Modern Vespa

Ok, rats are pretty much the ultimate survivalists among mammals so I get the indiscriminate use of the words for unrestored NSMs.

Still, for mé there is a definite distinction:

- ´Rat´ can basically be any vintage. Definition being showing honourable proof of a useful life. Like minor scratch ´n dent scruffy but mechanically up to snuff.

- ´Survivor´ has to have age. Like at léast pre Euro 3 preferrably pre 1990 or what. Again showing the use and being mechanically sound. The difference with ´rat´ being the patina only áge can add.

Is this just mé???

Only interesting things are pre-euro whatever

Of my; and now we heve ´interesting´ troubling the waters
I would have to seriously ponder about that water shed for mé.

Back to my two

The Vespa PX models are all NSM no?! and yet they go up to 2017 in the EU and the PX150 is still being sold in several parts of the world.

See my ´thing´?!
A say 2015 PX125/150 is definitely NSM, can very much be ´rat´ but ´survivor´ no way imo.

I have one of each, then!

The PE certainly looks both in one No, seriously, stop rust, conserve and enjoy.

The ET3 dunno; looks more like very well preserved Any ´sabi´?

That's the plan! 'Sabi'?

Look up the Japanese concept of ´wabi sabi´. The second part applies

Ah - gotcha! 👍🏻

I've tried wasabi

What is the definition of Speedy?
It's NEVER won anything at a Rally, as doesn't fit into either field, but has aspects of both.

I'll muddy the waters further...to me, a Rat is a bike which is aesthetically original/weathered/shitted out, but *mechanically sound*.

Because at that point, there has been an explicit decision to not improve the appearance, despite putting real effort (and often, serious tuning) into the bike.

Bikes which are both worn looking and worn mechanically are just beaters.

Not agree that you muddy. You ádd a distinction, so clear up.

Rat for me included mechanically up to snuff and was thus omitting the not up to snuff; you have named those

Over here ´we´ try to avoid class devisions. It hardly even goes beyond oldest or best restored. Most original is already opening a can of worms.
To avoid the finer points, there sometimes is ´most interesting´ so all worm cans are guaranteed open

Thanks!

As opposed to, of course, the missing quadrant of our chart, bikes that look pretty, but are mechanically garbage: Bodges.

LOVE IT!!!! Both and Spot on NSM Vespas

Soooo.... Speedy is officially ..... a "Bodge Beater".

I can accept that

I just realized that I really screwed up my chart, so I re-made it. Because I'm OCD like that.

I was confused chandlerman, but your revision sorts it out.

10~15 years ago, a resto-mod would be located high up in the upper right quadrant. Thanks to youtube videos, i would now place most resto-mods right down next to bodge. A resto-mod used to be a VERY high end build utilizing only high end modern components, body, and paint work. It's now their kinda the opposite of that at an ultra low-def 240p~360P.

To me, what you're describing may or may not be a resto-mod. If it's a well-intended effort that just has half-assed results, I'd say it's still a resto-mod, it's just not a good one.

If it's knowingly half-assed to flip, that's a bodge, it's just a...I don't know...resto-bodge?

If you can give it a name, I'm happy to update the chart

There is a whole quadrant of quality/appearance spread for ´resto mod´. Does not need to be show perfect nor high end mechanical to be a good looking well put together reliable tech upgrade.
Same thing ´rat´. Maybe that is a bit more critical on the quality line as the even the appearance, the patina preservation is more susceptible to sloppy work.

And knowingly half assed to flip yes thát crossed the line towards bodgery.

I totally agree with you.

All of these categories have huge spread on both appearance and reliability.

So long as they meet the owner's goals, I'm happy for them.

a sidestep from Roland´s P200 thread about the license plate is that thesse have a lót of impact on the appearance. Modern homologated model plates as well as newly made vintage models look imo out of place on all NSM.
Also think pristine newly remade vintage models out of place on anything but nigh pristine scoots.
The horizontal, appearance, water shed in the table for me lies significantly higher for the plates.
It seems that the vintage number/plate in my mind is súch hard proof of age that looking new belies it.
As such I have the original battered plate on my pristine looking P200E.

Half a century plus old scoots often had the license number on the front mud guard cheeeks. Not sure about the cut off for those but it was even mandatory at some point.
This has even greater impact on the appearance. Imo they just do not look right on any restored model, only on beaters/rats and thus scruffy themself.

As I am harping on modern clasing with NSM, I want to mention tyres.
Now I am the first to strees that the rubber is the only interface between vehicle and road; crucial!
Howevvah.... it jars even more than a new homologated plate to see modern size/profile tyres on anything but an obviously speed tuned NSM.
I myself have softish compound Mitas MC20 on the NSM. Modern but lóóking period.

And then mirrors.... arrggghhh I get tired with myself