Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:33 am

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:33 am linkquote
Had a question for you guys - do you see yourself riding a Vespa/scooter as your main mode of transportation for the foreseeable future? Any tension/apprehension riding to work? Co-workers/boss's thoughts?

Just curious, because I notice as I get older, I am beginning to wonder if I can continue riding indefinately. I will always have a scooter for enjoyment, but I am unsure I'll be able to ride it as my main mode of transportation to work.

As I "age", I notice that people expect me to "outgrow" this scooter "phase". Something about a 30+ year old guy riding a scooter to work just makes people shake their head. I notice this varies by culture. If you go to Europe, I don't think its a big issue at all - scooters everywhere. In the US - depends on where you work. In Asia, they would think its irresponsible/childish to ride a scooter to work, especially if you're older (the only ones that ride around regularly are delivery guys and kids on rockets).

I had someone mention something to me that made pause and think - what happens if you're a vital part of an organization (CEO, CFO)? I think everyone would agree that riding scooter/motorcycle is more dangerous than driving a car. Is it irresponsible to ride to work when you're "vital" to a company and its respective employees, shareholders? Pro athletes are prohibited from engaging in such activites - see Jay Williams of Duke/Chicago Bulls and the most recent incident with Monta Ellis of the Golden State Warriors. You could extend this argument to include your family - you have kids, wife, parents, that depend on you for income, etc. I had no response to this, but it did make me think.

EXAMPLE: Andrea Pininfarina. CEO of Pininfarina, designer of Ferrari. Guy dies when his Vespa hit a car that pulled out on him (apparently not his fault) - he was estimated to be riding LESS than 30 MPH! Guy leaves family (wife and 3 teenage kids) , loved ones and coworkers who depended on him. Also, company is in shambles:

"News of Pininfarina's death brought speculation the financially-troubled company may soon have new owners and sent its stock skyward."

See whole story here: http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/08/pininfarinas-ce.html

As CEO, father - one could ask, what the hell was he doing riding a motorcycle when so many depended on him.

I understand the whole - he died doing what he loved, etc. But tell that to his family and coworkers that invested their lives at Pininfarina. Not sure they are comforted by that.

With this in mind - How long can I/we, or should I/we, keep riding?

Last edited by Wangta on Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:54 pm; edited 2 times in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:44 am

Molto Verboso
Blue 70th anniversary Vespa GTS 300
Joined: 02 Jul 2008
Posts: 1305
Location: Leeds, Yorkshire, England
 
Molto Verboso
Blue 70th anniversary Vespa GTS 300
Joined: 02 Jul 2008
Posts: 1305
Location: Leeds, Yorkshire, England
Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:44 am linkquote
I'm 54 and use my scooter daily as my main mode of transport, both for work and pleasure. My bosses and colleagues admire the fact that I ride in all weathers and apart from really strong winds I much prefer riding than driving.
I used to get some grief from one of my bosses until I rode past him waiting for a bus then later that week he was queueing in traffic when I rode past him, funnily enough the smart arse comments stopped!!!

So sod the rest as long as you enjoy riding then carry on doing it!!!!

As for responsibility Yes I do have a family but have never felt vulnerable on my scoot, and surely if you are that vital to the firm then they should wrap you in cotton wool 24/7

Last edited by Oultondave on Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:49 am; edited 1 time in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:48 am

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
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Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:48 am linkquote
Oultondave wrote:
So sod the rest as long as you enjoy riding then carry on doing it!!!!
Yeah, I agree - but I guess I'm thinking of this in terms of responsability to others. Sometimes you gotta put other people's best interest first.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:55 am

Molto Verboso
Blue 70th anniversary Vespa GTS 300
Joined: 02 Jul 2008
Posts: 1305
Location: Leeds, Yorkshire, England
 
Molto Verboso
Blue 70th anniversary Vespa GTS 300
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:55 am linkquote
Personally I dont see the fact that I ride a scooter as being irresponsible. I know I ride sensibly and although I am more vunerable that car drivers if you start thinking that way then you may as well stop riding. I don't want to sound callous or blase but when setting out on my scooter, the last thing on my mind is crashing

A good friend of mine rides daily to work and again at weekends. He works nights and doesn't have a car licence. He also has a wife and child is he being irresponsible???
If he didn't ride he would have two options , either spend the vast majority of his income on taxi's ( no public transport at that time of night) or finish work and hope to get a job within walking distance

Last edited by Oultondave on Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:00 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:00 pm linkquote
Oultondave wrote:
Personally I dont see the fact that I ride a scooter as being irresponsible. I know I ride sensibly and although I am more vunerable that car drivers if you start thinking that way then you may as well stop riding. I don't want to sound callous or blase but when setting out on my scooter, the last thing on my mind is crashing
No one plans on getting into an accident, but it can happen, whether you plan for it or not. Defensive driving can only do so much. There was the guy who worked at BMW-San Jose, an excellent motorcycle driver who was killed earlier this year when a woman, who leaned down to grab something in the car, came accross the lane and hit him head on. Not much you can do when a car comes right at you. Unlike cars, one mistake or mishap on a motorcycle has a high probability of killing you or seriously injuring you (thus can't work).

I understand your point, but reality is - I would feel terrible if it did happen. More so for the people that depend on me than myself.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:02 pm

Molto Verboso
GT200. Buddy 125.
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Posts: 1617
Location: NJ
 
Molto Verboso
GT200. Buddy 125.
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:02 pm linkquote
Wangta01 wrote:
Oultondave wrote:
So sod the rest as long as you enjoy riding then carry on doing it!!!!
Yeah, I agree - but I guess I'm thinking of this in terms of responsability to others. Sometimes you gotta put other people's best interest first.
Why? You only need to do that in life where and when you really want to, y'know?
But hey, it is a good excuse to give up riding if you're getting bored with it, or tired of the risk involved.
Hey, ANY reason is a good reason to stop riding, if that's what YOU really want to do!
But somehow I doubt that blaming the decision on someone else's opinions will make you feel any better...

Last edited by Chazzlee on Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:07 pm

Molto Verboso
Blue 70th anniversary Vespa GTS 300
Joined: 02 Jul 2008
Posts: 1305
Location: Leeds, Yorkshire, England
 
Molto Verboso
Blue 70th anniversary Vespa GTS 300
Joined: 02 Jul 2008
Posts: 1305
Location: Leeds, Yorkshire, England
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:07 pm linkquote
Now you're repeating yourself!!!!

I win I win!!!!

Seriously though the bike rider that got killed, had he been in a car and the same thing happened he may well have been seriously injured and become a terible buren on his family. There are dangers in everything we do, you have to weigh up the pro's and con's and make a valid judgement. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to your question and this debate could run and run, we all ahve our own thoughts and ideas on what is and what isn't responsible!
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:09 pm

Moderator Australis
2014 Moto Guzzi V7 Stone, 2014 Vespa 150 Primavera (sold) 2003 Vespa GT200 (sold)
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 5652
Location: New Zealand where it is already tomorrow..
 
Moderator Australis
2014 Moto Guzzi V7 Stone, 2014 Vespa 150 Primavera (sold) 2003 Vespa GT200 (sold)
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Location: New Zealand where it is already tomorrow..
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:09 pm linkquote
Re: Vespa Riding as you get "Older"...Irresponsibl
Wangta01 wrote:
Had a question for you guys - do you see yourself riding a Vespa/scooter as your main mode of transportation for the foreseeable future? Any tension/apprehension riding to work? Co-workers/boss's thoughts?

Just curious, because I notice as I get older, I am beginning to wonder if I can continue riding indefinately. I will always have a scooter for enjoyment, but I am unsure I'll be able to ride it as my main mode of transportation to work.

As I "age", I notice that people expect me to "outgrow" this scooter "phase". Something about a 30+ year old guy riding a scooter to work just makes people shake their head. I notice this varies by culture. If you go to Europe, I don't think its a big issue at all - scooters everywhere. In the US - depends on where you work. In Asia, they would think its irresponsible/childish to ride a scooter to work, especially if you're older (the only ones that ride around regularly are delivery guys and kids on rockets).

I had someone mention something to me that made pause and think - what happens if you're a vital part of an organization (CEO, CFO)? I think everyone would agree that riding scooter/motorcycle is more dangerous than driving a car. Is it irresponsible to ride to work when you're "vital" to a company and its respective employees, shareholders? Pro athletes are prohibited from engaging in such activites - see Jay Williams of Duke/Chicago Bulls and the most recent incident with Monta Ellis of the Golden State Warriors. You could extend this argument to include your family - you have kids, wife, parents, that depend on you for income, etc. I had no response to this, but it did make me think.

How long can I, or should I, keep riding?
To answer your last question first - until your toes curl up and they nail the lid on the box!
Jaysus!!! 30+ is still wet behind the ears.
I didn't get my first scoot until I was 40 and I have never had any second thoughts, regrets or cares about what others think. I don't beleive it was a mid-life crisis either - haven't been there yet (according to my friends) and anyway, surely that involves going out and buying a Hog or a red Ferrari.
I talked the whole M/C = danger thing through with my wife and children. I wear Toreador Pants and high viz and IMO I ride fairly conservatively. BUT....scooting has changed my life. I couldn't have the lifestyle I have now if I was still cage-bound. Mt GT allows me to have breakfast with my kids, help get them ready for school and have a chilled-out breakfast with my wife. She catches the bus, as does my eldest daughter, then the youngest and I get on the GT and ride to school/work in the middle of rush hour. I travel 14km in peak traffic and it takes me an average of 22 mins (a car would be 1 hour+).
So I'm not really a 'scooterist'. I chose 2 wheels for practical reasons and it has paid dividends ever since. I chose Vespa because I enjoy well designed consumer goods with a pedigree and on a teachers salary I am unlikely to ever own a Ferrari/Porsche/Lambo (sigh).
I do hold a senior position in a large-ish organisation and as it happens my up-line manager did question my taking up two wheeled commuting. Prior to this I had commuted regulalry or a bicycle - IMO a far more dangerous activity to which noone raised an eyebrow.
I don't ride out, do rallies, belong to a club (except this forum). I just commute, occasionally ride for pleasure and a Vespa GT200 is my ride d'jour.
Practicality, pleasure and financial common sense rolled into one - what more could a bloke ask for. Age just doesn't come into it.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:10 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
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Ossessionato
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:10 pm linkquote
Oultondave wrote:
Now you're repeating yourself!!!!

I win I win!!!!

Seriously though the bike rider that got killed, had he been in a car and the same thing happened he may well have been seriously injured and become a terible buren on his family. There are dangers in everything we do, you have to weigh up the pro's and con's and make a valid judgement. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to your question and this debate could run and run, we all ahve our own thoughts and ideas on what is and what isn't responsible!
HUh? Not following you there.

Yeah, I was just curious how you guys rationalize this to yourselves. Unfortunately, i cannot take Chazzlee's approach - I am always thinking about how my decisions impact the people I care about. Its a struggle, but on the positive side - it REALLY pushes me to ride safe.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:14 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:14 pm linkquote
Chazzlee wrote:
Why? You only need to do that in life where and when you really want to, y'know?
Hmm, you say that but I'm not so sure you could ignore this in real life. Say your wife, parents, and KIDS asked you to stop riding because it scared the crap out of them. What would you tell them? FU - I'll do what I want? I believe in doing what is best for yourself, but sometimes its not that easy. Imagine your family without you in the picture. How would their life be?
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:18 pm

Hooked
only a memory 08 Midnight Blue GTS 250, Suzuki Burgman, 400Burgman 650.
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 409
Location: Modesto, CA
 
Hooked
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:18 pm linkquote
Re: Vespa Riding as you get "Older"...Irresponsibl
Wangta01 wrote:
Please read my inserted answers with a smile or an LOL. No disrespect or slam intended. Gail.
Had a question for you guys - do you see yourself riding a Vespa/scooter as your main mode of transportation for the foreseeable future? YES, Unless it is raining or VERY cold.
Any tension/apprehension riding to work? Only when people that should have left 10 minutes earlier to take their kids to school don't see me and almost run me down, no, no apprehension. Co-workers/boss's thoughts? They think I am a tiny bit nuts. My boss always says, You can't carry that, drive there, go that far, etc on a scooter. I say, Watch me. Bye. And I am a fairly important cog in our little part of a larger organization.
Just curious, because I notice as I get older, I am beginning to wonder if I can continue riding indefinately. No, one day your "Depends" may get squishy when you go over a bumpy road. Or you will have to add a cane holder to the front. That is a sign that it might be time to sell the scooter. I will always have a scooter for enjoyment, but I am unsure I'll be able to ride it as my main mode of transportation to work.

As I "age", I notice that people expect me to "outgrow" this scooter "phase". Something about a 30+ year old guy (you are still a Baby my dear) riding a scooter to work just makes people shake their head. That is good excercise for their necks. You are doing them a favor. If it makes you feel bad get a bigger scooter, a larger Piaggio or Burgman or ?? I notice this varies by culture. If you go to Europe, I don't think its a big issue at all - scooters everywhere. In the US - depends on where you work. In Asia, they would think its irresponsible/childish to ride a scooter to work, especially if you're older (the only ones that ride around regularly are delivery guys and kids on rockets). Asia is a big place. How come my brother sent home photos of FAMILIES piled on to one scooter?
I had someone mention something to me that made pause and think - what happens if you're a vital part of an organization (CEO, CFO)? I think everyone would agree that riding scooter/motorcycle is more dangerous than driving a car. Is it irresponsible to ride to work when you're "vital" to a company and its respective employees, shareholders? So teach someone else your job. Share the smarts. Even Bill Gates and Warren Buffet have to move on. A million other things could happen to take you out of work. So be prepared. Pro athletes are prohibited from engaging in such activites - see Jay Williams of Duke/Chicago Bulls and the most recent incident with Monta Ellis of the Golden State Warriors. You could extend this argument to include your family My kids are grown and after 6 months are getting interested in riding too. They saw photos of their mom before they were born on a Harley, I think they are glad I am on "just" a scooter- you have kids, wife, parents, that depend on you for income, etc. I had no response to this, but it did make me think. Yep, that is an important decision.

How long can I, or should I, keep riding? As long as you feel it is an enjoyable mode of transportation and you feel like a safe and alert driver. If you don't like it anymore or you feel it could be detrimental to the long term care of your family, perhaps it is time to leave the riding to us older folks. This is my long winded opinion only. And you know what they say about opinions....
So it this an age and respectability question or a safety and take care of my family question? Which weighs the most for you? As for the scooter phase part - Have you ever thought you may be on the edge of a new trend in the USA? And perhaps a better trend than the huge SUV trend?
Again, this meant in the most friendly manner. = ]
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:25 pm

Banned
GT200
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Posts: 345
Location: L.E., U.K.
 
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:25 pm linkquote
Wangta01 wrote:
Chazzlee wrote:
Why? You only need to do that in life where and when you really want to, y'know?
Hmm, you say that but I'm not so sure you could ignore this in real life. Say your wife, parents, and KIDS asked you to stop riding because it scared the crap out of them. What would you tell them? FU - I'll do what I want? I believe in doing what is best for yourself, but sometimes its not that easy. Imagine your family without you in the picture. How would their life be?
No kids, no partner. I got my first ptw at 16, now 41, and have been riding ever since. A few close shaves and one sider but never a broken bone. I wake up every day and imagine how the roads could treat me that day and ride accordingly. I'm sure my mum worried about me and prolly still does BUT THAT'S LIFE.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:26 pm

Enthusiast
Harley SuperGlide
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:26 pm linkquote
There's an old saying that goes something like "Why tip-toe through life only to arrive safely at death?"
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:26 pm

Member
LX80
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Location: Victoria BC
 
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LX80
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:26 pm linkquote
A big part of riding a scooter is doing so because you don't care what other people think. The real question is, "are you comfortable taking responsibility for riding a scooter as you age?".

I don't intend to ever give up my scooter.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:29 pm

Addicted
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:29 pm linkquote
Wangta01

I've had those thoughts cross my mind too. They are legitimate concerns, but part of the equation. I am 50 and do use the GTV as my primary means of commute. I do not commute in the rain - not because I don't want to get wet, but for safety reasons - us Californians do not know how to drive in any kind of bad weather & with reduced visibility the cagers are just that much more of a hazard. I only have my wife as a partial dependent, so less strings there. And though I do have a good size team at work, I know that everyone is replaceable. So maybe feeling the weight of responsibility less. I consider myself lucky that I can and do ride as often as possible without too much baggage.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:29 pm

Molto Verboso
GT200. Buddy 125.
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Posts: 1617
Location: NJ
 
Molto Verboso
GT200. Buddy 125.
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:29 pm linkquote
[quote="Wangta01]
Yeah, I was just curious how you guys rationalize this to yourselves. Unfortunately, i cannot take Chazzlee's approach - I am always thinking about how my decisions impact the people I care about. Its a struggle, but on the positive side - it REALLY pushes me to ride safe.[/quote]

In that case I strongly suggest that you give up riding. No sense riding around so deeply divided against yourself; that sure doesn't sound like much fun to me!
One suggestion tho; if you do use the self-serving reason of giving it up tor "others", I suggest you not tell them about it. You'd be surprised; they might not like you for doing it, and they may not even appreciate your noble sacrifices for them. -Especially if you blame them for your having to stop riding later on, as many people do who give up things "for others..."

I still say if you want to stop riding, if the risk bothers YOU, then by all means just STOP. You need no excuses for doing so, and you owe NO explanations to others regarding doing so either! It's your life, and in the long run you're the one who's responsible for the way you live it!

Jus' call me Dr. Phill....
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:36 pm

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GTS
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:36 pm linkquote
43 here and drive to work 3-4 days a week on my scooter. I usually take the car if I have to visit clients or if the weather is really bad in the morning. My wife also drives a Vespa and we both have larger motorcycles too.

Too risky? Well, its measurably more risky than a car, but I think that driver behaviour has a larger impact on risk (as I see it anyway) then any other single factor. Drive defensively and within your limits. I suspect that a scooterist who drives carefully has a lower risk of getting involved in an accident then the 'typical' car driver.

I think I set an example of conservation by driving my scooter to work. Even if the folks I work with don't go out and buy a scooter, perhaps I am inspiring them to conserve in other ways more compatible with their lifestyle. If not, so what, I only spend $6 USD on gas a week to drive to work! Rasberries to them if they have a problem with it.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:37 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
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Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:37 pm linkquote
Chazzlee wrote:
One suggestion tho; if you do use the self-serving reason of giving it up tor "others", I suggest you not tell them about it. You'd be surprised; they might not like you for doing it, and they may not even appreciate your noble sacrifices for them. -Especially if you blame them for your having to stop riding later on, as many people do who give up things "for others..."
Very good point. I can see how one could get bitter about not riding. Obviously you don't make this decision unless you can live happily with it.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:41 pm

Ossessionato
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:41 pm linkquote
briguy wrote:
Too risky? Well, its measurably more risky than a car, but I think that driver behaviour has a larger impact on risk (as I see it anyway) then any other single factor. Drive defensively and within your limits. I suspect that a scooterist who drives carefully has a lower risk of getting involved in an accident then the 'typical' car driver.
C'mon man - it is definately more risky! Yes, driving behaviour, yada yada. But there is one HUGE difference - 1 mistake on a scooter does not equal one mistake in a car. Cars are made with safety features in mind - scooters, not so much. 300 lbs with no real protection vs. a 1500 lb monster metal frame. One accident going 40 mph on a scooter probably means broken bone of some type, burns - 40 mph in a car is totaled car, but most likely walk away relatively unscathed.

Last edited by Wangta on Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:51 pm; edited 4 times in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:42 pm

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2009 GTV 250
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Location: Olympia, WA
 
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:42 pm linkquote
I'm 57....
..................and hopefully can go till I'm 97 on a scooter. Cathy and I were on Vancouver Island a few years back and met a guy who looked 70, turned out he was 90 and riding a Harley. I really don't think you can EVER give up what you love to do, just maybe find a easier way to do it if the time comes.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:42 pm

Member
GTS
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Location: Seattle
 
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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:42 pm linkquote
43 here and drive to work 3-4 days a week on my scooter. I usually take the car if I have to visit clients or if the weather is really bad in the morning. My wife also drives a Vespa and we both have larger motorcycles too.

Too risky? Well, its measurably more risky than a car, but I think that driver behaviour has a larger impact on risk (as I see it anyway) then any other single factor. Drive defensively and within your limits. I suspect that a scooterist who drives carefully has a lower risk of getting involved in an accident then the 'typical' car driver.

I think I set an example of conservation by driving my scooter to work. Even if the folks I work with don't go out and buy a scooter, perhaps I am inspiring them to conserve in other ways more compatible with their lifestyle. If not, so what, I only spend $6 USD on gas a week to drive to work! Rasberries to them if they have a problem with it.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:48 pm

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Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:48 pm linkquote
I'm 44 and plan to keep riding until I physically can't anymore.

It is a question of choices and values, both real and perceived. Is riding a scooter safer to you than driving a car? If it isn't then you should give it up. If your family and/or co-workers (boss, board, etc.) have issues with you riding, then you have to make a decision based on your own values.

We are talking about a package deal here - your mind and body are affected by your choice of work and your commuting options. Does sitting behind a desk all day make you healthier (safer) or less healthy (unsafe)? How do car related stresses, such as sitting in traffic, filling your gas tank, keeping it maintained affect you? Does eating fried foods, drinking and smoking make you healthier or not? I could go on but I made my point.

I ride as safely as I can in an unsafe world, and I know full well it could all end at any point and time, for any reason. If you let fear of what could happen and spend your live avoiding doing things that could hurt you, that would be a sad life indeed.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:57 pm

Molto Verboso
GT200. Buddy 125.
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Posts: 1617
Location: NJ
 
Molto Verboso
GT200. Buddy 125.
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Posts: 1617
Location: NJ
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:57 pm linkquote
Wangta01 wrote:
Chazzlee wrote:
Why? You only need to do that in life where and when you really want to, y'know?
Hmm, you say that but I'm not so sure you could ignore this in real life. Say your wife, parents, and KIDS asked you to stop riding because it scared the crap out of them. What would you tell them? FU - I'll do what I want? I believe in doing what is best for yourself, but sometimes its not that easy. Imagine your family without you in the picture. How would their life be?
Perhaps better? Anyway, certainly different...
But there's no guarantees any of us will outlive any others of us, is there?
Life after all, is not life, without death...

And as for your own off-track assumptions about me having to say "FU" to my family,
I have to say that I don't talk to my family that way! Not ever!

And if my 'ol lady or my daughter asked me to stop, I'd still have to ask them why they wanted me to stop; did they consider my riding abilities to be impaired with age now, or what? (Which is the only future reason I can ever consider them even asking me!)
And then I'd still have to make up my own mind as to whether I wanted to acquiesce to their requests or not. My family is pretty much not enmeshed; we allow each other the space to grow and learn and experiment, and we try not to step on each other's lives. And we also try very hard not to lay the responsibility or blame for our own decisions onto others... 8)

But if you do stop riding because I suggested you do so, I'll be generous and let you blame me for your decision, okay?
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:57 pm

Hooked
GTS250
Joined: 24 Sep 2008
Posts: 142
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
 
Hooked
GTS250
Joined: 24 Sep 2008
Posts: 142
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:57 pm linkquote
hardly foolproof statistics but a random sample. not normalized for number of vehicles, or anything else.

In raw numbers, the annual death toll in motorcycle crashes rose from 2,116 in 1997 to 4,810 of 2006.

The total number of people killed in highway crashes in 2001 was 42,116

The CDC estimates that in the US more than 100,000 people are hospitalized and more than 20,000 people die from the flu and its complications every year.

"Heart attack" Mortality 451,326 deaths in the United States in 2004

If it's your time, it's your time, on a scooter, in a cage or on the couch. Buy insurance and do what you love. Ride smart, Ride safe, Toreador Pants, remember they will kill you if they get a chance, then do what you love.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:19 pm

Hooked
GTS250, Rally 200, 125 t.s.
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 180
Location: Olde Canberry
 
Hooked
GTS250, Rally 200, 125 t.s.
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 180
Location: Olde Canberry
Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:19 pm linkquote
As you increase in years, if you feel your reaction times are getting too slow and you're losing your sense of balance and it's just too crazy out there - I'd say yes, do indeed stop riding. Hopefully that won't happen for a while yet.

Having said that, there is one guy in his 80's in my town who rides a Gilera Fuoco. He's a WWII navy veteran and rode motorbikes in his young days. After decades of not riding he bought a Vespa ET4 about eight years ago, then upgraded to a GTS, then a Scarabeo 500, and now the Fuoco. He even rode the GTS from here to Broken Hill and back - that's 963 km each way. Good on ya Derek, you're an inspiration to us all!

Not sure what the OP means by 'Asia', but in many Asian countries scooters and small motorbikes are just a normal way of getting around, regardless of age. Of course you all knew that...

Last edited by SWMLDR Bill on Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:19 pm

Molto Verboso
GTS 250
Joined: 28 Apr 2006
Posts: 1093
Location: San Diego
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 250
Joined: 28 Apr 2006
Posts: 1093
Location: San Diego
Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:19 pm linkquote
I honestly hope to never make it to that point
Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:54 pm

Member
GT200
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 7
Location: Fort Collins, CO
 
Member
GT200
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 7
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:54 pm linkquote
Responsibility to Life and Living
When my children were babes, I stopped by cycle-commuting to work, as I now had more responsibilities, and needed to be more responsible.

Now that I'm 50 and my children are grown, I realize that what children need most is the role models of persuing their passions. Lead healthy happy lives. Follow your folly.

As for which risks are acceptable, those can only be left to individuals. I suspect the innocent child left behind by a climber who died on a mountaintop is far better off than the one whose father "hid" his passions behind the needs to be responsible.

Buy life insurance. Develop proficiency. Live full and pass it on! life insurance. Develop proficiency. Live full and pass it on.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:17 pm

Addicted
GTS250ie
Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 570

 
Addicted
GTS250ie
Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 570

Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:17 pm linkquote
I ride my Vespa to work every day.

My boss's boss wants a Vespa now.

It works great with business casual clothes (vs riding a motorcycle).

I got teased a little at first, but now the women in the office want "scooter rides" around the parking lot at lunch. Since then, another guy got a Vespa, but they don't ask him for scooter rides...
Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:44 pm

Ossessionato
2011 GTS 300 Super 2013 BMW K1600 GTL
Joined: 26 Nov 2006
Posts: 4013
Location: Irvine, CA
 
Ossessionato
2011 GTS 300 Super 2013 BMW K1600 GTL
Joined: 26 Nov 2006
Posts: 4013
Location: Irvine, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:44 pm linkquote
This should have been a poll.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:53 pm

Hooked
'08 S150
Joined: 09 Aug 2008
Posts: 324
Location: New Mexico
 
Hooked
'08 S150
Joined: 09 Aug 2008
Posts: 324
Location: New Mexico
Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:53 pm linkquote
I just turned 45, and I've riden my Vespa exclusively for all commuting, and all short trips, since I bought it. My wife and I take a car or the truck when we're going somewhere together, but that's about it.

My female boss laughed a me when I said I was getting a Vespa, because she said she'd have to keep explaining to people that I wasn't gay. But we covered that pretty well in another thread...
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:00 pm

Banned
Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 2919

 
Banned
Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 2919

Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:00 pm linkquote
Wangta01 wrote:
Chazzlee wrote:
Why? You only need to do that in life where and when you really want to, y'know?
Hmm, you say that but I'm not so sure you could ignore this in real life. Say your wife, parents, and KIDS asked you to stop riding because it scared the crap out of them. What would you tell them? FU - I'll do what I want? I believe in doing what is best for yourself, but sometimes its not that easy. Imagine your family without you in the picture. How would their life be?
My wife doesn't like me riding, but sorry to bad. It is the one thing I really enjoy doing. It puts a smile on my face every morning when I hop on the MP3, and I miss it when I can't.

Get real good term life insurance and ride safe.

Wayne B
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:08 pm

Hooked
bunch "o" bikes
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 226
Location: Trail, B.C, Canada
 
Hooked
bunch "o" bikes
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 226
Location: Trail, B.C, Canada
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:08 pm linkquote
This is one of those threads that I just dont understand.
I've been driving bikes since I was 5, scooters since 16...I'm now 43 and have more bikes than ever, 3 dirtbikes, 12 scooters 2 motorcycles and a snowmobile.
If I can time it right, I'll fall over dead at the end of a cross country ride when I'm "older"
If I didn't think burial was stupid, I would be buried sitting on my SS.

I have my own buissness, employees, wife, kids, all that stuff.
Bikes are me...
If my wife asked me to stop riding the answer would be "ummm....no"

More people have died stepping off the sidewalk in the last 10 years than have EVER died on bikes. So by your logic, you should stop walking if your a "responsible" guy
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:12 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:12 pm linkquote
sean s wrote:
This is one of those threads that I just dont understand.
I've been driving bikes since I was 5, scooters since 16...I'm now 43 and have more bikes than ever, 3 dirtbikes, 12 scooters 2 motorcycles and a snowmobile.
If I can time it right, I'll fall over dead at the end of a cross country ride when I'm "older"
If I didn't think burial was stupid, I would be buried sitting on my SS.

I have my own buissness, employees, wife, kids, all that stuff.
Bikes are me...
If my wife asked me to stop riding the answer would be "ummm....no"

More people have died stepping off the sidewalk in the last 10 years than have EVER died on bikes. So by your logic, you should stop walking if your a "responsible" guy
Well, if you don't understand, I'm not sure I can explain it any better. Just think of it this way - what would you say if one of your kids had a passion for something you inherantly saw as very very dangerous. How would you feel?

We're all different - this topic comes on my mind often when I ride. It hasn't stopped me yet, but I wonder if things will change in the future.

"More people have died stepping off the sidewalk in the last 10 years than have EVER died on bikes. " - Not sure I believe this. Is this true? Doesn't make sense to me!

Last edited by Wangta on Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:17 pm

Hooked
Piaggio LT150
Joined: 16 Jun 2007
Posts: 237
Location: Seattle, WA
 
Hooked
Piaggio LT150
Joined: 16 Jun 2007
Posts: 237
Location: Seattle, WA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:17 pm linkquote
I'll stop riding my scooter when I am physically unable to keep riding. My riding habits may change as I get older, but for the forseeable future, my scooter is my primary mode of transportation. It saves me money it is more fun, and a lot of times just generally makes my life easier than being in a car.

personally, I feel MUCH safer on my scooter than I do in a car. I know I am much more vulnerable, but I feel like I am more in tune with my surroundings and more able to get out of a potentially dangerous situation on a scooter than I would be in my car.

bad, terrible shit happens to people for no good reason all of the time. all you can do is knock on wood and hope it doesn't happen to you or the people you care about. if i was going to live my life in fear of what would happen if i got into an accident, i would stop and think that maybe being on two wheels could be a poor life decision for me, not to mention leaving my house because what if an engine from a passing jet were to fall off and land on me?
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:26 pm

Hooked
Joined: 04 Jun 2008
Posts: 362
Location: Austin, Texas
 
Hooked
Joined: 04 Jun 2008
Posts: 362
Location: Austin, Texas
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:26 pm linkquote
I'm 51, and this is my first motorized 2-wheeler. It is now my primary mode of traveling to/from work, running errands, and having fun (the car stays parked most of the time now). I'm self-employed and don't have a family, and I presume that I have a fair number of years ahead of me yet before I may become a menace to other motorists. When that day comes though, I won't want to give up my freedom to get around on my own, let alone think about having to go to an assisted living facility by myself . . . so I'll probably just do a "Thelma & Louise" and drive off a cliff somewhere
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:34 pm

Ossessionato
LX 150
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 2538
Location: Danville, Va
 
Ossessionato
LX 150
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 2538
Location: Danville, Va
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:34 pm linkquote
Re: Vespa Riding as you get "Older"...Irresponsibl
Wangta01 wrote:
I had someone mention something to me that made pause and think - what happens if you're a vital part of an organization (CEO, CFO)? I think everyone would agree that riding scooter/motorcycle is more dangerous than driving a car. Is it irresponsible to ride to work when you're "vital" to a company and its respective employees, shareholders?

one name
Malcolm Forbes
Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia wrote:
Malcolm Forbes became a motorcyclist late in life. He founded and rode with a motorcycle club called the Capitalist Tools. His estate in New Jersey was a regular meeting place for tours that he organized for fellow New Jersey and New York motorcyclists. He had a stable of motorcycles but was partial to Harley Davidson machines. He was known for his gift of Purple Passion, a Harley-Davidson, to actress Elizabeth Taylor. He was also instrumental in getting legislation passed to allow motorcycles on the cars-only Garden State Parkway in New Jersey. He was inducted to the Motorcycle Hall of Fame in 1999.
Wangta01 wrote:
With this in mind - How long can I/we, or should I/we, keep riding?
Look I don't mean to sound rude, but if this is what you think about when riding maybe you should just park it for a while.


And Malcolm he died of a heart attack at 70

peace
messy
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:41 pm

Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 39663
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
 
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 39663
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:41 pm linkquote
Wangta01 wrote:
Well, if you don't understand, I'm not sure I can explain it any better. Just think of it this way - what would you say if one of your kids had a passion for something you inherantly saw as very very dangerous. How would you feel?.
Worried, but glad they were living their own life. My elder son joined the British Army - yes of course I was anxious, but I was very glad for him - and it has given him so much.

So your offspring wants to be a mountaineer? Great! A bike rider? Great! Life is inherently risky - it's how the individuals manage the hazards that's important.

I am saddened by the results of the Dettox generation - all worry, no adrenaline or useful antibodies.

Last edited by jimc on Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:41 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:41 pm linkquote
Re: Vespa Riding as you get "Older"...Irresponsibl
messycoloring wrote:
Wangta01 wrote:
I had someone mention something to me that made pause and think - what happens if you're a vital part of an organization (CEO, CFO)? I think everyone would agree that riding scooter/motorcycle is more dangerous than driving a car. Is it irresponsible to ride to work when you're "vital" to a company and its respective employees, shareholders?

one name
Malcolm Forbes
Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia wrote:
Malcolm Forbes became a motorcyclist late in life. He founded and rode with a motorcycle club called the Capitalist Tools. His estate in New Jersey was a regular meeting place for tours that he organized for fellow New Jersey and New York motorcyclists. He had a stable of motorcycles but was partial to Harley Davidson machines. He was known for his gift of Purple Passion, a Harley-Davidson, to actress Elizabeth Taylor. He was also instrumental in getting legislation passed to allow motorcycles on the cars-only Garden State Parkway in New Jersey. He was inducted to the Motorcycle Hall of Fame in 1999.
Wangta01 wrote:
With this in mind - How long can I/we, or should I/we, keep riding?
Look I don't mean to sound rude, but if this is what you think about when riding maybe you should just park it for a while.


And Malcolm he died of a heart attack at 70

peace
messy
Wow guys. Little surprised by how open and shut this seems to be. Are you guys telling me you don't think about this at all? Honestly, I'm a little surprised by people's responses here. I don't mean to offend anyone, but most comments seem to contain "me, me, me". Look, I understand EVERYONE here LOVES riding and has a serious passion for it.

But this is not about questioning your passion, reasons for riding, etc. Obviously we all know these reasons. Its about THINKING about trading something you love, for the betterment of OTHER PEOPLE! Other people!!!!! We're talking about sacrifice - for your family, to put it as simply as I can. Or atleast thinking about it.

Basically people's answer here seems to be "its not that dangerous. I could die walking down the street. I would never give up riding, even for family.". When you put it like that, seems a little one dimensional eh?

I understand you all love riding. But there are other things in life BESIDES scootering. We all take on risks whenever we ride - but thinking about the big picture is something I think we all need to do - not for ourselves, but for your loved ones.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:42 pm

Enthusiast
Siena Ivory LXV
Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 78
Location: Sonoma County, CA
 
Enthusiast
Siena Ivory LXV
Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 78
Location: Sonoma County, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:42 pm linkquote
My daughter developed a passion for horses at age 2. By age 6 she was riding and by 8 going over jumps. I would not tell her that she could not ride a horse because of the dangers, but I explained to her that her job was to master herself, think through her difficulties and persevere. Yes, there were numerous times when I did not breathe for long minutes, but her experiences with horses were invaluable.
Commuting via air is far more dangerous than via Vespa, yet would you ask the same question of the executive commuting on a commercial jet? At least on the Vespa, the rider has some control.
Life has risk attached.
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:45 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:45 pm linkquote
eSprit wrote:
Commuting via air is far more dangerous than via Vespa, yet would you ask the same question of the executive commuting on a commercial jet? At least on the Vespa, the rider has some control.
Life has risk attached.
? How did you calculate that? The chances of having a serious/injury-causing accident on a motorcycle is much higher than having a serious injury in a car, and airplanes are actually safer than cars. So how is airplane more dangerous than motorcycle? Not sure I agree with your numbers.

Last edited by Wangta on Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
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