Modern Vespa

Yesterday afternoon I was riding the scabby ET4 to Whitstable on the Kent coast in Kent Englandshire on a pretty quick stretch of road when I saw a vision which both frightened me and impressed me at the same time. Riding towards me was a man who had a rather fuller figure riding a an immaculate silver PX125 ( that's the impressed bit ) but what really frightened me was the fact that he was wearing a t shirt, shorts and no eye protection or gloves. The poor guy probably couldn't see much as he was riding fast enough to have to squint against the wind so I'd hate to think of what would happen to his skin if for any reason he parted company with his ride which was a nice ride.
Please mate if you are out there get some protection because it's not going to be pretty if you fell.
Regards Nanny Bill and the scabby ET4

Personal freedom is great, isn't it.

If local law enforcement has an issue - they'll deal with it.

Ride your own ride.

I agree with you but it sent a shiver down my spine to think of what condition his limbs would be if for any reason he hit the tarmac.
Stunned.
Bill

Do you mind if I make this my signature?

90% of the time I wear a helmet and gloves with shorts. The few times I have gone down I've been in my version of full gear.

This is either exceptional good luck or a rash of bad luck.

I think the jury is still out

~El Josh AKA Ruby

*talking to self "I will not post inappropriate pictures on this thread. I will not post inappropriate pictures on this thread. I will not post inappropriate pictures on this thread..."

we were out today in 30C heat, in jeans, gloves, boots, and armoured jackets (mine was mesh so i didn't suffer too badly), when a couple on an aprilia mojito lanesplit past us at about 40mph (in a 30 zone). he was in shorts and flip-flops, she was in a tube top, tiny shorts, and bare feet.

i agree - ride your own ride, not my problem, etc. etc. etc. ... but it's still difficult not to think 'what if...? ouch.' when somebody blows past you dressed like that.

At first I thought it was quite funny but then I realised what an awful mess he was going to make of himself (and the px) if he slung it up the road.
He wasn't a small fella. I've come off myself and taken the tops off my knuckles and knees - I wouldn't wish anyone to experience the pain I had while they healed over. Even in the hot weather I wear a jacket - be it leather or canvas/waterproof.
I guess eveyone has a choice huh.
Bill and the scabby ET4

I've got such mixed feelings.. I know what other people wear (or don't wear!) is none of my business... HOWEVER, when you crashed on your head and face doing 45mph without a helmet and I am the person who stopped to help and gets told by 911 to give CPR to a guy with no lips (they're on the pavement somewhere), then it's MY problem too. True story. He died while we were trying to stop the bleeding btw... severe bleeding and brain trauma.

It took me a VERY long time not to get pissed at every rider not wearing gear after that incident. For a few weeks there, I'd just bawl every time a helmetless rider went by. I couldn't help it. But I still respect everyone's right to make their own decision. I just don't always like it.

This veers dangerously close to the "no helmet discussion" rule doesn't it?

If you have such a problem with it williamvillage, why not hound all the people you see not wearing enough gear to your liking, see how far being a total prat gets ya.

Thank you for your balanced view of my last thread. You are totally right - it's really none of my business. Bill

Well, you just remarked on something - nothing wrong with that.

It wasn't like you ran up and gave him a lecture. You did mind your business, he minded his.

uh .... no. helmet laws are no-go terrain - you can talk about helmets 'till you're blue in the face. this, however, veers dangerously close to being a personal attack. chill out, mate.

If I'm honest I wasn't really in a position to look surprised at his choice of ride wear after all we were travelling in opposite directions at around 50 but as the above text says it's not my problem until I witness his bloody mess laying in the road if he comes off. Don't really want to see that.
Am I the person to draw his attention to it ? Na it's his choice not my duty to enlighten him.
I thought common sense would do that.
No one quite respects the flame quite like the fool whose badly burned.
Bill and the scabby ET4

Thank you for your support Genie. I'm thankful. Bill

i think everyone is allowed an opinion, but i'm torn on this subject. it makes me nervous whenever i see someone without a helmet, which is often because there is no helmet law in CT. but i also understand personal freedom. although it is stupid i never wear my seatbelt, i think it's my business if i want to belt up or not, but for some reason i ALWAYS wear my helemt. every other day in CT there is a strory of critical or fatal motorcycle accidents here, each time the rider was not wearing a helmet. it's happening so often Gov. Rell is considering changing the helmet law. the news scares me into wearing one.

For me it's a simple question - do I want to protect myself in an accident and not mash my face to pieces either by shoving through a windshield or weave it into the tarmac or the nearest kerb ? Answer is yes, so I do, plus of course in the UK it's the law to wear a seatbelt and a crash helmet but even if it wasn't I'd still do it.
I like my limbs and face the way they are thanks all the same.

The trouble is opinions are like arseholes everybody has got one.
I'm quite enjoying this lively debate.

Bill and the scabby ET4

Do a search for Toreador Pants to see how done to death this is.

Everything in life from what you eat to where you live is a risk. Everyone on this forum has already made the choice of a higher risk mode of transportation. IMHO getting high and mighty about choice of gear (or not to wear gear) is kind of like splitting hairs at that point.

Sounds to me like the real victim of this would potentially be the PX125. Think about it, poor little bike... if he doesn't care about himself in a crash, the bike probably doesn't get the greatest care either.


I am kidding of course.

The real tragedy is that some people possess something of a conscious. Abandon this illogical state and all will be right with the world once again.

As if.

why are you kidding, it's true!

Ratstar you are wise . The force is strong with you.
Regards Bill and the scabby ET4

But that's the strange thing the PX looked like a minter so it was either new to him or he doesn't ride it that often or maybe he rides it like that all the time. Whatever. As it's been pointed out to me it's none of my business until it affects me.
Regards Bill and the scabby ET4

this, however, veers dangerously close to being a personal attack. chill out, mate.[/quote]

I agree with Genie - these comments are uncalled for. Bill was sharing an observation and his concern for a fellow rider. I won't get into the helmet debate but in Canada, like UK, we have public health care. Yah, you can wear what you want when riding - freedom of choice. But, if you unfortunately low side or get road crayoned, you may need intensive medical care. And more health care dollars to fix. Working in healthcare, we have to make do with fixed budgets, equpiment, and personnel constantly. People in cars can drive like idiots. But in Canada, they are expected to wear seat belts. I think wearing protective gear when riding make sense.

Isn't he a lucky (fat) Bastard.

Joys of a socialised health system - all the other taxpayers help him out!

with "personal freedom" comes "personal responsibility" and "personal accountability"!

Socialised health system or not

It does make sense for the rider and the NHS as we have it here. When I has my accident the doctor asked what gear I was wearing at the time, remarking on the number of "idiots we get in here who wear shorts".

I think they are fed up of picking tarmac out of people's knees. They'll still do it and be sympathetic, but they think you're a fool at the same time.

If the NHS changed the rules and told you that in order to receive treatment you had to be kitted up, I bet that every biker in England would go and buy the gear within a week. That is happening now with surgery for obesity (you have to lose weight beforehand) and smoking (you have to give up for surgery or other treatment programmes). I don't agree with these approaches but with a limited budget for the NHS then I can see it happening.

i have been riding a lot in a short sleeved shirt in the recent hot weather and have been loving it.

the funny thing is, i've sometimes found myself stopping mid-journey to take my jacket and boots out of the pet carrier / top box and put them on.

i suppose there's a point where freedom of choice wears thin and common sense kicks in.

I must admit to being a little "Jekyll & Hyde" when it comes to riding gear.

On the TDM it's either armoured cordura jacket, trousers and gloves with sidi boots and full face helmet or leather jacket, dragging jeans with the sidi boots and armoured gloves.

BUT

On the Vespa it's piss pot lid, basic leather flying gloves, jeans and a thin jacket in this weather. On a long trip i will wear the cordura jacket and caberg justissimo.

What i wear depends more on the weather and the length of the journey more than anything else.

it's a scorcher in london today, and coming back from downtown just now, i toyed with the idea of leaving my jacket in the top box, just to see what it felt like to ride without it.

i made it exactly one block before pulling over, getting the jacket out of the box, and putting it back on. call me paranoid if you like but all it takes is one distracted muppet of a cager and there's my tender skin all over the pavement and ugly scars for life. no thanks.

LIVE FREE OR DIE. New Hampshire (no seatbelts required over age 18

Last sunday:
we had been riding through the shady country roads on the way to the beach in Maine, I was wearing my armor jacket.
Just before heading home , It was HOT at the beach, I WAS TEMPTED TO STUFF my jacket in the pet carrier.... I turned to my wife and said " How stupid would I feel if I wrecked with my armor under the seat.... Ride on..LOL
BUT .... it is up to the individual Live free and ride!!

Run to the hills!!!!!!

Quick question though - how do y'all get armored jackets to fit in the pet carrier? I certainly can't. Is there a trick to folding them?

I don't have a problem getting mine in. I'll try and take a picture if I can remember.

" I WAS TEMPTED TO STUFF..."
key word, stuff. as you see in the post , the process for me didn't get past the temptation part.
Besides I would have had to move the cd player, sub woofer and mini bar refrigerator 8) 8)

it depends how big the jacket is - it's the back armour that makes or breaks the deal. any of my jackets will fit if rammed tightly enough, with the back armour on top, the sleeve and shoulder armour folded in underneath, and the edges of the back armour tucked in. however if you wear a XXXL i doubt you're going to make it fit no matter what.

Nope, just a regular XL. This would be great as I hate wearing jackets (even mesh ones) on hot days after I park and I'm never happy leaving them unlocked. I wasn't able to stuff the mesh jacket the last time I tried but, as my wife will happily tell you, I suck at folding laundry.

you should se how maltese drive here, !!!! thats an every day thing

I'm afraid I do shout "Put some clothes on!" at scantily-clad riders.

As they're usually big guys on sports bikes, I'm probably in more immediate danger than they are...

Control freaks:
What is it about some people who are obsessed with an uncontrolled urge to stick their noses in other peoples business and personal freedoms under the guise of doing good and helping someone? After reading some of these "Agatt Nazi" posts, I went for a 25 mile ride with a t-shirt, no helmet and sandals just to get a little personal satisfaction that they can't control what I choose to do. It felt really, really good.

This sounds like rather a good idea in reverse - perhaps I could start shouting "coward" and "if you were any sort of man you'd ride that Gixxer naked" when a t shirt and shorts guy went past.

Sexual harrassment cunningly disguised a concern for safety!

This thread seems to have degenerated quickly into an emotional and somewhat unpleasant debate about personal choice, etc. My question is a practical one and I appeal to those here more experienced than I. Don't you think the risk depends a lot on the specific route and traffic conditions? I mean, if I were barreling through London or NY that's a bit different than my own environment. I commute to work on suburban double-lane secondary roads in Minnesota with speed limits about 45-50mph. The surface is good. The traffic is never more than moderate and it's not aggressive. Are there stupid drivers? Undoubtedly. But I've settled on riding in helmet (always) and pants but short sleeves on the way home, when it's hot. I'm sorry, but I just can't see wearing an armored jacket when it's 90F on these roads. Is there ANY consensus on what constitutes minimal protection, eg "wearing even a light jacket is better than nothing," or "anything short of a thick cordura jacket is a joke." I'm trying to remove a bit of the emotion and look at it more from an analytical risk-assessment point of view.

Does this question make sense?