which are also great.
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May the paint gods be with you.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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orwell84 wrote:
May the paint gods be with you.
Danke Sehr!

I pulled the trigger on a new DeVilbiss gun along with a couple other goodies this morning. I'll use the existing 1.4 gun to do a test spray and make sure the paint's still good, but after that, it'll be waiting until the new gun arrives.

Luckily, Summit Racing stuff usually gets here next day for me, so it's not like I'll be cooling my jets all week or anything.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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I decided I didn't want to wait for the new paint gun, plus I wanted to make sure the paint wasn't going to ruin it the first time I used it, so I did some quick prep on the engine door and mudguard so I could shoot paint on them and also see how the color looked.

It's a little darker than I was really thinking, but we'll see how it looks in the light. The color difference between inside the shop and outside in the sunlight was pretty significant with the VBB, so we'll see what tomorrow brings, but the paint went on nicely, especially considering who was doing the painting and with what.

Between the pictures, the door is closer to how it looks under the shop lights, so I guess I'm lucky it turned out well.

The mudguard, though, was weird...one half turned out reasonably well, the other half is orange peel from hell. Same prep, shot not more than thirty seconds apart, same settings. No clue on that one, I just know I'm going to be doing some a lot of sanding.
Door looks good
Door looks good
Looks pretty good, right?
Looks pretty good, right?
Not so much. WTF?
Not so much. WTF?
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Johnny Two Tone
'15 GTS300, '86 PX125EFL, '66 VBB, '01 ET4
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UTC quote
what color is it? the door looks blue and the fender looks gray
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parallelogramerist
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A couple things...
I google searched Summit DTM epoxy primer and it say to mix to a 1:1 ratio. It also says the pot life is 90~120 minutes @ 70 degrees.

If you have a bunch of orange peel i'd probably turn up the air pressure a little bit.
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Lucky
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sdjohn wrote:
what color is it? the door looks blue and the fender looks gray
It's like the blue of the door in my shop. But what it will be in the sunlight is a mystery that will have to wait until tomorrow. I think it'll be close to the door, though.

It's not really the color I intended, but it gets a little overwhelming when you're standing in the paint shop with easily a thousand little color blocks on big 8" rings to look through.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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whodatschrome wrote:
A couple things...
I google searched Summit DTM epoxy primer and it say to mix to a 1:1 ratio. It also says the pot life is 90~120 minutes @ 70 degrees.

If you have a bunch of orange peel i'd probably turn up the air pressure a little bit.
Yep. I think I also had some sort of surface contamination, because the other side looks a lot better with the same settings.

And this wasn't primer, this was the top coat (I'll have to look at the can to get the brand), which I shot with my old gun. New gun and regulator should arrive tomorrow, both of which I think will help a fair amount.

The primer that went off early is not Summit Racing. It's something else. It sands down beautifully, though, when it's not ruining everything it comes in contact with.
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chandlerman wrote:
Yep. I think I also had some sort of surface contamination, because the other side looks a lot better with the same settings.

And this wasn't primer, this was the top coat (I'll have to look at the can to get the brand), which I shot with my old gun. New gun and regulator should arrive tomorrow, both of which I think will help a fair amount.

The primer that went off early is not Summit Racing. It's something else. It sands down beautifully, though, when it's not ruining everything it comes in contact with.
I'd just make sure to use a grease and wax remove to clean the body. It will be either a water based or solvent based, depending upon what the paint PI data sheet specs out. Don't clean mineral spirits, acetone, or lacquer thinner. I'd also use only lacquer thinner for cleaning my gun. Also make sure you're using the correct reducer in the primer and paint (probably a urethane reducer?).
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Be aware of using water based degreaser in cooler temps. If the water doesn't evaporate fully before shooting paint you can have adhesion issues. This is why I never use water based.
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Making forward progress... even with some occasional horizontal steps.
(AND, no kersplosions! Good on ya.)
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Lucky
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Lucky
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Birdsnest wrote:
Making forward progress... even with some occasional horizontal steps.
(AND, no kersplosions! Good on ya.)
Just give it time Razz emoticon

Got a look at the color in sunlight this morning and...I just don't know...

I like it better in the sunny picture than I did in IRL, which I can't explain, but like it best in the shade. It'd be hard to only ride in the shade, though.

Now I'm wondering if it would be too weird to just continue the Summer of Citrus and paint it the same orange as the VBB. I have almost a full quart of orange, plus reducer and hardener, so it would not only not cost me anything, but would get a couple cans out of the workshop.

What's the wisdom of the crowd say?
Sunny side up
Sunny side up
What it does in the shadows
What it does in the shadows
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I like it. Reminds me of Boo Berry cereal. (If ya know ya know.)

Will look good. I'd rock that shit.
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Lucky
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Lucky
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Birdsnest wrote:
I like it. Reminds me of Boo Berry cereal. (If ya know ya know.)

Will look good. I'd rock that shit.
Loved me some Boo Berry back in the day, but on the rare occasion we got sugary cereal, it was Apple Jacks or some Cap'n Crunch variant every time.
@birdsnest avatar
UTC

Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VMA VSX - o9c vbc vmb
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8262
Location: Hustletown, TX
 
Not So Moderator
@birdsnest avatar
VNB VSC VMA VSX - o9c vbc vmb
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8262
Location: Hustletown, TX
UTC quote
chandlerman wrote:
it was Apple Jacks or some Cap'n Crunch variant every time.
The roof of my mouth hurts as I read that sentence.

I am also salivating.

.. and now I want some Sugar Smacks!
@orwell84 avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3140
Location: northern New York
 
Ossessionato
@orwell84 avatar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3140
Location: northern New York
UTC quote
It looks like your gun just suddenly started spraying chunks…like it's clogging, your air pressure dropping or the paint kicking off way early.

I would tear your gun apart and clean every bit with orange stripper. Fiddle with the paint and gun, try reducing until you're happy with how it's flowing. Is it really damp/humid there?
@bajarob avatar
UTC

Addicted
1961 VS5T, 1981 P200E, Rigid Frame Chopper, 2001 Harley FXDXT
Joined: UTC
Posts: 842
Location: Ventura, CA
 
Addicted
@bajarob avatar
1961 VS5T, 1981 P200E, Rigid Frame Chopper, 2001 Harley FXDXT
Joined: UTC
Posts: 842
Location: Ventura, CA
UTC quote
I like the color changing effect of your paint. The mudguard looks like contamination to me.
OP
@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9839
Location: Nashville

48 Days Since Last Explosion
 
Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9839
Location: Nashville

48 Days Since Last Explosion
UTC quote
orwell84 wrote:
It looks like your gun just suddenly started spraying chunks…like it's clogging, your air pressure dropping or the paint kicking off way early.

I would tear your gun apart and clean every bit with orange stripper. Fiddle with the paint and gun, try reducing until you're happy with how it's flowing. Is it really damp/humid there?
Yes or probably Yes to everything but the paint kicking off too early. That gun has sprayed its last spray and had a terrible regulator besides; it was pouring rain last night; and my air pressure is always dropping a little because I only have a little pancake compressor.
@qascooter avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4263
Location: Florence, OR
 
Ossessionato
@qascooter avatar
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4263
Location: Florence, OR
UTC quote
That blue looks good, but only because you have an orange scooter already 😃
@orwell84 avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3140
Location: northern New York
 
Ossessionato
@orwell84 avatar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3140
Location: northern New York
UTC quote
chandlerman wrote:
Yes or probably Yes to everything but the paint kicking off too early. That gun has sprayed its last spray and had a terrible regulator besides; it was pouring rain last night; and my air pressure is always dropping a little because I only have a little pancake compressor.
My last rounds of painting were done with a pancake compressor and a HF touch up gun (the little purple gun). It worked the absolute best out of everything I tried. Big gun+bigger compressor=too much paint output to keep under control, for me anyway.

Those guns are so cheap. Use it a coupla times and strip it for parts for the next new shitty gun. It would keep the party going and get it done.
@ginch avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8676
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@ginch avatar
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8676
Location: Victoria, Australia
UTC quote
chandlerman wrote:
...and paint it the same orange as the VBB.
Is it only me that is thinking velcro number plates?
OP
@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9839
Location: Nashville

48 Days Since Last Explosion
 
Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9839
Location: Nashville

48 Days Since Last Explosion
UTC quote
Ginch wrote:
Is it only me that is thinking velcro number plates?
No need here in the wilds of Tennessee. I rode the VBB for about a year with no plate at all. Literally had cops behind me in traffic and not a peep.

I mostly have them plated so I can insure them.
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