Modern Vespa

is it better to first startup the scooter then take it off the stand?
i've been taking it off the stand first, then starting it up, then paddling it backwards out of the garage/parking spot.

i was thinking that if i startup first, there might be a chance that i would pull the throttle accidentally when rocking the scooter off the stand.

would you first backup with the bike on off, then turn on the scooter to pull away forward?

also, i've been using the 'kill switch' to first shutoff, then turn the key to off.
saw some other posts about not using the switch... emergency only?
am i messing things up?

I start my scoot up on the stand. that way if i need to give it a bit of throttle it won't fly off without me. I then stand on the left hand side of the scoot with one hand on the rear brake and the other hand on the grab rails and push it off the stand. hold my rear brake and hop on.

I always have my rear brake on even if stationary with all my bikes. must be force of habit.

I also use the kill switch to stop the engine then use the key (for my other bikes as the lx150 has no kill switch). I like to do this so in an emergancy it would be the first thing to get done - kind of like a muscle memory, don't even think about it.

I can only say what I do.

I start up on the centre-stand, bump it off said stand, then ride. no warm-up, ever, on any bike. You wouldn't expect to have to do this with a car, why expect it of a bike?

Personally...

I start up after I get it off the center stand.

I use to kill switch first then position my scoot.

Since I have a side stand...I then put the side stand down...turn wheel left...dismount...grab passenger grab bar...grasp left handle bar...turn straight (keeping hand off brake; this can happen!)...then level scoot on center stand pegs (both pegs touching down)...then push down and it pops up...turn wheel left and remember to lock steering column.

Friendly and caution reminder: IMHO...the majority of scoots being dropped occur when were either coming to a stop and / dismounting hence, I make sure that I'm very cognizant of conditions when I'm stopping...surface condition (potholes, gravel, gas/oil residue), incline, firm planting of foot...just being careful.

I start it up on the centre stand while standing beside the scooter. I then take it off the centre stand, then get on the scooter and ride away.

At the end of the ride, I park it, kill the engine, then get off the scooter and put it on the centre stand.

thanks for all the feedback.
this forum has been amazing awesome!

Bumping this thread as I too am curious as the OP...is there a risk of some type of damage by using the kill switch instead of the key first?

No risk, the kill switch is designed to be used.

In 40 years of riding motorcycles/scooters, I have never (not even one time) used the kill switch.
When I get ready to leave, I take the scooter off of the stand, sit on it and then start the engine.
When I'm ready to park it, I stop, turn off the key, get off the scooter and put it on the stand. When I'm parking in my garage after riding, I always use the sidestand which I put down while I'm sitting on the scooter (but I don't put much weight on it.....just enough to make sure it is extended and engaged).
My wife uses the same procedure when she rides for getting on and off.
I know that the MSF instructors tell people to use the kill switch but I've never seen the rationale with that instruction. Also, the overwhelming number of people that I have ridden motorcycles with over the years DO NOT use the kill switch either.
BTW: I've ridden over 600,000, accident free miles and I've ridden with guys who had logged even more miles than me and they didn't use the kill switch.

The bottom line is do what makes you feel comfortable. You know the old adage: Different strokes for different folks.

The kill switch is good for only two things:

1) I have used it once on a motorcycle that was lying in the middle of the road after a bad accident and the motor was running away at max RPM.

2) I have flipped them to "off" on other people's parked bikes as a joke so they couldn't start them. Funny how they never check the switch. I have been told that I will burn in Hell for all eternity for that sin.

Actually the kill switch is only good for one thing... turning off the bike. 8)

I've never been able to work out why bikes have kill switches. I have only used one once, while touring the highlands in Scotland, and then by accident. I was at the side of the road and I had tested pretty much everything trying to workout what was wrong when I finally remembered the kill switch. I'd like to think that the inventor of the kill switch will have to spend eternity switching pointless switches up and down.

They say they're useful in a crash but I've been in loads and the only thing your thinking about is how to save your skin. I guess if a bike has crashed and the engines still running then it might be useful but why not switch the bike off with the key. I suppose they are good for making your exhaust backfire in long tunnels but other than that I'd leave it alone. You will definitely burn for that!

Sometimes electrics screw up, its good to have a back up just in case. Also, you can access the kill switch when your hand is still on the handlebars. To turn the key you have to take your hand off the grip.

Is there a backup for anything else (indicators, light switch, starter button, throttle ...). Normally when the electrics screw up then the bike won't start rather than not stop. Haven't tried but could you stop the engine by stalling it by applying throttle and rear brake at the same time? or would you have to pull the spark lead off? Making a pointless button easier to access doesn't make it any more useful though

You shouldn't be worrying about the indicators, light switch, starter button, throttle, in a situation where a kill switch is needed. Key word: Normally. The kill switch is used for abnormal emergency situations.

If your engine is about to blow up, wouldn't you want to turn it off as quickly as possible?

I've also seen #1 happen and it's reason enough for a kill switch!

As far as #2 goes...
When I came out after breakfast last Saturday morning, some fun loving friend???
had turned my kill switch to the off position...hilarious huh!!!
I notice it after the first try and pushed it back...no problemo!

What really ticked me about it, was that somebody had touched my baby!!!

As a new rider, that is exactly where I learned the practice of using the Kill Switch. The only reason I have personally found this method useful, was by using the switch, the electronics are still on including the headlight in my dark garage.

Which leads me to my next question. After removing the key does anyone switch the Kill Switch to "off" as an added security devise?

I don't really worry about anything while riding along but I think you've hit upon my problem - I just can't picture a situation where a kill switch is needed. I've driven a fair few miles and a fair few bikes over the last 20 odd years but I've never had an engine blow up on me yet. I guess with our engines rev at 6000rpm - how much difference do you think switching it off via a switch or via a key is going to make? If I did hear a strange noise then I'd probably park up at the side of the road and try to work out where it was coming from.

I have heard people say it's good practise to turn the bike off via the kill switch if you're in an accident. I've no idea how many accidents you've had but I've had loads (I know I should ride safer). I promise you the last thing you'll think about is hitting that kill switch.

What have you (or anyone) actually used the kill switch for (where the key wouldn't of been adequate)?

I Never start my bike on the center stand as a friend told me of her story....She started her bike and as she was trying to get if off the stand hit the throttle and away it went. I get my bike off the center stand then start it. BTW I always use the kill switch so when if for some horrible reason I may need it, it will be automatic for me.

Do you guys let your Scooter warm up?

I've become lax about letting it warm up and I just wanted to know if I am damaging something.

Thanks

Yeah this kill switch thing is lost on me too. I've heard many people over time referring to grave situations where its use would be imperative but I've never heard an example of such a situation. I'm open to suggestions though.

Do you warm your lawn mower up?

Dont have one.
Suppose I did, should i let it warm up or not

There is a thread on general discussion
recently posted called "Stuck Throttle!"

I think it might apply to this discussion.

To me it's important to have a routine, just so I make a habit of doing everything that needs to be done.

Pre-ride: don jacket & overpants, get helmet & gloves from topbox, insert key & unlock scooter, put on modular helmet, undo parking brake & push scooter off centerstand, sit on scooter and begin rolling it out of parking space while putting on gloves. Finish gloves, zip jacket around gloves, flip down helmet, key to start position, disable kill switch, start, go.

Post-ride: lock suspension, kill engine, flip up helmet, dismount, mount scooter to centerstand. Engage parking brake & lock wheels, remove key. Open topcase, remove gloves & helmet, stow'em, lock topcase & put keys in jacket pocket, adjourn.

Practice makes me more perfect!

Modern engines of any type don't require warming up. A properly maintained and tuned engine can be put to reasonable use as soon as it is running smoothly. Multigrade lubricants flow well from cold to hot and any liquid cooled motor will have its warmup controlled by a thermostat.

You seriously think that in the entire history of kill switches, no one has ever used it, and its completely pointless to EVERYONE (i.e. not just you)?

OK, here's a senario:

You're in rush hour traffic (possibly lane splitting if you live in CA), when your throttle sticks.

Alright, now before you say "but, I'm totally cool and composed and never panic, and I can totally find the key while maneuvering between cars!" You still have to admit that the kill switch would be a safer option to use in an emergency maneuver. You should NEVER take your hands off the grips while doing emergency swerves and stops.

There are all sorts of things on bikes now that are not completely NEEDED, but is still a progression in safety. For example: turn signals... hand signals have been used before and have been adequate, but you and I both know that turn signals are safer.

I am unsure about the warm-up. I do on mine just because i always forget to grab something and have to run back in my house.

As for the kill-switch.... redundant switch. The key switch does the exact same thing. As for accidents and can only reach the kill switch ... Ok good argument. I see your point on only being able to get to that.

I always start mine on the center stand.

+1 - better to start on the ground lest you pop it into gear or roll the throttle by accident taking it off the stand.

Mounting

1) Put on safety equipment (the order of the safety equipment depends on the temp outside, if it's hot, the jacket goes on last)
2) Mount bike
3) Raise side stand
4) Ignition on
5) Engine cut off switch to On
6) Rear brake
7) Parking brake off
8) Start button

Dismounting

1) Engine cut off switch to Off
2) Ignition off
3) Parking brake
4) Side stand
5) Dismount
6) Lock forks
7) Unlock seat
8) Remove key and put in pants pocket not jacket pocket!!!
9) Safety equipment off and stowed

Regarding #8 in the Dismounting section. I've learned the hard way that it's a bad habit to put your key in your jacket pocket. It's fine during the cool riding months when you don't take your jacket off after dismounting. But in the hot months when you DO take your jacket off, you will almost certainly not remember that your key is in your jacket pocket until your jacket is securely locked in your under-seat storage. For my bike: No key, no getting into the under-seat storage.

I'm a creature of habit. They make me do things faster and without thinking--including things that I don't really want to do.

I'm not trying to antagonise you. I'm just generally curious as to what situations might require a kill switch. Here in the UK it's nor regarded as being particularly important and obviously in the states it is. I've never seen people using kill switches in Europe either but perhaps I wasn't being very observant.

Wouldn't applying the brakes followed by turning off the bike work in the above situation?

As an aside I did have this happen to me in a car. It was an automatic with power assisted everything. I first put the car into neutral - this made such a horrendous sound with the engine at max revs that I put it straight back into gear. I then killed the engine with the keys - and found the power steering and servo assisted brakes didn't work any more - I could barely move the steering wheel! So I turned the engine back on. Luckily a slip road was approaching and I managed to get onto the slip road, lined the car up and turned the engine off again - it took both feet and all my weight on the pedal to stop.

anybody seen this yet?

Yes, it has been posted here before. What is the connection with this thread?

You're still missing the point here. Yeah, you could do all the things you stated, but hitting the kill switch is safer.

Have you ever tried to apply the brakes while the throttle is open? That causes your brakes to lock up and you to lose control of the bike.

But, I again state... wouldn't hitting the kill switch while being able to simultaneously applying both brakes (on an auto) or the brakes and disengaging the clutch (on a shifty) be safer?

Just to re-iterate - in the UK we are taught that the kill-switch is a vital emergency engine cut-off switch, that can be easily found and used by anyone if a bike needs to be switched off. We are also taught never to operate it in day-to-day use, as it makes the likelyhood of forgetting to take out the keys far higher. Bike theft is highly prevalent here, sadly.

After years with a damb Harley I now,

Start engine on stand
turn on right turning light
put on jacket
turn on left turning light
turn off turning lights
Put on helmet
put on gloves
sit on and take off stand and back out of garage

This is for what its worth.

Paul

Why? The rear brake will simply cancel out the power from the motor. The front brake will just slow you down as normal. I'm not sure if the engine will stall in this case - if it doesn't just hold the rear brake on and switch off the engine.[/quote] If you can disengage the clutch then there's no risk at all. On CVT bikes like Vespas having a kill switch would be slightly easier in this isolated case but only if you can use it.

The simple way to test this is to sit on your bike, with your hands in the normal riding position, 20' in front of a wall and then nail the throttle. Do you grab the brakes or hunt around for the kill switch?

Oddly enough I ride all day with the throttle stuck in the wide open position and never seem to want a method of turning the engine off

going nowhere?

To comment on the OP's routine, I don't have the scooter engine running when trying to push the scooter out of the garage. Mostly due to having to smell the exhaust fumes.

I take it out, put it on its stand, and then start the engine. For the first run of the day, the scooter runs for about 30 seconds while I test the signals and brake lights, and finish doing up my helmet, and then off I go. Afterwards, I gear up, bump the scooter off of the stand, start it and ride off. Not WOT mind you, but at a normal speed until the idle comes down.

I almost always turn the scooter off with the kill switch, and then lock it with the key when stopped. It's just my habitual way of turning off the scooter.

If the engine is running and you are using your brake to kill the engine as part of an emergency procedure than you are losing ground. A running, in-gear engine resists your braking effort and will increase your stopping distance. To stall the engine using the brakes at speed (say 45?) in a timely fashion (i.e. without decelerating for half a block) you would almost surely lock the rear wheel up.

It's better to kill the engine separately from your braking procedure (i.e. with the kill switch or ignition key), and leave it in gear, so the resistance of the engine ASSISTS your braking efforts. In this case, I would rather use the kill switch than the key so that both hands can remain on the handlebars and on the brakes and clutch (where equipped).