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Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
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Molto Verboso
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<edit> Changed title.

I lost my belt this morning 11265 miles! Crying or Very sad emoticon

I've had a new one, and new rollers, for some time now but have been lazily putting it off.

I haven't bought the proper tools for the replacement yet either.

The weather has been so nice lately, I've just been twisting and going.

So on my way into work this morning, I am going WOT with very little traffic due to the MLK holiday.

As I pass the 60 FWY, I lost all power to the rear wheel, and the motor was still running.

I new immediately what had happened; I am glad that the rear wheel didn't lock up on me, as I've read happen to others on this board.

I coasted past the FWY on ramp, and only had to push it a few yards before making it to an area where I could have my son come with the truck, and pull over with enough room to load her into the back.

I called my son, and he was there with my truck in a bout 20 minutes. Fortunately I only commute about 15 miles, one way.

He dropped me off at the office, and I will get a ride home from someone here.

I'll take pics, as I go through the repair, and post, later.

I need to put the tools on order too. Unfortunately Max is not open today, Monday.
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 2 times
@judy avatar
UTC

World Traveler
2007 LX150 Daring Plum Leonardo Da Vespa
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UTC quote
Hope you get her up and running soon. We need to speak to max about having days off Razz emoticon
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Gobshite Shiva
Kymco Downtown 300i the 'Dolphin Noise'
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UTC quote
eeek! i bet that was a bit scary. sounds like it all worked out okay for you though. 8)
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Molto Verboso
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Ok,

I finished replacing the belt and rollers, and will now attempt to report on it.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
Max didn't have any clutch holding tools in stock so I made one.

Here are the details: GT200 / GTS 250 Clutch Holding Tool.

And here is a much simpler one, that I don't see why it would not work: Homemade clutch holding tool
Made from two bolts, and some sort of construction washer.
Made from two bolts, and some sort of construction washer.
On the scoot.
On the scoot.
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 2 times
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Molto Verboso
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Removed the trans cover after removing the clutch nut and washer.
Used torque wrench to remove clutch nut and washer
Used torque wrench to remove clutch nut and washer
Removed intake filter.
Removed intake filter.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Invaluable tool after many years of motocycle maintenance, a torque driver.
Invaluable tool after many years of motocycle maintenance, a torque driver.
The front screw has a ground wire attached.
The front screw has a ground wire attached.
Disintegrated belt, once cover was removed.
Disintegrated belt, once cover was removed.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Note how I placed the screws on the ground in the order of removal.
I then placed each one back into it’s respective hole in the cover since I would need to come back another day.
The screws turned out to be the same size all around, but I do this in case
Note how I placed the screws on the ground in the order of removal. I then placed each one back into it’s respective hole in the cover since I would need to come back another day. The screws turned out to be the same size all around, but I do this in case
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
Oh, buy the way, Moped, I tried your trick of just rotating the air filter forward by leaving the forward screw in place, but found that I had to remove the front screw as well in order for the housing to clear for removal.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
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Molto Verboso
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Someone other than Max filled my order, and sent me the variator tool for the GTS instead of the GT.

I called, and spoke with Max.

He had me send it back and he sent the correct one in parallel.
Housing off, annd clutch removed with most of the debris removed.
Housing off, annd clutch removed with most of the debris removed.
GTS Variator tool
(Wrong tool for GT200)
GTS Variator tool (Wrong tool for GT200)
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
When I recieved the correct tool, I new it needed a mod to be used on the GT vs. the LX, but didn't know where.

These pics show the mod and where.

I made the mod in our model shop at work.
No tool in place. Tool mounts in these two holes. A pin goes into the upper counter bore.
No tool in place. Tool mounts in these two holes. A pin goes into the upper counter bore.
Red line shows direction of mod.
Red line shows direction of mod.
You can see the misaligned hole, and where clearance is needed. The pin is inserted into the upper counterbore.
You can see the misaligned hole, and where clearance is needed. The pin is inserted into the upper counterbore.
Close up.
Close up.
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Molto Verboso
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Modified tool.
Front side.
Front side.
Back side. Sorry for the poor focus.
I took the slot up to the wall of the cylindrical feature on the back side.
Back side. Sorry for the poor focus. I took the slot up to the wall of the cylindrical feature on the back side.
Tool in place using one of the housing screws to mount it.
Tool in place using one of the housing screws to mount it.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
I've run out of lunch time, so I'll pick back up later.
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Ossessionato
07 GTS250(RIP), 13 GTS300, Several Lambrettas
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UTC quote
Was that a stock belt or an aftermarket?
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
That was the original stock belt.

I should have replaced it long ago.

I had the new one in the garage, but procrastinated.
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UTC quote
its a bad thing to happen when your 300 miles away from home.... luckily mine snapped outside a dealer 8)

good luck on getting her going again.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
suit scoot wrote:
its a bad thing to happen when your 300 miles away from home.... luckily mine snapped outside a dealer 8)

good luck on getting her going again.
Thanks, she is goin' again.

I rode her into work this morning.

I was just reporting on the replacement of the belt, and will finish the report later.
@moto-scoot avatar
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Member
Typhoon 50, Vespa GL, ET3, Rally 200, & GTS, Gilera Runner 180, KTM 525, Suzuki DRZ400, Buell XB12X, Honda Ruckus, Honda CB400F
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UTC quote
Whenever you snap a belt, I would recommend taking the driven pulley apart, to verify the pins have plenty of grease and are not worn. Sometimes the belt snaps because the driven pulley binds up.

Here is a dirty trick to hold the drive pulley on ET4, LX150 and GT200s: wedge a #4 Philip's screw driver between the starter sprocket(very large) and the engine case at the 5 o'clock position. I would never do this on a customers bike since I have the factory tools, but at home I have used this trick on my own scooters. Also the drive pulley center nut should be replaced every time it is removed, if you don't have a replacement use red lock tite on the threads. It is not pretty when that nut comes loose.
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Molto Verboso
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moto-scoot wrote:
Also the drive pulley center nut should be replaced every time it is removed, if you don't have a replacement use red lock tite on the threads. It is not pretty when that nut comes loose.
Now you tell me.

It was mentioned in this thread that it was ok to re-use the nut, so I did: Variator & Belt change - Pictures from MV workshop

And no loctite was mentioned.
moto-scoot wrote:
Whenever you snap a belt, I would recommend taking the driven pulley apart, to verify the pins have plenty of grease and are not worn. Sometimes the belt snaps because the driven pulley binds up.
I think mine snapped because I was pushing the smilage.
@moto-scoot avatar
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UTC quote
11k miles is quite a long time for one belt, I have seen a few snap before 6k miles.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
moto-scoot wrote:
11k miles is quite a long time for one belt, I have seen a few snap before 6k miles.
I know...
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Addicted
06 GT200(black graphite)
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UTC quote
I have a new belt and rollers sitting on top of my toolbox right now, have been for awhile now. Just hit 7k and almost all of my mileage is at highway speed. After seeing your post I WILL be doing some maintenance this weekend.
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UTC quote
Variator half pulley removal.
The manual said to replace the nut, but I didn't. Others said they were not too concerned. I will get a new nut next time, and I would have used the loctite, had I known.
The manual said to replace the nut, but I didn't. Others said they were not too concerned. I will get a new nut next time, and I would have used the loctite, had I known.
It has an integral spring washer.
It has an integral spring washer.
The starter engagement gear slid off with a small amount of effort.
I had to remove the oil filler cap for clearance.
The starter engagement gear slid off with a small amount of effort. I had to remove the oil filler cap for clearance.
Outer variator pulley next.
Outer variator pulley next.
Rather grungy. Needs cleaning with brake cleaner.
Rather grungy. Needs cleaning with brake cleaner.
More debris.
Note the washer.
More debris. Note the washer.
Debris removed. Washer still in place.
Debris removed. Washer still in place.
Washer removed.
Bushing visible.
Washer removed. Bushing visible.
Back of inner half pulley with rollers in place.
Back of inner half pulley with rollers in place.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
The little yellow things were a little tricky to re-assemble.

They have a specific purpose, and I'll explain with the re-assembly.
Inner half pulley removed, bushing still in place.
Note the orientation of the little yellow things.
Inner half pulley removed, bushing still in place. Note the orientation of the little yellow things.
Bushing removed.
You can see where the rollers engage and wear on the conical plate.
Bushing removed. You can see where the rollers engage and wear on the conical plate.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
Several views of the driven pulley assy.

<edit> I've figured out how to make the pics a little bigger.
Needs cleaning.
Needs cleaning.
Clutch pads visible.
Clutch pads visible.
Note the spring between the clutch and the outer driven half pulley.
Note the spring between the clutch and the outer driven half pulley.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
Some shots of the rollers in the inner variator half pulley.
At the 12 o'clock position, the metalic side of the roller is to the right.
At the 12 o'clock position, the metalic side of the roller is to the right.
Blurry shot of the metal side.
Blurry shot of the metal side.
Other, plastic coated side of the same roller.
Other, plastic coated side of the same roller.
Flat spots were worn into the rollers.
Some were worse than others.
Some not too bad.
Flat spots were worn into the rollers. Some were worse than others. Some not too bad.
Rollers removed.
Rollers removed.
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Molto Verboso
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UTC quote
Cleanup!

I used brake cleaner, and green scotchbright pad, as recommended in Michael Moore's thread.
There was a ring that was particularly difficult to clean.
I do most of my riding commuting on the freeway, WOT, so I think the belt rides high on the driving pulley
There was a ring that was particularly difficult to clean. I do most of my riding commuting on the freeway, WOT, so I think the belt rides high on the driving pulley
This is as best that I cleaned it.
This is as best that I cleaned it.
Eeeeew!
Eeeeew!
Cut a small piece of scotchbright pad that fit the roller slots.
Cut a small piece of scotchbright pad that fit the roller slots.
Shiney!
Shiney!
Driven pulley assy.
I hit the two half pullies, as well as the clutch pads.
Driven pulley assy. I hit the two half pullies, as well as the clutch pads.
Pretty shiney things.
Pretty shiney things.
Cleaned inside the housing.
I was still pulling debris out as I was assembling.
Cleaned inside the housing. I was still pulling debris out as I was assembling.
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MV Saint
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UTC quote
Salty, What a great write-up and pics Keep them coming.

This is the MV i like Clap emoticon Clap emoticon

Cheers
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Hooked
some scooters & a bonnie black
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UTC quote
GT owner here.

My hat's off - great post!
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Vespa GT 200
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UTC quote
+1 on the great posts. A fellow GT owner as well , I really appreciate your efforts in posting the whole process. And pics too, even better! Can't wait to see the thrilling conclusion.

I really get a kick out of the friendly back and forth of the Royal Bastards and others, but this detailed technical tutorial stuff is the real reason that I rarely miss a day without checking the MV posts.

Best regards, Big Jim
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UTC quote
Thanks, guys.

I agree, this forum is great for the tech stuff, and I'm just tryin' to do my part.

Following Michael Moore's thread really helped me. Variator & Belt change - Pictures from MV workshop

I just wanted to get the details of doing the GT. There are a few differences.
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On top of it all, while I was taking photos for this report, I am glad I was doing so.

I had to refer back to the photos to ensure re-assembly being correct. Whew emoticon
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
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2006 LX150 "Amadora"
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UTC quote
This has been a very nice thread to read! It almost makes me feel capable of tackling something similar on my LX. Thank you for your time and effort in putting it together! Clap emoticon
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Hooked
2007 Plum GT "Stephanie"
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UTC quote
Another BIG + for the step by step and great pictures----this will certainly make the job a lot easier when Stephanie gets to the point of needing a belt and a little internal cleaning. I think I will get the necessary parts before hand tho. Art
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UTC quote
Ok, re-assembly.
First get your best buddy, and a delicious beverage of choice.
First get your best buddy, and a delicious beverage of choice.
Rollers installed with metal side to right at the 12 o’clock position.
Rollers installed with metal side to right at the 12 o’clock position.
Follow suit around the clock.
Follow suit around the clock.
Assemble bushing on.
Assemble bushing on.
The yellow plastic things don’t want to stay in place very well.
The yellow plastic things don’t want to stay in place very well.
Sittin’ pretty.
Sittin’ pretty.
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UTC quote
Ok,

Here is a tricky part, and where I explain the yellow plastic things.

The yellow plastic things mate with the rectangular features shown.

So you have to get the inner half pulley, with the rollers in place, onto the shaft, and then onto the bushing.

Don't slide it on all the way yet.

The tricky part is getting it onto the bushing without the yellow things falling out of their slots, and then making certain that the rectangular feature is aligned with the yellow things.

It took a couple of tries but it was doable without too much aggravation.
Inner half pulley with rollers.
Inner half pulley with rollers.
Yellow plastic things mate with the rectangular features on the inner half pulley.
Still some debris to be removed.
Yellow plastic things mate with the rectangular features on the inner half pulley. Still some debris to be removed.
Y, voila!
Y, voila!
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UTC quote
<edit> Here is an important point to take note of before proceding to the next step. When you place the belt between the pulleys, be certain that when you hold it in place, you can read the printing on the top of the belt. If the printing is backward, or upside down, it is on backward. I made this mistake the first time, and had to pull it apart and correct it.

Now here is another tricky part.

Getting the half pulleys separated, and the belt pushed in to hold them apart.

This is where your best buddy come into play.

Though Kona was unable to help with his paws, he was there with moral support.

He also snuck in a couple of smooches while I was on the ground.

I inquired the help of Salty Dawn, and she did smashingly well.

I placed the driven pulley assy on the ground as shown.

With my thumbs, I pushed where indicated toward the ground, at the same time rotated against the spring, counter clockwise, while Dawn pressed the belt toward the center of the pulleys.

Once she pressed the belt in, it held the pulleys apart.

To ensure they stayed apart, I pinched the belt together as shown.

It did slip out, and I had to do it a second time, while I was assembling it onto the shaft, but it eventually worked out.
Place the assy on the ground, as shown.
You press on the lower pulley, toward the ground.
Place the assy on the ground, as shown. You press on the lower pulley, toward the ground.
Pinch the belt together, to prevent the belt from slipping out.
Pinch the belt together, to prevent the belt from slipping out.
Slide the whole shootin' match onto the spline, as shown.
Slide the whole shootin' match onto the spline, as shown.
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
@starreem avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
07 GTS250(RIP), 13 GTS300, Several Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 2804
Location: Raleigh, NC
 
Ossessionato
@starreem avatar
07 GTS250(RIP), 13 GTS300, Several Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 2804
Location: Raleigh, NC
UTC quote
Your tricky part is easier if you remove the backplate (with the three sliding bushings) of the variator, assemble it your hand, then push the assembly onto the crank. Then intall the sintered bearing (gudgeon pin), just make sure its all the way in.

Also it looks like you might have installed the belt backwards. Some have arrows, but the easiest way is you should be able to read the writing (not upsidedown) when it is on the scooter.
OP
@salty_dodd avatar
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Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
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Location: Riverside, CA, USA
 
Molto Verboso
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(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
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Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
UTC quote
starreem wrote:
Also it looks like you might have installed the belt backwards. Some have arrows, but the easiest way is you should be able to read the writing (not upsidedown) when it is on the scooter.
Shnickies!!!! I see what you mean.

I had read the correct orientation in another post somewhere, but did not remember to do so.

I wonder what the detriment of running it backward might be?
This pic shows the numbers being read backward.
This pic shows the numbers being read backward.
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
OP
@salty_dodd avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
 
Molto Verboso
@salty_dodd avatar
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
UTC quote
starreem wrote:
Your tricky part is easier if you remove the backplate (with the three sliding bushings) of the variator, assemble it your hand, then push the assembly onto the crank. Then intall the sintered bearing (gudgeon pin), just make sure its all the way in.
And I follow you on this statement, as well.

I didn't pull the backplate off. What you say makes sense.
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@salty_dodd avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
 
Molto Verboso
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(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
UTC quote
Well, I'll continue with the finishing of the assembly procedure.

This is where I was glad to have been able to go back to the pics.

I could not remember where the washer goes onto the driving pulley assy. It goes between the two half pulleys.
Washer assembled onto the driving pulley assy.
Washer assembled onto the driving pulley assy.
Another shot showing the printing going in the wrong direction.
With the washeer assembled onto the driving pulley assy.
Another shot showing the printing going in the wrong direction. With the washeer assembled onto the driving pulley assy.
Then the outer half pulley.
Then the outer half pulley.
It has an o-ring on the outer circumference.
Possibly for air flow across the fins.
It has an o-ring on the outer circumference. Possibly for air flow across the fins.
Then the starter motor engagement gear.
I may not be calling these parts by their correct name according to the manual, but they make sense to me.
Please forgive.
Then the starter motor engagement gear. I may not be calling these parts by their correct name according to the manual, but they make sense to me. Please forgive.
Engaged with the variator holding tool. I reviewed the pics and ensured that the outer pulley, and the starter gear back on in the same orientation. Note the arrows on the gear. There were some similar marks on the pulley as well. Balance.
Engaged with the variator holding tool. I reviewed the pics and ensured that the outer pulley, and the starter gear back on in the same orientation. Note the arrows on the gear. There were some similar marks on the pulley as well. Balance.
Nut back on.
Nut back on.
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
OP
@salty_dodd avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
 
Molto Verboso
@salty_dodd avatar
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
UTC quote
Torque the nut.

Here are the torque values from the manual.

I am not certain what the rear hub cover screws are.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
I torqued it to 60 ft/lbs.
I torqued it to 60 ft/lbs.
slide the clutch bell on.
slide the clutch bell on.
CVT housing cleaned up, and debris removed.
CVT housing cleaned up, and debris removed.
Remove the variator holding tool.
Remove the variator holding tool.
Housing assembled on.
Note the two brakets holdeing the brake line on the bottom.
Also don't forget the ground wire on the front screw.
Housing assembled on. Note the two brakets holdeing the brake line on the bottom. Also don't forget the ground wire on the front screw.
Home made clutch holding tool.
I torqued the nut to ~42 ft/lbs.
I also torqued the trans cover screws to ~9 ft/lbs.
Home made clutch holding tool. I torqued the nut to ~42 ft/lbs. I also torqued the trans cover screws to ~9 ft/lbs.
⚠️ Last edited by salty dodd on UTC; edited 1 time
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