Modern Vespa : Textile Vs. Leather For Protection

Textile Vs. Leather For Protection

OP UBER SCOOTER UTC details Member MP3 500 Joined: UTC Posts: 26 Location: Santa Maria California
OP UBER SCOOTER Member MP3 500 Joined: UTC Posts: 26 Location: Santa Maria California	UTC quote In this modern age (?) is there any added protection going with a leather jacket over a textile jacket with all options being equal ie CE approved body armor etc.?

grscum UTC details Ossessionato 2012 BMW G650GS, 2006 GTS, Joined: UTC Posts: 2090 Location: Snohomish County, WA
grscum Ossessionato 2012 BMW G650GS, 2006 GTS, Joined: UTC Posts: 2090 Location: Snohomish County, WA	UTC quote what about latex?

heavyduti UTC details Hooked MP3 500 Black Joined: UTC Posts: 211 Location: Toronto
heavyduti Hooked MP3 500 Black Joined: UTC Posts: 211 Location: Toronto	UTC quote Either material is better than nothing. I have slid in leather and it did its job the way it was supposed to. As long as it is a bike jacket with armour it should do what it is asked. The downside with leather is that, in general, it is hotter and heavier which sometimes makes the wearer reluctant to use it in hot weather.

Allwooba UTC details Hooked GTS 250ie Joined: UTC Posts: 228 Location: Benicia, CA
Allwooba Hooked GTS 250ie Joined: UTC Posts: 228 Location: Benicia, CA	UTC quote qualifier: i don't know what i'm talking about. but like this quote from a forgotten source: "nature has not prepared cows for sliding down the road at 60 mph" justification for those of us who don't like leather (except on cows)

BoomieMCT

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This is the eternal question and I doubt there will ever be concensus on which is better.

heavyduti wrote:

Either material is better than nothing. I have slid in leather and it did its job the way it was supposed to. As long as it is a bike jacket with armour it should do what it is asked. The downside with leather is that, in general, it is hotter and heavier which sometimes makes the wearer reluctant to use it in hot weather.

Heavier - maybe, but I think it breathes more. I know I sweat less in my leather jacket vs. my old textile one.

Allwooba wrote:

qualifier: i don't know what i'm talking about.

but like this quote from a forgotten source: "nature has not prepared cows for sliding down the road at 60 mph"

justification for those of us who don't like leather (except on cows)

You're right - you don't know what you are talking about. Most the motorcycle racers I know wear leather protection. Some of them have hit the pavment at some pretty high speeds. Their gear got worn but not worn through.

ritchj

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From the Aerostitch site:

Quote:

Crash and Abrasion Considerations?
Compared to leather of the same weight and thickness, Cordura nylon is a stronger material. But hides are thicker and heavier so they offer greater abrasion resistance. We repair about twenty or thirty Aerostich garments a month. About a third of these were in crashes that produced some abrasion damage. Several common themes have emerged. Though Aerostich suits are not as abrasion resistant as racing leathers, they offer significant and useful protection, especially at typical street speeds.

Aerostich wearers often think of their suit as sacrificial in the same way a car's airbag gets used up by its deployment. These garments are lighter, cooler and easier to use in bad weather (etc...), but less crash-durable than leathers. On average, street riders seem to crash only at infrequent intervals. How gear feels and works during the intervening years of use and the tens of thousands of miles of riding is very important. Most street crashes occur between 20 and 50 mph, not between 50 and 100. For each Roadcrafter suit that was in a 100 mph crash, we get dozens that need smaller repairs because the rider fell down at 35 mph . For these kinds of everyday spills, even the fanciest leathers do not offer protective advantages. We make gear to help you use a motorcycle more and be better protected. It has to be safe, easy to use, and comfortable for everyday riding.

Nylon and Friction?
Although we have not conducted tests comparing the friction coefficients of cordura suits and leathers on various pavement surfaces, we have collected a significant amount of relevant information. We repair many Aerostich suits every year, and most of these are damaged by sliding on all kinds of pavements. Many of the wearers (testers....?) had previous crash experiences with leathers. Post-crash wearers typically comment that their Aerostich was 'slipperier' than their old leathers. The consensus is that Cordura slides a little better and tends to roll and tumble the wearer somewhat less than leather. After studying hundreds of accidents, former Motorcyclist magazine editor and professional accident reconstructionist Gordon Jennings believed that more crash injuries (broken shoulders, etc..) were caused by tumbling than by the incrementally increased chances of hitting something due to sliding farther.

Once I loose my 30 pound beer investment, I'm getting full ~~latex~~ leather, but until then, it's the banana suit for me.

OP UBER SCOOTER UTC details Member MP3 500 Joined: UTC Posts: 26 Location: Santa Maria California
OP UBER SCOOTER Member MP3 500 Joined: UTC Posts: 26 Location: Santa Maria California	UTC quote Allwooba wrote: but like this quote from a forgotten source: "nature has not prepared cows for sliding down the road at 60 mph" It is for this very reason that I always insist on my cow (skins) being rated at an 80+ mph slide rate.

Dessita

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Molto Verboso

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UTC quote

I think leather wins in abrasion resistance always.
but it requires care and it has to be good leather, there's all bits of the cow's leather out there, and you don't want the flimsy thin ones..
my Spidi jacket would protect me from abrasion all the way.
but it's very HEAVY in weight so if you're walking around in it shopping you get tired from wearing or holding it!
it is also not (technically) water proof, so if you get caught in the rain you can damage it bad..

the good things of textile is better weather protection.
and the more breathable ones, if you think of the mesh ones, they are very little abrasion resistant... but cordura does a good job.

I'd still say leather is better abrasion protection. Textile is better weather friendly.

Born2BWild

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From my wife's accident on Sunday, the textile jacket held up MUCH better than the leather chaps she was wearing.

The jacket has a very minor abrasion on the elbow (despite her having landed full force on it and sliding at 25mph. Her leathers are much more agressively abraded. In 2 areas, it burned through completely (thank god she was wearing high boots!).

I just picked up a pair of textile riding pants. I'm one to learn from someone else's lesson.....

snapshot05 UTC details WHOoligan 1985 PX200E Arcobaleno : 2010/14 GTS300 S: RIP GTS250 @ 40K Joined: UTC Posts: 6695 Location: Los Angeles Kings, Stanley Cup Champions X2
snapshot05 WHOoligan 1985 PX200E Arcobaleno : 2010/14 GTS300 S: RIP GTS250 @ 40K Joined: UTC Posts: 6695 Location: Los Angeles Kings, Stanley Cup Champions X2	UTC quote grscum wrote: what about latex? Steve I think he ment it for ridig scooters not each other. Manny PS I still owe you a beer, but not in latex.

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Born2BWild wrote:

well, good to know, thanks!

Harvey

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Born2BWild wrote:

Wow! do you happen to know the thickness of the leather (usually the maker states it on their website)?

Regards
Harvey

snapshot05 UTC details WHOoligan 1985 PX200E Arcobaleno : 2010/14 GTS300 S: RIP GTS250 @ 40K Joined: UTC Posts: 6695 Location: Los Angeles Kings, Stanley Cup Champions X2
snapshot05 WHOoligan 1985 PX200E Arcobaleno : 2010/14 GTS300 S: RIP GTS250 @ 40K Joined: UTC Posts: 6695 Location: Los Angeles Kings, Stanley Cup Champions X2	UTC quote I wear a mesh Tourmaster jacket, in Soul Cal its hottier than it is rainy. Leather might be better but it seems too hot for me. Gitta wears a white leather jacket and Im sure she would be willing to give you her opinion, especially after her last accident. Gitta your up. Gitta? Manny

snapshot05 UTC details WHOoligan 1985 PX200E Arcobaleno : 2010/14 GTS300 S: RIP GTS250 @ 40K Joined: UTC Posts: 6695 Location: Los Angeles Kings, Stanley Cup Champions X2
snapshot05 WHOoligan 1985 PX200E Arcobaleno : 2010/14 GTS300 S: RIP GTS250 @ 40K Joined: UTC Posts: 6695 Location: Los Angeles Kings, Stanley Cup Champions X2	UTC quote Born2BWild wrote: (thank god she was wearing high boots!). .. I wear my doc Martins (8hole) 97% of the time I ride. Seen what happens when you wear tennis shoes and you go down. Manny

smrf UTC details Molto Verboso Smrfmobile was a 2007 sky blue Piaggio MP3 250ie w/Tow-Pac, Inc. Instatrike B kit Joined: UTC Posts: 1307 Location: south San Francisco bay area, CA
smrf Molto Verboso Smrfmobile was a 2007 sky blue Piaggio MP3 250ie w/Tow-Pac, Inc. Instatrike B kit Joined: UTC Posts: 1307 Location: south San Francisco bay area, CA	UTC quote kevlar I'm going with the mesh kevlar from motoport.com that is better and lighter (leather or textile) but $$$ But, hey how much is my skin and bones worth to me?!?!

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UTC quote

kevlar mesh

I wear Motoport kevlar mesh pants for daily commuting. Great pants for my purpose. I haven't worn leathers since dirt biking days in the early 80's. I chose these over leather for their comfort and convenience, but don't think I've compromised on safety. Beyond a certain point, precaution and gear choice takes a sideseat to pure luck.

At the risk of a thread hijack...quick kevlar pant review:

Pluses:
Amazingly cool and comfortable. Lots of airflow.
Throw the whole thing in the wash at once, armor included. Hang dries in an hour.
Big, bright blazes of reflective tape down the leg get you noticed (if riding a scooter girded for the apocolypse hasn't already done so)
Easy on-and-off overpants - step out of them ready for high tea.

Minuses:
No gamey aroma of sweat and leather.
Big upfront cash outlay - but a 7 year warranty eases the pain.
Not dual-purpose. More tool than attire.
No points for style. These are pants for Trinity's uncle Hank.

BoomieMCT

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Of course the best protection is the protection you will actually wear - do not neglect the advantage of comfort! The way I understand it here are the general differences between the two;

Textile
Pros: Lighter, cooler, slides more, generally cheaper.
Cons: Slides more, friction can "burn through" (burn the skin while the material stays intact), can melt onto skin (seen it happen - yuck).

Leather
Pros: Better abrasion resistance, better heat resistance. Looks cooler. Blocks wind better. Stiffer (can help on long trips).
Cons: Heavier, stiffer, generally more expensive, can be difficult to judge quality for laymen.

I personally think leather breathes more but most others think textiles do (or at least have more airflow). I personally wear leather becuase synthetics feel weird on my skin.

⚠️ Last edited by BoomieMCT on UTC; edited 1 time

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Born2BWild wrote:

What chaps did she have? Most leather chaps I see in stores is made of really cheap leather so this does't surprise me. Most companies don't put as much quality into their chaps as their jackets.

I originally used Joe Rocket textile pants but it was too hard to stay on the seat - I really slid around too much.

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The reason you don't race in textile: it melts. I shudder to think of what it'd feel like to be in the hospital with melted plastic fused in your wounds... At lower speeds on the street and highways: textile will likely be sufficient protection.

The more important feature than material is construction. A well made textile suit will be far safer than a poorly made leather suit. I take great care in examining gear before buying any.
However: fit of the suit will play a huge part in its safety. A snug fitting jacket will stay in place for a crash keeping armor where it should and keeping the suit from ripping or burning through highspots (folds from excess material).

FWIW: My every-day riding jacket is leather. It fits well and been repaired a few times now... It'll likely be replaced with a nice textile jacket (if I can find one that meets my stringent requirements on build quality)

Andrea UTC details Sponsor DL200, TV2, Vega, Lui, GTS Joined: UTC Posts: 750 Location: Orange, NJ
Andrea Sponsor DL200, TV2, Vega, Lui, GTS Joined: UTC Posts: 750 Location: Orange, NJ	UTC quote Has anyone tried the clothing with 3do armour in it yet? I was in England the weekend before last and was playing with a piece from a friends jacket. It was pretty intriguing. Andrea

kuj UTC details Hooked GTS 300 Super Joined: UTC Posts: 112 Location: Sunnyvale, CA
kuj Hooked GTS 300 Super Joined: UTC Posts: 112 Location: Sunnyvale, CA	UTC quote I have the soft shell hoodie from Armadillo Scooter Wear. It's very comfortable. You can use it as a regular jacket without removing the armor. I only wish it had a spine protector like the Corazzo Speedway. I bought one to wear underneath though.

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Salima Draghetta Molto Verboso GTS 250 Joined: UTC Posts: 1518 Location: Utah, USA	UTC quote post deleted by Salima ⚠️ Last edited by Salima Draghetta on UTC; edited 1 time

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For leather vs. textile regarding how it protects in a crash, the subject of the grade or quality of the leather should be considered also. Good quality leather materials in the garment will help insure the jacket or pants will hold together better in a slide than poorer quality full grain or "top grain" leather - which is a misnomer, since these are the lowest quality hides used to make leather stuff.

As for breathability, I have a buddy with a nice Dianese perforated leather riding jacket that he swears by for the cooling effect the perforated leather provides. His coat has several liners for cooler weather and he ride in all seasons. I like my khaki Corazzo and bright red mesh textiles for visibility when riding. My buddy's Dainese is black. There's where our opinions on riding gear really diverge. His jacket is d=surely better looking than mine, but I like to think my bright, reflective textile make me be seen.

TurtleGT UTC details Banned Joined: UTC Posts: 6032
TurtleGT Banned Joined: UTC Posts: 6032	UTC quote I think that for commuters (like me) the issue becomes, "How many jackets do you want to buy?" Since I ride a lot in the rain/sleet/grossness and since I only have one three-season jacket and one hot-weather jacket, they both have to be textile

jimc UTC details Moderaptor The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300 Joined: UTC Posts: 45220 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
jimc Moderaptor The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300 Joined: UTC Posts: 45220 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA	UTC quote Textile for the road, far more convenient. Full leathers for the track - it's mandatory.

TurtleGT UTC details Banned Joined: UTC Posts: 6032
TurtleGT Banned Joined: UTC Posts: 6032	UTC quote jimc wrote: Full leathers for the track - it's mandatory. 1. Bogart will never be visiting a track 2. I've never seen leathers in my size, which is short, female and--err--robust

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EN82pg Ossessionato 2010 PIAGGIO BV 500ie Tourer Joined: UTC Posts: 4644 Location: Lakeshore, ON, CANADA-Capestang,FR	UTC quote grscum wrote: what about latex? As in condoms??????

EN82pg UTC details Ossessionato 2010 PIAGGIO BV 500ie Tourer Joined: UTC Posts: 4644 Location: Lakeshore, ON, CANADA-Capestang,FR
EN82pg Ossessionato 2010 PIAGGIO BV 500ie Tourer Joined: UTC Posts: 4644 Location: Lakeshore, ON, CANADA-Capestang,FR	UTC quote jimc wrote: Textile for the road, far more convenient. Full leathers for the track - it's mandatory. Are you 100% sure Jim?? I understand Gore-Tex armour is also used.

genie UTC details Gobshite Shiva Kymco Downtown 300i the 'Dolphin Noise' Joined: UTC Posts: 14960 Location: London UK
genie Gobshite Shiva Kymco Downtown 300i the 'Dolphin Noise' Joined: UTC Posts: 14960 Location: London UK	UTC quote Andrea wrote: Has anyone tried the clothing with 3do armour in it yet? I was in England the weekend before last and was playing with a piece from a friends jacket. It was pretty intriguing. Andrea i'm not so sure about that stuff - it hardens on impact, which, i'd imagine, is precisely what you don't want armour to do.

jimc UTC details Moderaptor The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300 Joined: UTC Posts: 45220 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
jimc Moderaptor The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300 Joined: UTC Posts: 45220 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA	UTC quote The concept seems to work, it absorbs a lot of energy.

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EN82pg wrote:

jimc wrote:

Textile for the road, far more convenient.
Full leathers for the track - it's mandatory.

Are you 100% sure Jim??

I understand Gore-Tex armour is also used.

Racers can use what they like - but here for public trackdays full one-piece or fulled zipped leathers must be worn, together with FF (can be modular) gold-standard helmet, purpose designed motorcycle boots and leather gloves. Titanium sliders are not allowed...

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protection

Hello all,

I went down while I was racing, over 70 mph, leathers were fine( until the medics cut them off of me) I had no road rash at all.

The wife went down with textile/Gore-Tex, she had no road rash but the textile/Gore-Text was torn up pretty good.

Armor is also good addition. When my wife went down, she had no road rash, but plenty of bruises as the armor in the knees was light.

Thanks

Joe

Cindy UTC details Molto Verboso 2006 Vespa LX150 Joined: UTC Posts: 1457
Cindy Molto Verboso 2006 Vespa LX150 Joined: UTC Posts: 1457	UTC quote I wear mesh in the summer and textiles in the winter. I prefer textiles simply because good leather is heavy. Armor has saved my knee and a fullface helmet saved my chin. Too bad 3 of my teeth did not fare as well. Thankfully, they were in the back (molars) and could be crowned.

starreem UTC details Ossessionato 07 GTS250(RIP), 07 LX150, Several Lambrettas Joined: UTC Posts: 2834 Location: Raleigh, NC
starreem Ossessionato 07 GTS250(RIP), 07 LX150, Several Lambrettas Joined: UTC Posts: 2834 Location: Raleigh, NC	UTC quote I posted this in another similar thread. What ever you decide, make sure it fits well. A loose fitting, too large garment does not keep the armour where it needs to be in an impact situation.

⬆️ About 17 years elapsed ⬇️

Oskuk UTC details Hooked Joined: UTC Posts: 149 Location: Finland
Oskuk Hooked Joined: UTC Posts: 149 Location: Finland	UTC quote At least they are style in big letters!

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