Modern Vespa

Hey everybody! Was looking on the web at Peugeot scooter models and wondering why nobody imports or sells them here in the States. I don't know the whole history of Peugeot scooters, but I remember their cars here in the late 80's and early 90's. I love my Vespa, but they make some pretty cool rides, such as the Speedfight, that I would love to add to my collection. It seems like they would be popular here. Anybody have any thoughts on why they are not selling in the USA right now? Here's the website I was looking at: http://www.peugeotscooters.com/international.php?lang=en

Peugeot scooters were here in the USA perhaps 5 years ago. I used to see the Speedfight 50s on ebay. They probably disappeared due to a poor dealer network.

Maybe they're still mad at us about the mid east war. It's kind of like when we had a shortage of flu vaccine because something went wrong in England's production. The Canadians had plenty of vaccine, the US was hard pressed. We didn't buy their vaccine. I looked at Peugot's website and they sure do have plenty of 50cc bikes. It was like looking at the Kymco website. The designs look similar. They probably out source to China anyway.

The Peugeots imported to the US were gray market machines that, among things, did not meet US DOT specs. The importer was not quite kosher, but he did set up a dealer network. They are great machines, but for whatever reasons, Peugeot has no interest in making the small, dedicated production runs required to legally export their machines to the US.

We used to rent Peugeot Elyseos when we vacationed here (before we moved), and loved them. In Late 2003, IIRC, I was very tempted to buy a new Elystar (successor to the Elyseo) 150 from a reputable dealer in Seattle. He demonstrated how to start it, saying, "First, be sure the headlight switch is in the OFF position". That immediately rang "TILT" in my mind and I asked him how the scoot could comply with US standards with a headlight that could be turned off. Further, that switch was where an engine kill switch would be. TILT Number Two. Also conspicuously missing were the mandatory side mounted reflectors. The dealer was truly stumped, as he really thought the importer was kosher.

I did test ride the scoot, and it was great, but the irregularities led me to hold off a bit on buying while I poked further into the situation. About three months later, the whole Peugeot in the USA business came crashing down. The last I saw of it was the "importer" liquidating the Elystars on Ebay, but never delivering any to the unsuspecting buyers.

Talk in the scoot community was that the importer in Florida was buying them in quantity through/from the legitimate distributor in Bermuda and then bringing them into the US from there "as is", without meeting US standards. Thus, he was not a real "Authorized" Peugeot distributor/importer. The talk continues that he ultimately ran afoul of both Peugeot and the US Govt (for obvious reasons), putting him out of business.

Keep in mind that this took place at the very start of "Scooter Mania", when US Customs was letting boatloads of non-compliant stuff into the country due to lack of familiarity with the products. When they caught on, shipments of non-compliant scooters were regularly and routinely barred from entering the US. I remember one importer offering a container full of Chinese scoots for sale, clearly stipulating that they were in bonded storage at the port of Los Angeles and could not "enter" the US, but were perfect for sale in several South American countries.

Bryce-O-Rama knows more about it.

Al

Why none in the U.S.? Simple:

1) The brand has the word "poo" in the name, and

2) It also contains a frenchified version of the name, "Joe," which Americans are sick of hearing.

Peugeot is coming to Canada starting 2009! I believe first for Quebec and then hopefully for the rest of Canada after that.

As great as the Peugot product is for racing, long term reliability, Popularity in Europe, outstanding design and so on, the main problem that the US has is with the country of origin - probably warranty support as well. Which explains Benito's response.

I've had a couple P cars - but them for $50 with 150-200k miles, fix whatever simple thing had broken that the Lube-N-Tune couldn't (Peugot owners are usually CHEAP!) for $50 and then drive the poo out of it for 15k miles then dump it on CL.

Recent Peugot 24 Hours of LeMons victory too: http://teamlemon.blogspot.com/

I see a lot of their scooters here in Germany. The 125cc engine seems to be the most common, although it's used in a couple of different models.

They also have some interesting cars that I like (a hard top convertable for example), but the compliance issue for US specs will keep me from bringing one home.

Not sure about the quality, but they can't be too bad - I think they are the #1 importer to Germany. Europe is quickly moving to more restrictive standards than the US for auto emmissions, so once that's done the hard part is over. I think US specs require a different type of safety glass, some weird deal with the tailights and a speedo that works in MPH - not difficult or expensive fixes.

I suspect once the emmision thing is fixed (the expensive part), you may see a flood of foriegn makes on US highways. The deisels here are phenomenal, but won't run on US deisel (to crude/dirty).

Oh, I didn't vote in the poll - I am thinking Suzuki Burman Exec or the Gilera 800 for my next scoot, neither was an option.

I'll keep the GT though - I love that scooter!

Thanks for all the info and insight, everybody! The poll is more limited in options than I realized. I forgot to add the Genuine scooters as well as Suzuki. I really appreciate all the info you had Aviator47 and oldswimcoach! Masala, you had me laughing out loud with your comment! Modern Vespa really has a great group of people with a wealth of knowledge and that's why I like it so much! Hopefully we will see Peugeot scooters here soon after Canada starts getting them. I really dig the whole "supercharger on a 125" thing! As for the cars, would love to see the Alfa-Romeos, Fiats, Renaults and Peugeots back on the road here in the States. Growing up there were all kinds of makes and models. I got my driver's license in 1993 and by that time there wasn't much of a choice in autos besides domestic, Japanese, or expensive German cars (VW aside) and expensive Italian cars. My paid off Mazda is in my driveway at home most of the time. My Vespa has become my main ride everywhere I go! It's just a fantastic machine, easy on gas, and great to park here in San Diego. I was a little scared to buy it at first, because I had heard that anything made in Europe would fall apart, but it's a great piece of machinery and I would totally buy another vehicle from a European manufacturer now in a heartbeat! I'm enjoying the posts and reading everybody's comments! Keep them coming!

Benito, I'm totally jealous! Go Peugeot Canada 2009!

your lucky you don't get peugeot scooters

Quite, they're known as Pugshite here. Pricey to maintain.

Are they known to be reliable or unreliable? Their cars never had a good reputation when we used to get them here.

But so are Piaggio/Vespa.

To be fair, I've never personally owned one. But I've heard tales from those who have! My impression is that their reliability is not nearly as good as Piaggio's, even assuming all services are done on time etc. That's hearsay however, so I'd wait for someone with experience of the breed...

Don't Peugeot scooters have Piaggio engines?

Some now do.

The reviews are all excellent, so I don't know. Worse comment I've heard is the push button doesn't always work cold, but kick always does. I'm concerned over quality as they're made in China, but so are Piaggio so it's all relative. Chinese quality can be great.

At last years bike show the importer to Canada had promised me a full range of size from 50cc to 500cc. They are supposed to be still cheaper then Vespa. I hear they will compete price wise with Aprillia or Piaggio quite nicely. No. I don't know for sure but Peugeot already makes engines and I can't see them outsourcing them to the competition. But stranger alliances have happened.

Eh. I don't like how they look and they don't have any compelling models. The Geopolis is too big and heavy.

I'm keeping my eye out for the new Sportcity One 125/150 cc.

Indeed, Piaggo/ Vespa is far more expensive to buy und to maintain as the Peugeot !

Actually, Peugeot are good scooters and cars (cars are far far better than the other french manufacturers - but still under the quality of Audi, Mercedes & Co....)....so my experienece in terms of cars....

Tony

According to my UK friends, Peugeot are more expensive to maintain than Piaggio here. I understand you often pay twice what we do for Piaggio parts in the US, so that may be part of it.

Watching Patrick and Pete cannonball across the country on SYM HD200s confirmed what I already strongly suspected, that the HD200 is the sweet spot right now in available USA scooters. Peugeot scooters suffer from "doing things differently just for the sake of doing things differently" syndrome. Same deal with Peugeot automobiles. Sorry.

...that may be the case outside France .... in Germany the prices are the ssame than in France but outside, especially far abroad or in the UK, the importers are indeed womehow quite hungry...LOL.....

Yes but it can be good for the consumers...for example Peugeot als 1st for the metal roof cabriolet like the mercedes CLK etc...or the moving front lighting ...

Pugs are dugs, but the local teenage cognescenti seem to rate the Speedfight highly...

Not what I heard on some UK forums....
But, anything has to be better than the Chinese crap.....

I had a friend in college back in the 70's with a Peugeot automobile. I just remember that she kept having to put the carb back on it when it fell off.

well I've forgiven them enough to start buying the wine again, but scooters... nay

I've seen a few Lambretta with the same problem.

And with good reason. The dealership from which I bought my Peugeot called them "Pig twats." I owned a 1982 505 STI which was the second most problematic car I ever owned (a 1990 Honda Acord was the worst).

The Peugeots that have been placed in rental service here seem to have held up well, and rental is a rugged business. 2003 Models are still in a couple of dealers' fleets. MSRP is what kept them from being widely used, as Piaggio Typhoons, Liberties, and now Kymcos, cost less to purchase and are very dependable.

Al

It's pretty expensive, particularly for a company with bikes that cost as much or more than Piaggio/Vespa but without the name recognition.

You're quite right that the importer was not at all kosher. He blatantly lied to me over the course of several emails about things that were obvious to anyone. I never knew where he was getting the bikes, but that would explain an awful lot. He couldn't get parts for anything. You've covered it pretty thoroughly. Funny. I've poured more money into the Piaggio made engine of my Pug than I have into anything else on the bike. Mine has an air cooled Piaggio LEADER 150. Many of the other ones have Honda engines.

Here's a Peugeot 50cc Elystar for sale in Bellingham, WA. The engine is a 2 stroke, fuel injected version. Note the lack of side reflectors. That's the way they were delivered.

The engine has a unique computer that is diagnosed and programmed using a Gameboy with a special card from Peugeot. The card was never made available to the public. "Derestricting" the engine requires this special Gameboy to place the engine control computer into the "Free" mode. Otherwise, it's limited to about 50 kph to meet moped status. The EU had been grumbling that 50cc machines were too easy to derestrict with simple hand tools, and Peugeot thought they would be ahead of the game with this approach. But the grumbling never rose above that level.

When the 50cc Elystar was set in the "free" mode, it easily cruised at 75+ kph with no further mods. The injected engine had great power off the line. It's a very comfortable machine, but the mirrors mounted on the body were much less desirable than its predecessor's (Elyseo) handlebar mounted mirrors. The 150 Version used the Piaggio LEADER engine, much like Bryce's Luxor.

Al

[quote="Masala"]Why none in the U.S.? Simple:

1) The brand has the word "poo" in the name, and

2) It also contains a frenchified version of the name, "Joe," which Americans are sick of hearing.

[/quote]