Modern Vespa

Hey everyone,

I've been curious.

Does anyone know if your vespa rides smoother with a long idle warm-up before a ride (10 minutes) vs. just turning the key and taking off.


I live in Los Angeles where we don't have real weather just dry sunshine.
Lately the forest fires here have made the days insanely hot (105 C).

My vespa just seems to be running so much better. Especially when I keep it out of the garage.

I'm just taking a poll.
seeing if people are doing this. Logically it would seem good for the engine but I dunno?

I think anything - biological or technological, goes better if it is 'prepared' for action. In other words wamr it up a little.
I usually wait until the temp guage just starts to move, usually 30 seconds. I certainly don't fang it until she is right up to temp'.

I just start and go - all weathers. They are designed to do it. You think an Italian would wait for it to warm up?

Always warm it up period it will save your engine

Like I said I've been wrong before LOL

Not correct. All fuel injected engines (cars/motorcycles/scooters) are designed to simply start and go. Now, that doesn't mean that if you live directly next to a freeway ramp that you should start the engine and jump on the entrance ramp at WOT......but if you start the engine and drive at lower speeds for the first few minutes, you won't damage any modern engine by doing so. Ask any mechanic or talk to any automotive engine engineer and they'll tell you the same thing.
Here's a link to the first article that I Googled up re. this subject; http://www.motherearthnews.com/Ask-Our-Experts/Green-Transportation/Car-Engine-Warm-Up.aspx

There are plenty of others.

Bias site you think?


When I say warm up I mean 10 or 20 seconds not like the old days

I would say warm it up for 45-60 seconds.

The bike does have an auto choke and if you let it warm up you will notice the rev's go slightly down after it is warm.

Let the oil at least get up in the motor.

SDG

It just happened to be the first one that came up on Google but I first learned about this about 20 years ago. My grandfather and my father both warmed up their cars for 10 minutes or so before driving off and with an engine with a carburetor, it was usually a necessity or the engine would stumble. Warming up an engine is simply not necessary with a modern, fuel injected engine. I haven't done it in around 20 years and I've never had an engine problem of any type nor have I ever had an engine that used oil.
And here's another article: http://ezinearticles.com/?Should-You-Let-Your-Car-Warm-Up-Before-Driving?&id=1975316

Fast idle to warm up then hit the road at road speeds and increase speeds/load gradually...

If it's fuel injected , turn the key on , wait til
the light does off, PUSH the starter button and GO.
It can't get any easier that that. Since you are in the L.A.
area you need to keep the air filter clean. Warm up time
is for COLD weather places, NOT L.A. or O.C. beach city. 8)

I would have to say it protects seals and gaskets more then anything

Once the oil has circulated (a matter of seconds really) you're good to go. Especially in the modern 4-stroke motors. The 2-strokes, however, should probably be warmed. Always make sure the engine has reached operating temperature before shutting it off, though. This goes for any motor.

+1.
I let it run just long enough to get the oil circulating.

C&P from Vespa

Precautions
CAUTION
NEVER STRESS THE ENGINE AT LOW TEMPERATURES IN ORDER TO AVOID
POSSIBLE DAMAGE. BE CAREFUL NEVER TO EXCEED THE MAXIMUM SPEED
WHILE RUNNING DOWNHILL, IN ORDER TO AVOID DAMAGING THE ENGINE.
IN ANY CASE, IN ORDER TO PRESERVE THE ENGINE FROM PROLONGED EXCESSIVE
REVOLUTIONS, THE REVOLUTION LIMITER WILL BE ACTIVATED IF
THE ENGINE SPEED EXCEEDS THE ESTABLISHED THRESHOLD.


its on page 31 for what its worth.

http://www.americanrider.com/output.cfm?id=1021933

It also seems like the performance characteristics change when not given a warm up. My 300ie tends to be a bit more jerky at low speed when first started...

Warm it up!

An aluminum piston will heat up and expand much quicker than the barrel, specially if the bike is liquid cooled.

If your bike is cold, start it and let it idle while you don your helmet and gloves.. your engine will thank you.

If you dont, you run the risk of getting what is known as a cold seize.


Wibbo

105 C as in Celsius?

Bring it up to operational temperature as soon as possible.
Start it up and go.

I always start it first, put on my helmet, take it off the center stand, get seated, give it a few revs, check my mirror position ... then go. Takes me about one to one and a half minutes.

However ... the way to the main road from my place is all downhill. I find that if I put my helmet on first, don't let it warm up and just take off, then it almost always stalls going downhill unless I give it some gas (and the brakes) at the same time. I figure I will wear out my brakes more quickly than most riders due to the hills around here, so I have stopped doing that and just let it warm up a little to prevent it from stalling.

Based on the fact that both my scooters will stall going downhill when cold ... that tells me that they need a brief warming up period whether on a hill or on the flat, otherwise, they wouldn't stall like that. Right?

One is fuel injected and the other isn't.

+1

I firmly believe warming your engine first is the correct answer.I mean you can prove it to yourself just by listening to your engine, as well how it performs after riding a few hundred feet.This for any piston engine.A cold engine just seems like its running sick.

Do what you think is best for you and your engine. I will warm mine abit for starting and loading just to be safe

he ment

41 degrees Celsius

My undergrad thermodynamics books had a little section on this. Their contention was that it takes more engine cycles to come to temperature at idle than at operating RPMs, not neccessarily WOT. Which means more cycles with the oil at less than ideal temperatures. That is why engines have a fast idle, so the engine warms up faster.

That being said, I'm a jump on and go kinda guy. If you were not supposed to drive it, there would be a light saying don't drive it. I put 18k before putting a 190 kit and the cylinder looks fine.

I love thermodynamics its my bread and butter

I fire the engine up, put on my helmet, gloves and glasses and go, riding it gently till up to operating temp.

Wayne B

Hi Emillkim
I think you can take away from this that waiting 10 minutes is a huge waist of gas, and time. Just start her up put on your gear (helmet, gloves, jacket if not already on) Then just take off slowly till it gets fully warmed up. You do not have to wait till the engine gets to fully warm before you can go. But like others said, don't go wot out of the gate either. Work it up to full speed.
The main thing about these scoots, is preform the maintanace, get the services done and you can ride for years and years. It is not a china doll, they are designed to be a main form of transportation. There are good ones, bad ones and great ones.

So take care of her, and ride when you can, enjoy the hell out of it!! 8)

My bikes get to operating temperature doing 30mph for less than a minute - under half a mile. They take over four minutes to get there on idle. Jump on, start, go (but take it easy for a minute or two).

Thermo was my best subject in school.

I live and work for heatrate and sparkspeads. not to get off topic.

I do think warm up defintion has changed over the year when it come to engines.

Indeed, 105 F.

id turn it on...put on my gloves jacket and helmet.. make a quick walk around the bike to check things and go!

My way of thinking is:

- if there was any OBJECTIVE evidence that you were doing damage to your engine by not warming it up, we would all know about it. It would also be in 6in letters on about 20 stickers, placed all over your bike when you bought it. It would also be on page 1 of the manual, in unambiguous terms (which, imho, is not at all what the C&P quote in the post up above says)

- if my bike is prone to stalling shortly after startup, this is probably indicative of something being wrong with the bike. Not because I haven't warmed it up

YMMV

I turn my ET on, after about 4 seconds the engine revs drop a little and away I go.
The only time it doesn't start first push of the button is if it's not driven the day before. So Mondays take two pushes of the button. My understanding is the oil is pumped around the engine in time with the revs. More revs quicker oil movement. The oil works well wether hot or cold. Plus with synthetic oils clinging to the sides and lining the side of the casing. In a racing car the temp is important because of BHP/fuel mixture goes up/down with temperature of the engine. My understanding is that at the extremes of running temprtures...
Hot engine=better fuel economy, less BHP.
Cold running=Better BHP, less fuel economy.

I've seen classic sports cars started and revved up when started from cold. By ex formula one team mechanics whose job it is to service and care for them.

It aint a Harley!

I think we all know that, what else you have to offer.

Do not warm up an engine in idle, period. Just give it 5-10 seconds to build up oil pressure, to ensure proper lubrication, and then start riding at medium throttle and medium RPMs until it is warm.

This is why: a cold engine (actually, cold oil and a cold engine) will not lubricate optimally, there will be more wear during the warm-up phase.
There will also be more fuel condensation, diluting the oil and therefore reducing its lubricating properties.

Warming up an engine in idle will take considerably longer than warming up in actual riding under load, so you would be extending the time it is subjected to extensive wear. Keep that phase as short as possible to enjoy your engine longer. But make sure you avoid full throttle and high RPMs during the warm-up phase.

so you ment the other warm up phase then.

OP 10min is to long

Both of my scooters do this. I know there is an idle problem with the fuel injected one. Does that mean there is also an idle problem with my 2008 model?