Modern Vespa

Here is what I did. Dropped my bike in a parking lot turning a tight corner and then coming to a stop. Since the turn was under 3mph no real damage was done except to my ever-present and over-inflated ego.
Here is what I know. When making a tight turn and then stopping, never, never, never use the front brake 'cause you're goin' down! At the time of the drop, I was trying to find that illusive "friction zone" Motorman talks about on Ride Like a Pro using my left brake and the throttle to control speed. Well.. that worked well on my LX150 but the Piaggio has an integrated braking system so I can't use the brakes without using the front brake.
Question. How do you handle a slow turn at walking speed without using the brakes during the turn and then stop?

You don't! I don't know what "friction zone" you're practicing, but you never use the brakes to a full stop during a turn. Not without straightening out the front wheel first, or you're going down!

I practice the same during turn. If I ever apply any braking (slowing) it's the rear along with the throttle (throttle control)...never the front brake. While in a turn I never apply full braking...only when I have wheels up and straight.

Note: Friction zone applies to bikes with a clutch...which in essence provides a braking effect...the use of the clutch and rear brake is referred to as "dragging the rear brake".

However, I believe what fun2ride is referring to is (and I forgot the specifics) but some bikes will have a braking system whereby if you apply the rear brake there is an a slight application of the front brake...however, I was led to believe that this would happen only if the rear brake was applied rather firmly.

Regardless, braking to a stop should not occur while in turn...need to get the wheel straight and then apply brakes. My threat indicators go up whenever I'm into a slow turn (especailly in a cogested enviroment) and remind myself to right myself as soon as possible.

The Piaggio 'integrated brake system' uses zero front brake while under "30%" pressure is used on the back brake lever. So over-application might have been the cause...

The X9s have a very equivalent (I won't say identical) system - and the back brake used gently is very effective in slow control.

Methinks more practice is in order. Yes, I still practice every time I can - as doing tight turns in anger can happen out of the blue. Passing a test doing one two year's ago is eff-all use when it's raining hard and you suddenly have a very tight (non-UK) right-hander...

I would avoid turning all together. Those big wheels are meant to go straight.

I agree with the other poster. Try not to use your brakes in a tight turn. I've nearly taken a fall a few times doing the same thing. If you start to wobble, straighten up first and then brake.

Shane

Practice is very important...I too practice every chance I get...use a practice area that we had put together that mimics the DMV Motorcycle Test.

1. Left turn and right turns (L shaped slot)
2. U-turns (boxed); emphasis on more extreme head turns
3. Coned weave

In addition I practice the "dead stop" right / left turn. From dead stop...I turn wheel then turn head to right / left and accelerate...it's really amazing that by the amount you turn your head and eyes (not just eyes) you can negotiate a really tight turn.

On U-turns...if I need to...I don't hesitate to pull over...duck walk back (like I'm parking along the curb) and then execute the "dead stop" turn to complete a U-turn.

I don't mean this in a snarky way at all, but it sounds like you could use a motorcycle training course.

Thanks for the information re slow turns. I was not aware that the integrated braking system allowed for some small amount of braking to be used before the front brake engages. I believe the problem was as stated, I over engaged the left hand brake. I have gone over some of the basic info on cornering and turns and I'm out to the parking lot for some practice. Thanks everyone. And, no snarkiness taken. I did take the MSC and passed, but it was Piaggio's braking system that threw me.

The linked brakes are set up with a 70:30 rule via a pressure regulator.

Up to 30% of pressure, the back brake only is applied.
Up to 70% of pressure, the front brake is engaged by a linearly increasing amount - but reaches a limit of 70% rear, 30% front.
Over 70% of pressure, the ratio of 70:30 is maintained.

I've got a diagram from Piaggio somewhere, but 5 minutes of rootling around didn't find it.

Use of throttle against the brakes (using the left lever only) is just fine for slow manouvers with these linked brakes.

LOL rootling rooting + fooling = rootling?

I have dropped my BV also.

For me, have to keep that front wheel straight or I am going down! It is too heavy for me.

So if I am turning and see that I have to make a quick stop. I immediately straighten out the front wheel and apply the brakes.

It just takes a lot of practice to handle a BV500. It's a big bike. Like people have suggested, practice in a parking lot is the best.

Also if I have to make a quick stop, chances are I am going too fast for traffic conditions, so slow down.

But if the odd swerve happens in avoiding an accident, I would rather drop my bike than hit something.

You should shift your butt and weight to the opposite direction that you are turning when attempting a very slow speed turn. This will equalize your balance. If you also have to brake, you just need to feather the rear brake. I had to spend some time teaching my wife how to do this because she was having the same problem. After a few weeks of practice, she became comfortable with the technique but still doesn't feel as comfortable riding my BV500 as she does on her GTS or our GTV. The BV is much more like a motorcycle with the larger wheels and heavier weight and simply is not everyone's cup of tea.

I always try to slow way down before entering a turn and then accelerating some out of the apex...
(And I am not concerned about how nerdy this may appear?) 8)

Because IMO many crashes are caused by newbies not being able to correctly gauge an upcoming turn (especially the decreasing radius ones on exit ramps!) and riding into them too hotly!

i just drag both feet on slow turns...gets a lot of priceless looks at the biker bar

This is why I always wear knee sliders. That way when the bike goes over, my knee and the two wheels for a triangle contact patch and I can donut in little circles all day long. And I can give any watchers the thumbs up sign without looking like a duffus...

+1

You should practice this in a parking lot. At speeds over 15 miles an hour, counter steering is in order, above 5 MPH...more like what you do with a bike...at slow speeds (less than 5 MPH), hang your body towards the outside of the curve. So if you want to turn left, then lean your body to the right. It is weird in the beginning, but once you get skilled, you can turn this big girl around in about a lane and a half.

The counter weighting technique helps...I use this on occasion. I rely more on minimal application / feathering of rear brake in conjunction with throttle control...it does take practice. As Chazlee pointed out, prior to even taking a turn...slow down. Make sure to turn your eyes and head to where you want to go...don't look down!
Cannot emphasize to slow down and keep control...we're not on a race track...

Back to counter weighting technique...the most obvious is more upper body I've also use lower body (foot press)...instinctively the upper body weight shift follows...gotta practice in practice area...don't practice on the open road!

I emailed Motorman some time ago about applying his techniques to scooters and he said it's exactly the same as with motorcycles...but, there's no friction zone, so that's one less thing to worry about! Rear brake, throttle, head and eyes. All you need.

Yes, no clutch to be concerned about, hence the emhasis on throttle control and using head and eyes...spent some time reviewing this with the wife and she said the best advice was turning the head and not just the looking with the eyes. Simple to understand and execute...need to still practice and now she's practicing with a lot more determination.