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@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: UTC
Posts: 12106
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
UTC quote
Not a good report from last weeks' ride. A half dozen of us met in the Driftless area of SW Wisconsin for our annual Wisconscoot. It's chosen for its landscape including twisty, hilly roads, occasionally with gravel surfaces. I get razzed a lot for the gravel we've mostly unintentionally encountered over the years, but at least these days it's easier to find out what you're going to ride on in advance. Anyway, on Friday we're riding a Town road that had been chip sealed. Most of the surface was solid, but there were still areas on the road, particularly between tire tracks that have some residual loose pea gravel. I remember going downhill through a slight curve, but only seeing a flag in front of someone's house...the road seemed innocuous enough to look around... About a half mile down the road all the bikes in my rear view mirror had disappeared. It always seems that the moment I stop glancing back every 154 seconds something happens. Turns out the couple of guys behind me tried to alert me but I couldn't hear their horns between the distance and ear plugs. I circled back to find everyone off their parked scooters, except for the motorcyle lying in the road with a bit of debris around it, and our own MVer, CubsKing lying on the shoulder. I don't think he'd lost consciousness, but was clearly dazed. Not sure who called it in, because one of our guys had said there was no cell signal, but fortunately he'd crashed right in front of someone's house who had some connection. Waiting for emergency personnel in the boonies isn't fun. First responders show up, secure the scene and check on our guy, maybe 15 minutes later a county cop shows up. Interestingly we'd caught each other's attention at the beginning of the ride when passing each other along the Mississippi. Ambulance shows, load Mark up and we're done there. Bike was store for the moment in the shed at the residence there.

Gave up the route as it was almost over anyway and made a beeline back to our place, where we could call his parents, who drove up to get him out of the hospital.

For the moment, looks like we have a chipped tooth, broken thumb and cuts and contusions to the lip. No concussion, interestingly. Had amnesia of the accident though. Overall, he's beat up but will recover well. I think it's got to be hugely demoralizing, When you're a good rider and have lots of miles behind you, I think you feel you're more immune from "accidents" and even if you are, situations are out there lurking for you.

From the time of the accident until now, it's still on my mind....no one felt like speed was excessive. There was no recollection of braking or more aggressive turning, but the amnesia doesn't help. Someone noted wear on the front tire, but it wasn't bad when I looked at it. I'm not sure how much of a factor that could be anyway. So ultimately, it's not clear that he did anything wrong, just bad luck, I guess. What one would like to do in this situation is learn from it and not take the same risks, but that's probably impossible. Gravel is particularly treacherous, particularly if you don't see it coming.
@daleb avatar
UTC

Hooked
'55 VL1
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Location: Omaha, NE
 
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@daleb avatar
'55 VL1
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Location: Omaha, NE
UTC quote
Glad to hear that there's no life-threatening or crippling injury. Never good to be driving on marbles. Was he wearing a helmet? Assuming if he was that it wasn't full face.
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@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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Posts: 12106
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
UTC quote
DaleB wrote:
Glad to hear that there's no life-threatening or crippling injury. Never good to be driving on marbles. Was he wearing a helmet? Assuming if he was that it wasn't full face.
I'd intended to cover that, but overlooked it....He was wearing a modular. Was pretty sure it was locked in, but I have a hard time matching up the facial injuries with an intact chin bar. I'd suggested one of us volunteer to research my smacking our faces against a wall with our helmets, but no volunteers. Maybe I should bring one of my old ones to the next group ride. Razz emoticon

So anyway, that's just one more variable....
@jkj-fz6 avatar
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BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
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@jkj-fz6 avatar
BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
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Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
UTC quote
I was sorry to hear about Mark. Hoping he recovers quickly.
fledermaus wrote:
From the time of the accident until now, it's still on my mind....no one felt like speed was excessive.
Do you remember slowing down for the gravel when you encountered it?
fledermaus wrote:
Gravel is particularly treacherous, particularly if you don't see it coming.
Especially pea gravel. That's what caused my wreck with my Vino when I broke my ankle. Just a spot of pea gravel.
@jkj-fz6 avatar
UTC

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BV400, Primavera 150, Yamaha Zuma 125
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@jkj-fz6 avatar
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UTC quote
DaleB wrote:
Glad to hear that there's no life-threatening or crippling injury. Never good to be driving on marbles. Was he wearing a helmet? Assuming if he was that it wasn't full face.
Mark is one to wear Toreador Pants. I'm sure what he had saved him from more serious injuries.
@motovista avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
GT 2.4
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@motovista avatar
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UTC quote
Was he riding his Indian? I think they have the combined braking system, which applies braking to both wheels.
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@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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UTC quote
Motovista wrote:
Was he riding his Indian? I think they have the combined braking system, which applies braking to both wheels.
No, he had his 400-ishcc motorcycle that he usually brings up. Combined braking is nice, but I'd be skittish about using any brakes in that situation unless absolutely needed.


Kraig: Yes geared up as usual. I think I overheard some comments about tearing up his jacket a bit in the slide. He got his money's worth this time.
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Location: Tega Cay, SC
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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UTC quote
fledermaus wrote:
I'd intended to cover that, but overlooked it....He was wearing a modular. Was pretty sure it was locked in, but I have a hard time matching up the facial injuries with an intact chin bar. I'd suggested one of us volunteer to research my smacking our faces against a wall with our helmets, but no volunteers. Maybe I should bring one of my old ones to the next group ride. Razz emoticon

So anyway, that's just one more variable....
Not really, just look at the helmet he was wearing and see where the abrasions are. This still sucks. Riding a motorcycle on gravel is a little dicey but much better than a scooter. With the ability to get up on the pegs, and steer with the knees and feet makes such a difference. Sitting down slows down the way the scoot want to go which makes most people tighten up on the bars setting up a worse situation. At that point it's easy to dump the scoot. I'm glad his injuries are not worse than they are.
@old_as_dirt avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 GTS
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@old_as_dirt avatar
2007 GTS
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UTC quote
thanks for posting on Cubsking. I will reach out to his parents,
@old_as_dirt avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 GTS
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Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
 
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@old_as_dirt avatar
2007 GTS
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UTC quote
just got off the phone with Mark, he is doing good. he has surgery tomorrow for his thumb that is requiring a plate at the base and some wire to hold it . Ortho say 75 min surgery. he did have the chin bar down on his brand new shark helmet and it took a good face beating so time for another new lid. his chipped tooth is scheduled for next week probably a minor filing and polish.

The honda faired pretty well , bent rear brake foot lever, 1 mirror, 1 turn signal, and some scratched up crash bars. Its at the honda dealer and they are going thru it inspection wise.

his gear saved him from worse road rash for sure.
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@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
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@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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UTC quote
old as dirt wrote:
just got off the phone with Mark...
Thanks for checking. I was holding off, figuring he wouldn't have news yet. Sounds like a busy day.

I'd picked up some of that debris, but never tried to figure out where it came from. One of the guys rode the bike back to our place and said the rear brake wasn't working. No surprise there.
@motovista avatar
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@motovista avatar
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UTC quote
fledermaus wrote:
Combined braking is nice, but I'd be skittish about using any brakes in that situation unless absolutely needed.


The issue with combined braking is that you don't get to pick whether or not the front brake engages. In dirt or gravel, you are usually better off using more rear brake and feathering the front brake.
@steelbytes avatar
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2019 GTS300 Supertech E3 60,000km
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@steelbytes avatar
2019 GTS300 Supertech E3 60,000km
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UTC quote
Motovista wrote:
In dirt or gravel, you are usually better off using more rear brake and feathering the front brake.
Yup, that's exactly what I've found with all the bad roads I do. But what ever the brakes, gravel takes lots of practice to get good
@madison_sully avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
@madison_sully avatar
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
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UTC quote
SteelBytes wrote:
Yup, that's exactly what I've found with all the bad roads I do. But what ever the brakes, gravel takes lots of practice to get good
Over the years, Wisconscoot has provided, well, some level of practice. To those who have attended over the years....
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@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: UTC
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Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
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UTC quote
Madison Sully wrote:
Over the years, Wisconscoot has provided, well, some level of practice. To those who have attended over the years....
Okay, true that, but for the record my wife was the first casualty.
@crazycarl avatar
UTC

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2007 250 GTS, 1980 P200E, 2010 ThunderFly 190 (SOLD) 2015 Yamaha SMax (SOLD)
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@crazycarl avatar
2007 250 GTS, 1980 P200E, 2010 ThunderFly 190 (SOLD) 2015 Yamaha SMax (SOLD)
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UTC quote
That's just a tough break unfortunately. Gravel on top of pavement is usually quite unforgiving. You're riding along and then in less than a blink of an eye, you're on the pavement.

His recollection of the crash might come back in the future, but there likely won't be much to takeaway as learning. Whenever you're on a wonky surface, you have to be super-focused and take it easy - and even then it might not be enough.

Here's hoping he has a full and fast recovery. Thumb injuries can be tricky, I know 1st hand (no pun intended).
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@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: UTC
Posts: 12106
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: UTC
Posts: 12106
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
UTC quote
CrazyCarl wrote:
That's just a tough break unfortunately.

Here's hoping he has a full and fast recovery. Thumb injuries can be tricky, I know 1st hand (no pun intended).
You're right...its such a thin envelope that the slightest thing going wrong can put you on the ground. Having said that, I've managed to stay up on gravel with my bike, little motorcycle and scooter for the past 50 years. I've had both good luck I'm sure. I've had back luck with wet hayfields though. Jamming a clutch lever into your thigh is a memorable experience.

Good pun, Karl. I bet you're good with dad jokes! Razz emoticon Laughing emoticon
@fleece avatar
UTC

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1991 Vespa T5 Pole Position, 2008 Vespa S 125, 2023 Piaggio MP3 300HPE Sport
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@fleece avatar
1991 Vespa T5 Pole Position, 2008 Vespa S 125, 2023 Piaggio MP3 300HPE Sport
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UTC quote
old as dirt wrote:
he did have the chin bar down on his brand new shark helmet and it took a good face beating so time for another new lid. his chipped tooth is scheduled for next week probably a minor filing and polish
good job he had a chin bar so this isn't meant in the literal sense
OP
@fledermaus avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: UTC
Posts: 12106
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@fledermaus avatar
2007 LX150 2015 GTS (on the bench) 2017 BV 350
Joined: UTC
Posts: 12106
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
UTC quote
fleece wrote:
good job he had a chin bar so this isn't meant in the literal sense
Actually his face took a fairly good beating. There was a fair amount of blood and a bunch of swelling on his lip. Kind of like going extra rounds with Sonny Liston. I'm kind of surprised he didn't have worse facial/dental injuries. It's why I questioned whether the chin bar was even in place. I'm kind of curious if that's a typical result of hitting pavement with your helmet face first....
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