Modern Vespa

I have just started the restoration of a Rally 180 (in the project reports section). I now have it running, shifting and braking and think it is time to drop the engine and replace the seals (everything about the bike indicates it's been sitting, so I figure might as well).

This seems like it is also the best time to have it repainted, as the engine will already be out. I have never completely disassembled a vespa before. Besides taking pictures, any sage advice or tips from those of you who have done it? How much time should I allow? Any tips on how to keep everything organized until the frame returns from the painter?

Thanks in advance-

There's a lot of facets to disassembly that all depend on stuff like how much of the original parts you're going to use .... wiring harness, etc. Obviously preserving original rubber / rails ... these type of things are going to take more work.

I tend to just clip all the cables with dykes, and pull them all out that way.... it's easier.

Get one of those plastic parts trays, and every nut and bolt you pull off the thing goes into there, so you don't lose anything. Plastic bags are good for whole assemblies. When i remove a nut / bolt / washer combo i'll screw them all together to keep them together.

To get the original floorstrips off, use a dremel + cutting disc on the bottom to carefully rub away the hammered side of the rivet until it pops free, scraping away as little of the frame metal in the process as you can.

I'd guess you could assemble a vespa in under an hour.

I'll share with you my first rule of restoration: never rush. Especially as the projects starts to near completion the temptation will be there to hurry and button it up. The end is the key - gotta take time to finish everything RIGHT.

The paint is the other key. Bad paint is, well, bad. Nothing sucks quite like it.

Get a Box of large Ziplok Bags and a pad of Post-it-Notes. Add the parts to the bag and include a Post-It-Note of the part, any particulars about removing/installing. That way, when you get around to re-assembly, you won't be looking at a part and scratching your head.

Don't know if you've ever seen this blog. Lot's of advice and some free-hard-learned lessons. A quick cruise through it might be helpful and entertaining.

http://vesparestoration.blogspot.com/index.html

cheers

Put the post-it note in the bag though - 'cause they can fall off and then you are screwed... (yes it has happened to me on non-scooter projects!)

Good Luck,

Desi B.

I'm a huge fan of having a bench grinder with a wire brush on it.

As i pull off parts ...anything from nuts + bolts + washers to your headset tubes to various metal parts like brake cable clamp assemblies, etc. Headset bolt + nut ...swingarm bolt + nut... rear suspension bolt, etc.

i take everything apart, wire brush it so it shines again, then hit it with clear laquer so it won't rust again.

as all the foregoing responses suggest, *be methodical*. start with a dedicated work area and space for storage, be it a corner of your room, a big box, whatever, so you don't misplace anything. i use sturdy paper bags and put entire assemblies in them, and label the outside with a sharpie: clutch assembly, carb/airbox, stator, what have you. if you have a digital camera, don't be afraid to take pics of stuff before disassembly. don't leave any question marks in the way when you're ready to reassemble. one specific tip: before removing the case bolts, number them. just take that sharpie and number them, 1 thru whatever, right on the head of the bolt itself. then either draw a diagram of the case and mark which number bolt goes where, or write the corresponding bolt number right on the case next to where the bolt goes.

yeah ...definitely take pics of stuff with a digital camera as you disassemble. You'll be happy you did.

Thanks for all of the tips. Unfortunately I don't have a lot of workspace but I can be very organized. I like the idea of keeping the varying assemblies together, at least that way I can tackle one general group of parts at a time. I had planned on taking lots of digital photos. I am an architect and I work much better when I have pictures. Luckily I also have a shop manual/parts book with exploded diagrams. Architects love exploded diagrams.

I once rebuilt a P engine on my kitchen table with nothing more than a Haynes manual (before digital pictures) and a parts book, so I'm more worried about the tactile things like getting the clutch cable and the timing right. I appreciate the advice and am looking forward to tackling it. Is there anything I will need a second set of hands for, or should I be able to do it myself?

if you can rebuild a P engine with nothing but an exploded diagram, then the rest of the bike should be a cakewalk.

I think I kinda know what you mean. You can read a diagram and seem to know your way around a tool box but just have never had to do things on a scooter like this. Not a problem. The fact that you are good with your hands is a huge start. A lot of people can't get past that part. Follow the advice in this thread and you'll do just fine.

re: timing....it is determined by the stator's physical orientation as installed on the case. if the rally 180 doesn't have a factory timing mark somewhere on the case just around the perimeter of the stator backing plate, make one yourself before taking the stator off! just take a scrawl or some other suitably sharp tool and scratch a line or two from the outer edge of the stator and onto the case, itself...so you'll be able to line those marks up and thus retain the same timing you had before removing the stator.

there is a ton of this sort of information on the net. just poke around for a couple hours and you'll be in good shape, especially since you've already rebuilt a P motor.

second set of hands = too many cooks in the kitchen in my opinion.

throw everything in a box. Let it sit for months, then sell it to your buddy cheap.

Thats how I ended up with lots of my bikes. Not a good way start/stop any restoration...

Its tough to categorize bolts in a coffee can. Only the brave decide "this fits here."

I've done my searching and read as much info as I can over the past month or so, so I'm ready as I'm going to be. By the second set of hands thing - I meant someone to help lift/maneuver the vespa at any point. I'm strong but only weigh about 110, so I was concerned about whether I could lift the bike/drop the engine by myself.

take your time. don't rush or push anything, go at your own pace. don't get frustrated when it takes twice as long and costs twice as much. don't cut corners.

label everything. mark the ziplock bags AND put a slip of paper in the bag with the parts that has the description.

you will lose shit. be ready for this.
the stuff you order will be wrong and/or not fit correctly. be ready for this, too.

bench top grinder with a stainless steel wire wheel and a brass wire wheel will be your best friend. the brass is soft enough that you won't lose the finish on the nuts and bolts. use the stainless wheel for the stuff you're going to paint.

blue painter's tape is your friend. mask off EVERYTHING. eliminate chips in paint.

don't ever feel rushed that you have to get to "this point" at any specific time. that's when you'll cut a corner or eff something up.

don't forget to budget for beer.

ask for help when installing the motor and fork.

best,
-greasy

+1. The engine isn't too bad but doing the fork alone is a real bitch. Ask me how I know...

i ditto the plastic baggy suggestion. i tore apart my sprint and i knew it was going to take me a bit to get it back together again and wouldn't know where every nut and bolt went to. i had baggies with nuts and bolts labeled for every section of my bike. it's a godsend.