Modern Vespa

Forgive me, the search thing is still a nightmare. To change the belt, people are using an box offset wrench and socket on the first cover/pulley removal. What are the needed sizes. Think a quick list of tools to do this would be nice in the project section. MP3 500 Great video tools, but tool sizes not listed.

Think the off set wrench is a 22mm and the axle shaft is a 10mm.

FYI!!!! When loosening or tightening the nut, Turn The Nut Not The Axle Shaft You try turning the axle shaft you will break if off.
Helps to set the parking brake while doing this too.

Wayne B

That offset wrench is hard to find and if you go the next step you need a different torque wrench to put it back on. You hold the nut with the offet wrench and then need a torque wrench that works counterclockwise to turn the nut. Most click type wrenches only work one way.

I broke down and bought an impact wrench to remove, then block the rear tire to put back on with a torque wrench.

What?

Sears: Craftsman Professional 20 x 22mm Full Polish Deep Offset Wrench, 12 pt. Box End, $20 and you'll have it in 3 or 4 days.
http://tinyurl.com/krcry4

And any new torque wrench I have looked at has a ratchet head and will go either way. Go to Lowes or Home Depot. Home Depot was cheaper by $2 or $3.

Wayne B

Great, and thanks for the information. Ordered it now. update found infor and the nut is 21mm ! now i own a useless wrench!

Don't use a 12-point socket or wrench on any of these high-torque things. 6-sided only!

Yes the Craftsman offset wrench is available on line, but no-one here had one in stock including Sears, Lowes, Harbor Freight, Northern Tool and others. I chose to go the impact wrench to remove and torque wrench while locking the rear wheel to reinstall so as not to wait another week to install my Dr. Pulley Sliders.

For the torque wrench, just because the head on the wrench is a ratchet does not mean it reverses. Many "click" type torque wrenches are one way and the ratchet does not reverse. Mine is a Sears Craftsman bought last winter specifically for working on my MP3 250. Then I get the 400 and find this left hand issue on setting the torque on the clutch cover nut. I can set the torque with the wheel locked and an impact will remove it safely so I choose not to buy another torque wrench.

Specifications on Lowes and Home Depot web pages do not say their click torque wrenches are bi-directional. Are you sure this is the case? Sears web page does have some but most of their on line inventory of click wrenches are one way and the few bi-directional ones are higher priced and state they are less accurate in left hand direction.

LOL great title for a blue movie,, LOL

Fuzzy,

I was thinking this over, why does the Torque Wrench have to work in reverse to do the belt? The Axle and Nut have Right Hand Threads. So Lefty Loosey, Righty Tighty. They Taught us that first day of Suzuki School and it has stuck
That always made me wonder though, some of the guys that make it to the school don't know the difference?

Wayne B

Look at the maintenance manual for the 400. The offset wrench is required to get to the nut on the clutch cover. The end of the shaft is cut to put a six point socket on to hold it while turning the nut. You cannot use a socket on the nut or how would you get anything on the end of the shaft to hold it.

Now when you go to put it back together you need the offset wrench to turn the nut clockwise, and put the torque wrench socket on the end of the shaft. The torque wrench is now pushing counter clockwise because it is on the shaft, not the nut, and thus must be the less common left hand torque wrench.

Of course the less expensive pointer type torque wrenches work in both directions.

Fuzzy,

Yes you are correct, not sure what I was thinking.
But I still have not seen a click type torque wrench that doesn't work both ways. I got a cheap Kolbolt at Home Depot and it works both ways, I have done my belt twice with it.

Wayne B

So...I guess this can go under this topic. I've always wanted to ask, especially from the more mechanically inclined, ..

What type/brand of tools do you use and why?

I, for one, always thought Kobolt were good tools(just based on talk from others). I currently have a Stanley set that fell between expensive and el cheapo. I'd like to eventually go whole hog and buy a great set, but what brand is best?

For the consumer, Craftsman are the best you are going to get from a store. Then the professional tools like Snap On, Mac, Matco.

I have a mix of Craftsman, Snap On, Kobolt for my torque wrenches and CP for my Air Tools.

For screw drives, if you can afford to spend $70 -$100 on a set of phillips head screw drivers, you can not beat Snap On Screw Drivers. I love mine and if you break a tip, find your snap on man and he will replace the shank for you while you wait. I had three replaced in one day once.

Wayne B

You actually need two sets; a good set and a cheap set.
I learned this from a mechanic friend back when I had time to work on my own vehicles.
The good set you leave at home for when your working on stuff.
The el-cheapo set you throw in your car/truck/mudder.

That way when you need to do a field repair you have the tools, but when you drop it in the mud or lay it on the side of the road and forget about it, you're not ticked off because you lost your expensive stuff.

-nub

Great tip!

To my knowledge, most tools are made the same today. Years ago there was a differance. Sure the "made in India" may not be the best, but and general "name brand" is likely made the same. Even sockets are just bunches of wire grouped together and then heat pressed into a socket. The old machining is history. I bought my first sk wayne socket set 1/2", 35 years ago and it is still here in great shape. Only threat to good tools are rust and theft. (or lending them out)

Perhaps, but the only change I see from the way it used to be to today is that the el cheapo foreign(mostly) brands have gotten better at making their packaging look reputable and similar to good parts. I know Stanley is not what is used to be nor something as good as Craftsman, but I bought the standard "DIY MECHANIC'S SET" from Wally world and went to use them to take off some parts on the rear tire assembly(not the axle nut and such!!, just some regular socket stuff) and within two bolts I had TWO sockets literally open up like a sliced pineapple in my hands. These were not torqued bolts. I bought the Stanley set which costs about double the cheap ones and so far they have held up admirably even with the tuffest nuts.

Big clue point - don't buy cheapo 12-point sockets or spanners, only 6-pointed ones.

More expensive to start with, but you gain in the long run.

+1 on 6-points, JimC.

Find one then

I checked Craftsman and Snap On Tools websites. You can get a standard 10 degree Off Set 6 Point wrench, but they don't make a 6 Point 60 Degree Deep Off Set in 6 Point and you need the 60 degree off set. I don't call a $54 Snap On wrench a cheap investment.

There is no way it's going to strip the head of the nut, I would break the axle off before that happen.

Wayne B

You have never owned a Snap On Tool have you? If you had, those words would have never been typed. Just Hold a Snap On wrench or ratchet and tell me all tools are made the same. Feel how smooth and effortless the ratcheting is on the Snap On. They "FIT" your hand, no sharp angles to dig into your hand when you are tightening a fastener.
Work all day with a set of SK's Tool and then all day with a set of Snap On Tools.

Try a Snap On Screw Driver on a screw that your screw driver won't get out. As long as you haven't totally stripped the head, you can most likely get it out with the Snap On. They have a special edge on the tips. Just look at one close and you will see why they grip so well.

Wayne B

I've seen a lot ot Snap-On and Matco tools break. I have several friends that own shops that are waiting for the replacement tool to be OKed by the factory. I'm not saying the tools are bad but I don't think they are as good as the money you have to put out suggests they are.
Rockwell, that was some good shit.
In the electrical field, the handles on the Snap-On screwdrivers make them unbearable due to the shape. We need round handles for fast spinning. That is why Klein rules in that field.
Another great manufacturer is Knipex. Their stuff is second to no one.
As Vince says," You know Germans make good stuff".

I never heard of having to wait for "Factory Approval" on Snap On tools that are broken. Must be some pricey stuff.

Wayne B

I had a friend who was a regional Snap On rep with 20 trucks working for him. He wouldn't sell friends tools. Said if you used tools for a living Snap On was worth it but for homme use they are overpriced.

We had a fire at the mill last summer. Wrote a purchase order to Snap On for $25,000 to replace the tools one of my mechanics lost in the fire.

I bought most of the Snap On Tools I have when I was turning wrenches. I buy specialty tools from them because I just couldn't find them anywhere else. I call my Snap On man and he will drop new or pick up broken tools at my house when he is in the area or I can go track him down, even at home if need be.

They are pricey and not worth the money for the consumer, I will agree with that.

Wayne B

My dad was an aircraft mechanic. He was a good father but he guarded his Snap On tools better than any of us. It would be a sacrilege for anyone of my mechanical ability to buy Snap On.