Modern Vespa

In thirty plus years of riding and over 40 different bikes from 15 different manufactures I have owned and ridden 6 Harleys. If you are enjoying your Harley then good for you.

In numbers of bikes not sold yes, but in percent of overall sales I believe HD is doing the worst. You must remember how small HD is compared to giants like Honda and Yamaha. Here is the US they seem big but worldwide is another story. Did Hondas profit fall 91% last quarter?

Where did you get your numbers? '07 was the first year production dropped (330,619 bikes*), and only by 5% of what was produced in '06 (349,196 bikes*). '04 had 317,289 bikes* produced. This year is looking to have around 250,000 - 260,000 bikes** in production. That's more than half.





* American Iron magazine, April 2009
** We've dropped production to 20,000 parts/week from roughly 25,000-30,000. Four of them go into each bike.

Quite.

It isn't a cage.

And I'd lose a job.

you are making assumptions here, the practicality of a motorcycle can be learnt from any kind of motorcycle. I have had several, you are right belts last longer and so do tires. Tires not that much longer and they cost 4 to 5 times more. What about the cost involved in a belt replacement on a 1400. I think if you do the math maintenance on a Harley is much more expensive, in my experience, Harleys are mostly used as show ponies or as a form of sport, like sportbikes. Again I am not saying you can't use them otherwise but that is not the norm as it is with scooters. When is the last time you saw a top box on a sportster except on yours of course, as I assume you have one and are using yours to commute, leave it parked on the street all day and get your groceries with it.

Go for it who cares. I rode home on the back of one today and loved it. I'm not one for caring what other people think. If i enjoy it that's what counts. Buy it and have fun

It's a good damned thing that I'm not five years younger, and have a less vivid picture of penury in my dotage. I'd be shackled to payments on an 2010 Iron 883 in a heartbeat.

Really a nice looking bike. I never really pay much attention to Harley's but they are a real piece of Americana. The 883 in red looks especially good. For a new bike at $7200 u.s. the price seems right to me. HMMMM.

Isn't that a girls bike???

\\osc

Wrong again. From motorcycledaily.com: Harley's profits did drop 91%. But, they are still profitable! Unlike other major bike mfgs.
But I see how it is, you just need to bash Harleys. Kinda sad to see this behaviour on a scooter site where peeps often complain about not getting respect from other bikers...

As for all those bikes you rode, you haven't ridden a Harley recently (or a Sportster since 2004) which is apparent from your claims...

The 883 Sportster as pictured in the op's first post is simply a 'standard', no frills, mid-weight motorcyle of modest power...pleasant to ride and reliable in stock form...rather dull actually, with 'pedestrian' performance for a bike pushing 900cc's...quite the opposite of a 'show pony'.

The 883 Sportster is also not in it's element on american freeways and interstates, it can manage interstate speeds, but with little, if any, margin for hills, headwinds, and loads.

So it's no 'show pony', and it's not at it's best on freeways, American or otherwise.

It's just a nice motorcycle.

Yeah, just buy what you like. There are always going to be people telling you not to buy something. Usually because it is not what they have, or because they have different reasons for owning it than you do.

Personally, I like companies that are original, and have style. Originality goes a long way with me, which is why I own a Vespa. There are plenty of scooters out there that have copied Vespa's look, but why would I want a copy when I can have the original? Same with Harley. Honda and Yamaha make bikes to look just like Harley Davidsons. Why buy a copy when you can have the original? I understand if you cant afford one. If thats the case, buy what you can afford, and enjoy the hell out of it like it's nobodies business. But if you can afford the original, whether it be a Vespa or a Harley, I say go for it.

Anything with that much chrome, polished as often as they are, ridden on nice days mostly, from pub to pub, all lined up with their owners in similar toough guy costumes( I say it again) most of the time or the commonest use for the Harley and I am a fan of Harleys, 883 1200 or the all dressed up glided one..... Most of the time it's common use is as a show pony....designed to cruise wide open highways of the American genre. And scooterdood you are right it is not at it;s best on freeways, it is at it;s best posing.

If you like it buy it. They look cool.

Go sit on one for a good long while (or rent one) and see how it really fits your body. If it does, and it makes you wanna ride....then just go for it and don't worry about anything else.

No bike (or scoot) is perfect, but if it fits you well and it makes you wanna ride it, then you'll learn to accept it's "imperfections" as merely part of it's personallity... and you'll wind up not caring about what others think or say about it. You'll just ride on!

We have had one for over 10 years. They are DIFFERENT. Seating position is not that different from a Vespa. Upright and good for urban driving. They are extremely reliable. Not much on horses, but lots of torque. All in all, not a great bike, but lots more fun than most bikes, if you can understand what I mean. They shake, can rattle, but they always roll. The sporties are nice to get started with, especially if you are of small stature.

The real beauty of Harley is that they feature the ENGINE and never cover it up. The bikes are really a classic thing of beauty.

GO FOR IT. But don't try to drag with a sport bike. The 883 has about 35 true horses.

Not only that, but they let you buy a Sportster, ride it for a year and then -- if you trade it in on one of their bigger machines -- let you apply 100 percent of your Sportster purchase price toward the larger machine.

If Vespa did that with LX 150s, they'd sell a helluva lot more 300 Supers.

If you like buy it. Having a Harley Davidson is much like owning a Vespa you won't have the latest greatest but you will have a fine looking machine with a sexy style and timeless look. If you want a sporty get it and ride with friends. I will just say if your wife will be riding with you go for a Streetglide.

The Chick bike is the hardest bike to handle in the line-up and is not an entry level bike it has a high center of gravity and seems top heavy, now take a good look around lots of the women riders are on baggers and softails not a sporty. "Chick Bike" is what bike snobs call it.

A few yrs. back, I seriously looked at a Harley 883 and really wanted one. In talking to the two local Harley dealers, they BOTH told me that it would not run right and would give me constant trouble unless I bought some kind of carburetor modification and the straight pipes for it instead of the stock muffler system that came on it. Their explanation was that the EPA (or some-such gov't department) required Harley to make these bikes this way due to pollution, or whatever. My thought was this: If I spent $8k+ for a brand new motorcycle and then immediately had to spend another $500+ for a different muffler and carburetor modification to make the thing run right, then what kind of nonsense it that? That made up my mind without any further thought. That would be like buying a new car and then have to put a new engine in it to make it run properly. How ignorant.

Sorry to hear that they wanted to sell you the "Harley TAX" it would have run just fine without jetting or exhust mods, sales men just want to sell parts and labor.
to understand click the link
http://www.chuckhawks.com/harley_tax.htm

i went to a bbq at our local hd dealership in marina del rey last nite.

the owners son has a scooter dealership/rental and also rents the big bikes

the harley is really a masive amount of weight, well balanced and most are eye pleasing.

the one thing we all did agree on was the fact that we can't ride a hd the way we ride our shiftys and twistys.

if i rode a 1200 sporster(the bike i liked) the way i ride my p or et3

forgetaboutit, id be in jail, bike impounded, or dead

I like the way the Night Rod fits my frame.

http://www.route66modernclassics.com/index.php

this is glens site, he is in our club and his dad owns a very old and famous dealership hear in la.

he rents vintage, twistys and harleys.

he host bbq's on certain nights and any area riders are welcome, including mv'rs.


this is my fav, the nightster 1200

This is about the best, most realistic and pragmatic description of the basic 883 Sportster posted so far. They are a true modern classic motorcycle, and in spite of the BS and 'baggage' of the biker stereotypes that hang on it like a dead Albatross, it's still just a nice, if somewhat archaic, motorcycle with some history built into it.

(God! just listen to me defending Harley Davidson...the world has truly turned upside down!)

I would probably buy a Triumph T100 Bonneville over it, but I wouldn't bitch much if both were in the garage.

I could understand that if it was a BUELL Blast, But not a Harley.

Beth got a Sportster because she felt that the Big Twin's primary drive case was too wide, making her feel unstable with her left foot. She's moved my bike (FXD Super Glide) around the driveway, and feels it's much better balanced than her Sporty.

nothing wrong with defending a hd

heck, i'll even ride this

anything with two wheels that allows me to tilt the horizon

I'd like to have one of these:

oh boy ken 8)

who ever has that is one happy camper shell

it is interesting the similarities in my old bmr and the xr

maybe it was just the seat

I went to a couple dealerships and was basically ignored - I really hate that

As far as weight and top heaviness, the BVC 500 is only 25 kg lighter than the HD 883.

So I came home and did a little research on the prices and looked at reviews. It seems that there is a 50 / 50 split among actual HD owners as to the quality of the machine. Most agree that the reliability could be better. Yes, I also read about those "necessary upgrades"... but also about a lot of breakdowns, oil leaks, and maintenance. I also looked at the prices and found that a new 883 HD costs about 8000 Euros and you can find Harley Davidson XL 1200 Sportster for the same price. On the other hand, a low mileage 10 year old HD is going to cost 6000 or more.

Given the reviews and stated problems, I don't much want older bikes with up coming problems, especially at a price that is 75% of the new prices

So I saw a comparable link... and was introduced to the Honda VT 750 Shadow which is nice... but it has 34KW while my BVC 500 has 29KW... So I am wondering where the advantage is for me, except that it is a motorcycle rather than a scooter.

Perhaps the best thing for me to do is wait, watch prices... and buy something in the winter so I get the best deal

Just for information - Here is a nice looking Shadow 750 with bags, windshield and 9000 km for less than 5000 Euros (the same price as a GTS 300 here in Germany):

The Shadow is a nice bike, but it is not a Harley. Kind of like buying a Vespa knock off instead of a Vespa.
Here are the main differences. The Honda has much thinner, cheaper paint. It has much thinner chrome, where it actually has real chrome. The rest of the 'chrome' actually is plastic. The fenders and other parts are plastic instead of metal like Harley. The standard of finish is much lower - check out the seam on the bottom of the gas tank - the Harley's tank is seamless. The switchgear is much lower quality. The engine has a carb while 'modern' Sportsters are fuel injected.
etc etc

You really do get what you pay for...

Thanks for the input - I certainly didn't know this. I only saw the bike, and most everyone that wrote a review only had great things to say. I couldn't find any serious criticism about the Shadow.

I know what you mean about the "knock off" remark. On the other hand... we have all bought Vespas / Piaggios... and there is a disparity between the quality price we pay and the quality of workmanship found on the scooters. I found a single wood screw holding my headlight to the headlight assemble on my BVC - wtf is that?

As with vespa, Hondas, Harleys or what ever bike a certin percent will find anything to complain about. "OIL LEAKS" new Harleys not leaking oil that is just passed on old facts that are not true today, My FLHX and 2002 sproty never dropped a drop of oil. Oil leaks ar what people who don't have the correct facts like to say because in the past they did leak then AMC cane in and made new engine. from that point on Harley are very low maintnace and easy to work on.

Maybe because its an XR1200 limited production Bike that came out last year in 09.

That 883 is a beautiful bike. I'd love to have one. maybe when the kids are out of college and wife's hearing deteriorates.

The only thing that could keep me is that I'm:

Not fat
Don't have a leather fetish
Don't have long, gray, thinning hair
I have hair
I would wear a helmet
Don't think I'm 'still tough' at 47

But if I cared what people thought I sure wouldn't be rocking a scooter.