Modern Vespa

I just took delivery of my new 400 a couple days ago. I trailered it home and have only ridden a couple miles around home. It quit on me in the driveway and won't start. The starter makes a grinding noise, the instrument panel blanks then returns, and I get a continuous series of 7-8 second long beeps with a couple seconds in between. When the key is first turned to on I get the usual beep and red light (center speedo) flashes and stays off. The oil light is on (I assume because the engine is not running), the tilt lock light is flashing (orange indicator between clock set buttons). If I attempt to actuate the tilt I can hear the momentary noise of the mechanism but it does not lock and the same long beeps begin and the red tilt lock fault light goes red.

I've checked the under seat connection and all fuses. Any ideas out there?

Also the instrument panel had been set to miles instead of kilometers and F degrees instead of C ... those have reverted to metric.

Sounds like a DEAD battery. Could be improper dealer charge, or the charging system isn't functioning. You got a battery charger?

I don't think it's a dead battery because the head lamps and lights are solid bright. I was riding it when it died so at the least I would think I have a charging malfunction if it is battery related. I suppose it is possible but shouldn't there be some low voltage diagnostic?

You said you checked all of the fuses. Even the "hidden" fuse? It controls the charging system.

You can find it by following this post:

Predelivery check list for the MP3 500

A few posts down that thread is a picture of how to get to the hidden fuse so you can check it. There is also a block of fuses behind a panel where your right foot would be while riding.

Thanks, I was just reading about the "hidden fuse" and I found the location under the seat but haven't enough light in my garage to see what I am doing to get that thing disconnected. I will check it in morning sunlight I guess. Next question ... is there a sure fire way to check the wiring connections if the fuse is blown?

Same thing happend to me. It was in the shop for two weeks while they tried to figure it out. Many of the MP 3's that were made in Canada came off the the line with two wires crossed, the negitive and positive wires that lead to the battery, not the ones that directly lead to it but two others. This problem causes the battery to drain instead of charge, thus the clicking sound in the starter and the dead battery. Piaggio knows about this. I wish I could be more detailed in the location of the wires but the scoot shop corrected the problem. It was repaired at North Florida Motor Sports the nuber is 850-575-0305. You might want to ask for Kent. hope this helps.

The same thing happened to my 400. Try a battery jump and see if it will start then. If it does, it won't last, but at least you will know it is the charging system. On my scoot they replaced the regulator and battery. There have been no problems since (about 250m miles).

I think you would have to hand check them. You can find the wiring diagram and service manual for your bike here:

[topic630]

First ... I want to thank everyone for the helpful replies. I haven't gotten it fixed yet but I am sure learning a lot about the scooter!

I managed to get the "hidden fuse" checked and it is good ... so I'm thinking the "cross wires problem" in the charging system is not the case. Bad battery and / or alternator and / or voltage regulator are still in the running. I should think the alternator would provide enough charge to keep the scoot running even if the battery were dead? I can understand it not having juice to crank it up but I am stumped why it quit running once started.

I will be calling the dealer today. I hate to haul it back to them because it is 150 miles one way.

Thanks again everybody!

Try checking the bolts at the battery terminals. Recently my LCD light went bright and dim and all sorts of negatives thoughts crops up until I found out that one of the bolt that tie down the cable is loose. After tightening the bolt everything is okay! I had the problem of the bike switching off on its own before. Guess thats what happens when the cable is loose. It is like turning off the on/off switch. Electrical supply is not constant! Try it and hope that it helps.

Thanks SHlim,
I will check that again ... I'm going to buy a charger this afternoon to top up the battery charge and will see what that may do and will check those connections while at the battery. Thanks

Have you got that thing started yet?




.

Yes! I bought a 2 amp charger with float so it would charge and then float on and off to keep it charged without frying it. It took over 24 hours to put a full charge on the battery so it was as dead as dead could be. It finished charging late last night and started right up. Now we shall see if it stays that way. It either has a charging problem or it was never fully charged from the dealer.

I must admit I never thought it was the battery at first because the headlamps burned so bright but I was obviously wrong. I don't mind eating another plate of crow though ... I'm almost getting used to the taste!

Once again thanks to all who gave suggestions and especially to those who were right on the mark from the beginning!

Keep posting us the result, if the battery does not recharge, it could be other problems and everybody would be glad to get to the bottom of things for you and at the same time get better understanding of potential problems with our MP3! Cheers!

Rats & Boogers! It died again! This time just about one minute after I had just passed my driving test at the DMV. I very cooly acted as if I had shut it down while being congratulated by the DMV test person and fiddled with my helmet while she walked back to the building. Then I pushed the scooter over to a parking place. I had to come back later and sneak it home on a trailer! Very disturbing and way too close for me. Now I have a license and the scooter won't start! I will be hauling it in to the dealer to have the charging issue diagnosed and sorted. I'll keep you posted!

If all of your fuses are not blown then I would say it'd the alternator wiring being reversed. Couple of people here have had that issue. If you knew where the two wires were you could switch them yourself.

I guess I am confused. I had thought the crossed wire problem would cause the "hidden fuse" to burn? After I finally found this fuse (with help from you great people!) I found it was NOT blown. Is it possible to have these wires crossed and not blow the 30 amp "hidden" fuse? And if so, does anyone know which two wires need to be swapped and where?

I'm all for fixing this thing myself and saving a 300 mile round trip with the trailer to get it fixed at the dealer.

I'm no electrician so I'm only guessing but I would think a fuse would not necessarily care which way the juice is flowing. As long as it's not too much juice. But seriously, I'm only guessing.

I don't think anyone got a chance to actually see the wires being fixed so I'm not sure they would know where they are. Hopefully someone can chime in here soon.

In the meantime, back to the fuses... When you checked the 30A hidden fuse, did you check the fuse that was being used, the spare fuse, or both? There should have been 2 in the fuse holder, one is a spare. Couldn't hurt to make sure both are still working. It's easy to check fuses so I do it a lot.

When I first picked up my 500 it wouldn't cahrge either. Very frustrating, but eventually I told the mechanic specifically where the fuse was and to check it. It was blown, he replaced it, and 3500 miles later...

I checked both and both are good. I am reluctant to start chasing wires with all the dismantling that would entail ... so unless I hear otherwise ... I will just haul it in to the dealer and let him test the alternator, voltage regulater and the battery. I will mention the cross wire situation as well.

CANADA?? No one else cought this so I am correcting you, All MP3's are bouild in Italy.

Did you mean to say Cananda and if so where did you get that info?

Wayne B

OK ... think we may have made some progress ... I called North Florida Motor Sports as suggested by PhilinFL. Talked to the mechanic and he said the wires that were to be swapped were the red and black booted wires on the same fuse block as the "hidden fuse". First I disconnected the battery and then I used a 5/32 allen wrench and swapped these two wires ending up with the same configuration as in the view from Predelivery check list for the MP3 500

Both of my wires are red with one having a black boot and the other a red boot. Since mine was not disconnected (as in the photo) it was easy to orient with the word "FUSE" on the plastic so I ended up with the black booted wire on the "F" side of the word "FUSE" (as in the photo from the link above).

The battery recovered just enough to get me started and it has been running fine ever since. I rode it for about 10 minutes and it started fine after shut down. I then rode it for about 45 minutes at 45 to 60 mph and no problems so far. If you don't hear any more whining from me on this subject just assume it is fixed and I'm out dodging Illinois potholes.

To REALLY be sure, take a multimeter and connect it to the battery terminals. With the bike off it should be reading 12v solid. When you start the bike it should jump up a bit to around 14. That's how you'll know you're really charging.

I sure wish I had a good enough mechanic to call up with something like that and for them to tell me the wires to fix.

And I hope I'm not premature here but... Congrats on getting it working!