Modern Vespa

[quote="AlexBv200"]I see a BUNCH of Pick ups with very long trailers full of mostly HD and choppers..
What do you think these are?

I think it's their idea of a road trip.

The are no real details of the impact of HD's motocycle financing division...this leaks compounds the revenue decline (write off on bad dept...remember "sub. prime" fiasco in the real estate industry? * (my assesment)

> 1000 employee reduction 11% (50% will be in Milwaukee) this is on top of 1400 to 1500 job cuts ealier this year...that's a total of ~ 2400 employees.

> Retails sales during last quarter fell 35%. Industry wide 48%. International was only 18%.

> Sales push is in Latin America, Europe and China to offset sales in US.

> CEO Keith Wandell took over in May 2009

> Van Conway, Conwy MacKenzie Inc. (turnaround firm), "demand may never to back where it was...got to go back to core people that love them" *

> Stock (HOG) actually went up based on investor optimism (my opnion)...check past 52 week low / high.

* I've got my own take on how we should be on refocusing efforts in the U.S. market by tapping in on the latent market of potential riders vs. going
after just current riders. i.e. How many non-MC riders would take up on offer of having "free" get aquainted offer by HD to attend a riding /safety class utilizing their bikes?

In the market for a motorcycle - Harley is on my list now due to this thread - I like the Iron 883 and am test driving/riding one on Thursday - if I like it more than the Triumph will jump on it. Was told today, can have one for me in 2 weeks which is a more than reasonable wait at the normal cost too. Hope to help them out with their numbers....

Also in 12 month they will give you full trade in value if you trade -up for a larger bike. thats a great deal for a new Hd rider

WOW! Buy a Harley, get a new wife. Now THAT is an incentive program, better than any rebate or 0% financing. Do you trade your old wife in?

When comparing the two bikes, look at the maintenance intervals and what is required at each. I think you'll be surprised.


On a separate note... I find it odd that one of the favorite pastimes for some members of this forum is to bash HD and HD riders. Reasons I find this odd are below. (Disclaimer, if you had asked me a year ago if I would ever own a HD, I would have told you no.)

1. One argument is that HD is over-priced for the market and if they want to increase their share they need more affordable accessible models. Umm... isn't Vespa in the same boat when compared to Genuine, Sym, Kymco? All make fine scoots for far less money than a Vespa.

2. HD riders are douchebag, fashionista poseurs. So, how many threads are there on MV about what jacket to get, helmet to get, generic piece of farkle to bolt to their scoot? Seems like the same thing to me.

3. HD riders are bike snobs. Well, so are a good portion of scooterists. How many "Vintage Only" rallies have your heard about. How many times have you seen a MV rider look down their nose at someone on a Buddy or People?

It's really easy to make generalizations about any group. However, be mindful that many of those same generalizations can be applied to you as well from someone on the outside looking in.

Remember, asshats come in all shapes, sizes, genders and sexual orientations, and it's not the machine that distinguishes them from the crowd, it's their attitude.

What would be better is if you could just get a new girlfriend... They're cheaper to replace.

When I ride My GTS or My Streetglide, people smile give thumbs ups and ask questios about the bike, So I would say people like them both and both are fine motorcycles.

Well said,

But I think you'll find there are a few more similarities between Harleys and Vespas:


Both companies had/have a die hard loyal fan base (that made the bikes the icons they are today)

Both companies introduced new models (Harley Evo engine - Vespa E2 and E4) and new marketing plans (boutiques/closing older shops that didn't fit the marketing/ boutiques/ image ) that alienated the past loyal fans.

You forgot:

Up until a few years ago, they were strictly air-cooled. Now they both have a water-cooled bikes in their lineups.

In response to tater's #3, I never looked down on anyone while on my Vespa. Same goes while on my HD.

I love harleys except i'm too damn short to ride almost all of their bikes. The sportster (nightster) is probably short enough, but none of the dealers here would let me sit on them

I like my GT, but its almost too tall for me The HD Sportster is actually reasonably priced, I just don't like the HD scene around here. Gotta get all dressed up in leather and HD shirts. Most people here don't even wear helmets which bothers me too. Not surprised HD isnt doing well, most companies aren't.

Wow! That's absurd. The dealers around here let you even take them for a test ride, something I've not been able to do at Yamwaszukida dealers.

Though I am not a fan of Harley motorcycles, I think they have the strongest dealership network and really understand branding better in the US than any other motorcycle company. They may be going through hard times and may be down but they aren't going to go out any time in the near future. I do like their Buells and hope they main stream them more. They always do something funky which I think throws them into a niche machine. Hopefully their MV Augusta purchase will help them as well.

While Harley's market may be shrinking, they have a remarkable ability to attract that outlaw dirtbag segment and the outlaw dirtbag wannabe market and there doesn't seem to be any shortage of that market.

Harley, as Vespa, does'nt usually respond to the trend of the week. But they do, sadly, to the token passenger seat which some think is cool. But most every model is available with the Sundowner Seat, which has an excellent passenger portion. It's their best seat aside from the outstanding Electraglide seat.

some responses to previous posts:

1) less profit means less profit. Not less money/sales. So if they have lower profits, maybe more people are buying the less expensive harleys where the profits are slimmer. i.e. more sportsters less road kings.
2) demographics. I don't think harley has no bikes that appeal to younger people, the vrod and sporster compete perfectly with muscle bikes and classic bikes (guzzi, triumph). I think they just need to market themselves that way, and not mix fat boys with sporsters.
3) while motorcycles above 250cc are not green (you reach the fuel efficiency of a 5 passenger motor vehicle with poorer emissions at the 500cc point) harley could do something in one of their lineups that shows they are on the ball. They obviously don't want to be a 'green' company because that is not their mission, but it will move more iron so to speak if they had a road-king hybrid which sounds blasphemous but with the size and weight and cost it can be done. Or simply a new engine that has the power of the 883 but is half the displacement (and weight). The trick will be getting it to 'sound' harley.
4) since harleys are belt drive anyway, they are very close to just running a cvt. I think that would bring in a ton of people who would never try a harley before because its now safer/easier - at the risk of diluting the brand demographic (which is the point no?)

Seth

There is a huge difference between Earning 91% less profit and Losing Billions.

My Street Glide (same motor and frame as a Road King, but heavier) averages 45mpg and I have seen as high as 52. While not scooter numbers, it puts it in the same range as the Prius. Starting in 2006 all motorcycles sold in the US are limited to CO2 emissions of 12.0 g/km. For comparison... everyone's favorite green car, the Prius, has a CO2 number of 104 g/km. So I am not sure where the bikes over 500 have more emissions than a 5 passenger car thing came from.

I'm not sure this is applicable everywhere, but I have found riding around here (NSW Australia) that Harley riders are the most friendly of the "Bike" riders towards this Vespa rider. Jap sportsbike riders will completely ignore me because I'm obviously a faggot (correct at least!), riders of more fancy European machinery will happily talk about their own machines, but Harley riders will engage in conversation!!

Except the ones who wear white Nikes, that is...

going with the Iron 883 - great ride, just put money down and hope to have shortly! Anyways, I'm trading in the GTV (for a Harley) never thought that was possible...

Anybody interested in a 2007 GTV for like $4500? 3600 miles, it's in MPLS extras on it - there is a small ding in the rt cowl (only noticeable at a certain angle) but other than that very clean. I will reserect the FS thread/thx for looking

Nice bike its the same size as the 1200, have fun and try to resist dressing like a pirate.

Time to visit your local Snap-On dealer and get a good set of Torx and allen drivers. HD loves those things.

Cong-Rats! 8)

I hear ya! My 09 Street Bob has just the solo seat (which looks really cool) and I bought a stick on Phantom seat pad for the occasional passenger. I did this because most of the time I'll be solo. But.. that seat blows and so I've been looking at the Sundowner for quite a while now.
Thing is, I use the Duc for distance 2 up riding, and it looks like I'll now use the Vespa for 'local' 2 up riding!
p.s. best mod to my Dyna were 13.5 inch 440 shocks. Transformed the bike...

Very cool!

Sorry, I meant to say efficiency, not emissions. Which is exactly my point.

I'm not saying they have to go hybrid or make a 50cc model, they can keep their existing line, just make them flex fuel or have a diesel model.

Seth