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What is it? Do I need this thing?
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V oodoo
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'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
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V oodoo
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'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
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I was going thru Mercado picking out parts for my Bajaj/LML project. Looking to see if they might have a suitable rectifier to charge my battery if I decide add that later.

I spotted this mysterious small red electrical box and knew I'd seen one before in my electrical stash. I found it and recalled it was with the LML motor I bought about ten years ago from a guy that pulled it from his almost new Stella to put in n a P200 motor. He threw in all the random loose stuff he pulled including the starter solenoid, this and some other junk. My starter seems to be working just fine without it.
Here's the one at Mercado and zero information given other than "Starter Protector Device", not even the usual which bikes it is for
Here's the one at Mercado and zero information given other than "Starter Protector Device", not even the usual which bikes it is for
Here's mine, looks very similar, both w/4 wires but not identical - different connectors and wire colors
Here's mine, looks very similar, both w/4 wires but not identical - different connectors and wire colors
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MJRally
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MJRally
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73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 06 PX150, 59 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special, 90 V5N 50, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Is that the starter interlock thing? Whatever device that requires the brake lever pulled before the starter relay gets voltage?
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V oodoo
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'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
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V oodoo
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'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
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UTC quote
You may be right, with 4 wires maybe gets a signal from the brake light switch, unlike Vespas. I recently got a PX200 in Greece back on the road and had to fix the starter motor and troubleshoot its circuit. I discovered that it's the clutch you must pull in before the starter button will work. Kinda nice coz you can start it on a hill in first gear - let out the clutch and off you go. That's how I setup the Bajaj so I likely don't need this four wire electronic majik plastic box now, but Mercado's description got me curious. More here: Bajaj LML 🇮🇳 hybrid w/ autolube & electric start


External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
Motorcycle brake switch provides last leg to ground for starter solenoid when clutch is pulled and starter button pressed.
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SaFiS
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1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1987 PK125XL Elestart, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
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SaFiS
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1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1987 PK125XL Elestart, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
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UTC quote
Interlock relay. On PXs you need to pull the clutch in before it lets you engage the starter. You can cancel it, you just need to bridge two wires behind the horn cover…
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V oodoo
UTC
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'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
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V oodoo
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'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
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UTC quote
I found an old thread that explained it well. It's to keep you from engaging the starter when the engine is running. It is in the chain that includes the clutch switch and solenoid needs both to be happy before starter will work, so one more smart layer of safety I want to add to this build.
blackbart wrote:
This may not be received very well by purists and safety advocates.

I dislike clutch permissive switches on all types of manual shift vehicles. I disable them. It's a personal choice. I might be less apt to disable it when you have a back-up kick start.

If this is your wiring set-up, you could ground the pink wire from the start relay by the battery, and it should start without having to use the clutch. By using a jumper with the proper connectors, you can do it without cutting or splicing wires. Or do it until you have it apart for some other reason and then fix it.

It appears the starter protection relay is there to prevent you from grinding on the starter while the engine is running. Note to self: Don't try to start an engine that's already running.

Ground the pink wire at the starter protection relay under the horncast, and you will still have that safety. Stuff's gotta come off any way you do it.

http://www.allstyles-scooters.com/EStart_Circ.htm
That's the gist of it from this lenghty 13 year old thread. I'll be studying the circuit diagrams referenced here.
Clutch Engagement Switch Replacement on a 2005 PX
Tierney
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Tierney
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UTC quote
On newer motorcycles, it is a safety feature and makes some sense, much like the kickstand cut out switch. But on an older scooter I would eliminate it. The Stellas had many of these safety features that were probably required by the US DOT at the time. If I ever get another Stella, I plan on ripping out the whole wiring system as the last one was enough of an electrical nightmare that it made the Vespa system look like the golden standard.
whodatschrome
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parallelogramerist
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whodatschrome
parallelogramerist
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UTC quote
V oodoo wrote:
You may be right, with 4 wires maybe gets a signal from the brake light switch, unlike Vespas. I recently got a PX200 in Greece back on the road and had to fix the starter motor and troubleshoot its circuit. I discovered that it's the clutch you must pull in before the starter button will work. Kinda nice coz you can start it on a hill in first gear - let out the clutch and off you go. That's how I setup the Bajaj so I likely don't need this four wire electronic majik plastic box now, but Mercado's description got me curious. More here: Bajaj LML 🇮🇳 hybrid w/ autolube & electric start


External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
Motorcycle brake switch provides last leg to ground for starter solenoid when clutch is pulled and starter button pressed.
Are you looking for a Piaggo version? If so, i might still have a couple that i removed from my 2005 PX150? I either kept them or threw them away, i'd just have to start searching in my shop to see if they're still there. You would also nee the tiny switch (and wires) that are located inside the headset that connect to the interlock box. It's just a simple spring loaded plunger switch that the clutch lever depresses.
OP
@v_oodoo avatar
V oodoo
UTC
Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9845
Location: seattle/athens
 
V oodoo
Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 '72 DanMotor Super150 and '04 Bajaj LML hybrid
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9845
Location: seattle/athens
UTC quote
Now that I know what it is supposed to do and think I know what the circuit inside probably looks like, I will test it assuming it is a solid state version of a single pole, normally closed relay - it lets the juice thru unless it's been 'activated' by voltage from a running motor. If so, should be easy to add to what I have.
I made a ruff draft of the schematic as I made it one circuit at a time. I'll send you a dollar if you can figure it out and draw it up properly. I will test it all, then make a decent copy myself if I have to and include it w/ the registration.
I made a ruff draft of the schematic as I made it one circuit at a time. I'll send you a dollar if you can figure it out and draw it up properly. I will test it all, then make a decent copy myself if I have to and include it w/ the registration.
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