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@pilatus255 avatar
UTC

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2009 MP3 500
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Location: Brisish Columbia, Canada
 
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@pilatus255 avatar
2009 MP3 500
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Posts: 5
Location: Brisish Columbia, Canada
UTC quote
Had my 500 out on a back country road which had some pretty new gravel on it...and lots of it. I have ridden for many years with different bikes of all makes and sizes on gravel and i have to say that the MP3 is one of the twitchiest on gravel that I have ever ridden...was not unsafe but still required a great deal of attention. Found that the back end wanted to go in directions that I really had no intention of going. The problem i think is the small diameter wheels. It handles much better at a slower speed...60 Kilometers per hour was about the top speed I could manage safely (about 35-40 MPH). Once off the sections that had an over abundance of gravel and on to a more civilized amount, I was able to do 80-90 KPH without any difficulty whatsoever...so be warned that if you happen to get into deep gravel..keep it slow and a loose grip on the handlebars helps a lot.

Ride safe... :)
@oldspice avatar
UTC

Hooked
'12 BMW R1200RT
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Location: iowa city, ia
 
Hooked
@oldspice avatar
'12 BMW R1200RT
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UTC quote
Good point. The back roads around here were just doused with a heavy sprinkling of gravel as well; not sure why. Sure makes for a more interesting cornering experience, and not in a good way!
@jimc avatar
UTC

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The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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@jimc avatar
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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UTC quote
Up to 30mph (50kph) seems OK on unstable surfaces here. No braking mind!
@truckbos avatar
UTC

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MP3 2007 Silver
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Location: Zeeland Mi
 
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@truckbos avatar
MP3 2007 Silver
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UTC quote
I live on a gravel road it has two hills and some loose spots where the farmers sunk thru so it is aninteresting ride to say the least,also it is thick with deer like jim said i go about 25 to 30 mph . The 250 handles fine in the loose stuff,my neighbor has a BV 500 and he is all over the road with it. We been on a couple of gravel road nad he daid he wished then that had an MP3
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UTC

Molto Verboso
Piaggio MP3 500
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Location: North Georgia
 
Molto Verboso
@georgiagirl avatar
Piaggio MP3 500
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Location: North Georgia
UTC quote
This is interesting. My MP3 seems to handle gravel, grass, sand, etc better than my hubby's 1250, but I think that is more because of the amount of torque on the back wheel of the 1250 (so my spouse tells me). I don't have anything to compare it too and I'm still slow in general, but I've never had any trouble on the gravel driveways, parking lots, and roads that I've dealt with. Just slow and steady, wspecially with the throttle or brake.
@bsumpter avatar
UTC

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2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
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Location: Greeneville, TN
 
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@bsumpter avatar
2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
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Location: Greeneville, TN
UTC quote
I too noticed the MP3 seems less stable in gravel than a normal 2-wheel motorcycle. To me, it felt like the twin front wheels wanted to "plow" more in the gravel than my other motorcycles. I don't know why for sure - my guess is either the smaller tire diameter, two wheels vs. one which create a heavier feel up front, or the skinnier tires are digging in more instead of floating on top of the gravel.

Either way, I've already mentioned it to my wife and told her to be extra cautious in deep gravel.
@truckbos avatar
UTC

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MP3 2007 Silver
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Location: Zeeland Mi
 
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@truckbos avatar
MP3 2007 Silver
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UTC quote
Awhile back my neighbor and me ran into a road closed due to construction while it looked like there was a path that cars where taken,we desided to take the same path found out there was a sand hole just before the pavement started ,he just about lost it me i walked right thru it had to get after it but it went better then he did. He said it was the two wheels that made it much better.
@jimc avatar
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The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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@jimc avatar
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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UTC quote
They'll certainly struggle in thick loose gravel - but compacted gravel with only an inch or so loose on top should be fine. I also think the thinner and smaller diameter tyres will dig in more where the surface is susceptible. However, the two wheels do mean that sideways front slides are less easy to induce.
@sushiman007 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
She's an I-talian $$-burning machine
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Location: America, The Beautiful
 
Molto Verboso
@sushiman007 avatar
She's an I-talian $$-burning machine
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UTC quote
It's all fun!
Speaking from personal experience, I would say that MP3 (500) does have a tendency to transfer a lot of road information to the rider through the handlebar. It's as if when you're listening to stereo music, you have a left channel and a right channel combined to give you a 3-dimensional sound image that is more realistic, directional, full of depth, colorful and life-like; whereas the old mono just sounds flat, dull and boring. I think riding an MP3 is like listening to stereo music, you constantly get feedback from the left and from the right front wheels; and while it's more "lively", it's actually a lot more stable. The friends that I ride with, you know those two-wheel scooterists, they all agree that when it comes to uneven, loose, dirty, gravely terrains, the MP3 definitely has the advantage over theirs.

I just think it's fun! C'mon down, let's go ride some fire roads!
@bsumpter avatar
UTC

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2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
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Location: Greeneville, TN
 
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@bsumpter avatar
2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
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Location: Greeneville, TN
UTC quote
Out of curiosity, those that are of the opinion that the MP3 is *more* stable in gravel - did any of you come from dirt bike backgrounds? Motocross? Enduro?

Just curious ... It is interesting that we're experiencing such polar opposite reactions to this topic, and I'm wondering if maybe it is our backgrounds that could explain the difference?
@jimc avatar
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The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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@jimc avatar
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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UTC quote
Could well be. I have zero 'dirt' experience. Apart from England's crappiest roads that is.
@sushiman007 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
She's an I-talian $$-burning machine
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Molto Verboso
@sushiman007 avatar
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UTC quote
What are we comparing here?
Lots of mountain bike riding, why.
No one ever said that MP3 was purpose-built for off-road; yet it is plenty capable (more than any other 2-wheel scooter that I know), just can't do big air, not just yet.
@bsumpter avatar
UTC

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2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
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Location: Greeneville, TN
 
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@bsumpter avatar
2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
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Location: Greeneville, TN
UTC quote
Re: What are we comparing here?
sushiman007 wrote:
Lots of mountain bike riding, why.
No one ever said that MP3 was purpose-built for off-road; yet it is plenty capable (more than any other 2-wheel scooter that I know), just can't do big air, not just yet.
Not that at all. I'm sorry if I worded my question in a way that caused some confusion.

I was simply noting that some here feel the MP3 does worse than a two-wheel motorcycle in deep gravel conditions (me included), and others feel the MP3 does better than a two-wheel motorcycle in deep gravel conditions. I found that interesting since we're all riding what is basically the same machine - at least in the unique MP3 front end.

75% of my riding background is in the dirt, and I was just curious about others backgrounds to see if maybe there is a correlation in the differing opinions. And to make sure that we are indeed comparing apples to apples, I am comparing the MP3 to other motorcycles (17" wheels and larger). I have no two-wheel scooter experience to compare to.
@old_as_dirt avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 GTS
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Posts: 22821
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@old_as_dirt avatar
2007 GTS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 22821
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
UTC quote
Re: What are we comparing here?
bsumpter wrote:
sushiman007 wrote:
Lots of mountain bike riding, why.
No one ever said that MP3 was purpose-built for off-road; yet it is plenty capable (more than any other 2-wheel scooter that I know), just can't do big air, not just yet.
Not that at all. I'm sorry if I worded my question in a way that caused some confusion.

I was simply noting that some here feel the MP3 does worse than a two-wheel motorcycle in deep gravel conditions (me included), and others feel the MP3 does better than a two-wheel motorcycle in deep gravel conditions. I found that interesting since we're all riding what is basically the same machine - at least in the unique MP3 front end.

75% of my riding background is in the dirt, and I was just curious about others backgrounds to see if maybe there is a correlation in the differing opinions. And to make sure that we are indeed comparing apples to apples, I am comparing the MP3 to other motorcycles (17" wheels and larger). I have no two-wheel scooter experience to compare to.
As an ex enduro/hare scrambles and some motorcross rider yes it is harder to control the front end of the MP3 in the loosenes of the gravel as compared to a dirt bike where the front end is lighter and it is easrier to shift your weight to the rear to keep the front wheel skimming more. Also the dirt bike probably has better power to weight ratio so you can come up on the power band to help slide and steer through th edeep loose gravels.

Your dirt experience should help you in finding the right speed for the conditionswhen riding the MP3 but the 2 fronts won't be a saviour for for going at speeds unasfe for the conditions.
⚠️ Last edited by old as dirt on UTC; edited 1 time
@sushiman007 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
She's an I-talian $$-burning machine
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Location: America, The Beautiful
 
Molto Verboso
@sushiman007 avatar
She's an I-talian $$-burning machine
Joined: UTC
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UTC quote
Re: What are we comparing here?
bsumpter wrote:
I am comparing the MP3 to other motorcycles (17" wheels and larger). I have no two-wheel scooter experience to compare to.
Worthy question. I don't have any motorcycle experience so I am not qualified to answer, comment, or compare. Sorry! However, I would say that MP3 has inherent antiquated, inferior front suspension when compared with modern motorcycles, and that translates to limited off-roadabilty.
@bsumpter avatar
UTC

Member
2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14
Location: Greeneville, TN
 
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@bsumpter avatar
2009 Piaggio MP3 400ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14
Location: Greeneville, TN
UTC quote
Re: What are we comparing here?
old as dirt wrote:
As an ex enduro/hare scrambles and some motorcross rider yes it is harder to control the front end of the MP3 in the loosenes of the gravel as compared to a dirt bike where the front end is lighter and it is easrier to shift your weight to the rear to keep the front wheel skimming more. Also the dirt bike probably has better power to weight ratio so you can come up on the power band to help slide and steer through th edeep loose gravels.

Your dirt experience should help you in finding the right speed for the conditionswhen riding the MP3 but the 2 fronts won't be a saviour for for going at speeds unasfe for the conditions.
I'm inclined to agree with you, old as dirt. I also think wheel diameter could play a role as well. It just seems logical (to me anyway) that a 21" front wheel is going to have less rolling resistance in deep loose terrain when compared to a 12" front wheel like the MP3. Between that and the lighter front end of the 2-wheel motorcycle (as you mentioned), perhaps this explains why I feel the MP3 is harder to ride in the loose stuff.

I have no actual trouble with the MP3 in gravel, but simply noted it was easier to ride the V-Strom or the WR250 through gravel. I mentioned to my wife that the MP3 took a little more work from the rider in gravel than my other bikes, and asked her to be careful in those conditions. That said, the MP3 totally whips the WR250 in a pavement stability contest.
@stickyfrog avatar
UTC

Moderatus Rana
MP3 250 and 2 MP3 500s
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Posts: 22659
Location: Nashville, Indiana
 
Moderatus Rana
@stickyfrog avatar
MP3 250 and 2 MP3 500s
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Posts: 22659
Location: Nashville, Indiana
UTC quote
Gotta keep the apples to apples and oranges to oranges comparison. You can't with integrity, compare a dirt bike...and some road bikes with similar specs to scooters and most other road bikes. I would never dream of taking my 250 anywhere I used to take my old yamaha dirt bikes. That said, using caution, I would trust my 250 in many dirt situations that I would not take most other scooters. On hard packed dirt roads...no problems as long as you don't drive like you are on pavement. Loose sand is another story. Gotta be real careful...like you are driving a jeep through a swamp road.
⬆️    About 1 month elapsed    ⬇️
UTC

Member
MP3 400
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9
Location: Montreal Quebec Canada
 
Member
MP3 400
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Posts: 9
Location: Montreal Quebec Canada
UTC quote
Try a pair of Schwalbe Weatherman on the front. Work realy well on off road. Do not last long on the back, only 6000 km but the front are at 40% at 20000 km. Good tire. MP3 400
UTC

Hooked
Puch SRA150, MP3 400, Moto Guzzi 750 Nevada, BMW K75S
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Location: Glendale AZ (was Albury NSW)
 
Hooked
Puch SRA150, MP3 400, Moto Guzzi 750 Nevada, BMW K75S
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Posts: 264
Location: Glendale AZ (was Albury NSW)
UTC quote
Re: What are we comparing here?
sushiman007 wrote:
Worthy question. I don't have any motorcycle experience so I am not qualified to answer, comment, or compare. Sorry! However, I would say that MP3 has inherent antiquated, inferior front suspension when compared with modern motorcycles, and that translates to limited off-roadabilty.
The MP3 has extremely sophisticated front suspension.

However, it also has very small wheels, especially so considering all the weight they carry.

As already pointed out, the larger the wheel, especially on front, the better the steering in loose conditions. A large wheel tends to ride over the gravel, while a small wheel will tend to plow through it.

Having 2 small front wheels is still nowhere near as good, in deep sand or gravel, as having one large diameter (say 21") one.

Cheers and all the best

Trevor G

PS While it is scary at first, you will have more steering control in loose conditions if you keep the power applied with your weight towards the back, and maintain a reasonable speed. Keeping the power "on" helps to lighten the front wheel and reduce its plowing coefficient.
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