Modern Vespa

Sorry 500 CC just isn't enough. . .

Is it just me! Perhaps I need to save for a Can Am

Go test ride a Can Am like I did...you'll be running and screaming back to your mp3...Let's see...

Can Am= no lean, 5-6K dollars more, about 20 mpg less....hmmm

My test ride on it was great!..up until I came to the first curve.

If you're really dying for that power, go get a Mana. Not only does it look nice, have the auto transmission(with 3 select modes), but it will smoke the Can Am on any real road with curves and real life driving conditions. The Can Am is a large toy designed for those who are afraid of falling over and don't care about what they've lost to obtain that feature. If I were thinking of buying a Goldwing trike but didn't want to fork out 30 grand, the Can Am would be a good option.

If you need more power, why not try out a normal bike?

Then you can have more power than you can handle.

A scooter will never be racer. You can haev fun with it yes, but still. CVT and 500 cc wont cut it.
And add to the fact that scooters have a tendency to weight a bit more.

So all in all. More power = regular bike.

Hang on Luthorhuss - and you know I mean this kindly!!!! But there may come a day when I will be looking at the Can Am and it won't be for any of the reasons you stated - though I do think there are people out there that buy it for those reasons. In this last year I found out that I have severe arthritis in my knees - genetic likely. I have to have a knee replacement in about 2 years (length of time I can stand the pain). But there may come a day when my knees may not be able to hold up the weight of a bike. If that day comes I would rather be ridiculed for getting a Can Am then never to ride again. I would rather be safe on the road, not just for me but for others, than trying to lean or hold up a bike I can't. Obviously there is a trade off but I think it would be worth it - open air, wind in my face and all the other things I love about riding besides being able to lean. Now truly I am not picking on you. At the moment I wouldn't consider the Can Am because I can handle my scoot very well. But someday I may have to broaden my scope and the Can Am looks good to me.

Hey a "GOLDWING TRIKED" for $30K, better stop smelling the paint fumes! Try adding about 4k-10k more to that figure! (at least a new one all around + taxes and tags)

I don't understand the disdain shown for Can-Am Spyder's on this board. It is an interesting and unusual ride. There is no need to dump on it just because it is not your thing.

Personally I am glad there are companies out there making something other than 600cc super sport bikes and 1800cc monster cruisers. I personally have no intention of buying one but I at least appreciate the choice.

The Mana is a good choice if you want a motorcycle.
The BV500 is faster than any MP3 and is a scooter that gets 55-60 MPG too.

I gotta agree. The Spyders are most unusual and definitely a different ride than a bike, but they have a unique attraction and nicely fill the niche they created...

I saw no less than FIVE Can-Am Spyders in South Dakota - of all places - cruising the Black Hills about two weeks ago. One was from Alberta, ridden by a heavier individual, but the others were all local plates and go-fast, with apparent enthusiasts aboard. Fascinating to look at and probably a really good choice for touring - especially the new RT model with trailer.

But if I had room in my stable (and a pile of dough) I'd look seriously at the FJR1300AE for long distance sport touring first.

the MP3 doesn't need more displacement. it needs less weight. literbikes weigh less than the 250...

I doubt Piaggio will ever make a MP3-850, but that much power would be nice to have.
What is needed is a custom bike maker to put the Mana engine & trans in a MP3-400.

Either way it would be way too expensive.

That would be great if they could make a lighter MP3... or make it drop-proof. You know... like a sidewards Segway. Did I just say that out loud?

There is a gentleman out west that sponsor tours with his spyder can am for the last year and a half.

I am thinking that the front suspension and bearings would have to be beefed up significantly for an 800 or 850 version. Would like to see it happen.

I think the primary overhaul to go to a bigger motor is going to be the chassis. Let's be honest: most MCs today are using aluminum frames, while ours is a still non-optimized all-steel frame. Changing that alone would save quite a bit of weight, but I imagine Piaggio (for now) thinks that such an overhaul is too expensive, especially since scooters are though of as intentionally slower vehicles, not sportsbikes.

That said, I believe Piaggio will HAVE to change.

The other MC manufacturers will continue to move towards more "automatics", making them direct competitors against the scooter market. When this happens people will naturally gravitate towards the larger CC MCs (which will invariably include 3-wheeled varieties like the MP3), and put Piaggio in the defensive.

Personally I think now's the time for Piaggio to do a complete overhaul, or even create a new unit from scratch:
* lightweight aluminum (or steel/aluminum combo) frame
* larger engine
* smoother clutch and variator
* modern safety amenities (HID lights, ABS, electric adjustable windscreen).

NOW... consider that Yamaha's FJ1300 sport-tourer already HAS all of these things, and at $14-16,000US MSRP, which rivals the cost of the MP3 500.

The only thing they are missing is a 3-wheeled layout and a swing across chassis (scooter style leg arrangement), and they could wipe the floor with Piaggio.

Don't get me wrong, I love my MP3, but I'd sell it in a minute if such a 1300cc, 3-wheeled scoot were produced.

Zang

BTW, did I mention that the FJ1300 has a 5.5gal tank and a 300mi/500km range between fill-ups? How many of us here who like the longer drives would appreciate that in a scoot, too?

Granted, undercarriage storage doesn't exist on the MC in its present form, but that's what some would argue top and side cases are for.

Just trying to point out what the competition is doing. Piaggio is ultimately competing against them for our business...

Zang

Zang, I have a used 500 to sell you for the low, low price of $8500. Based on your estimation above, that's a saving of over $6000 for a slightly used 500. What a bargain! I'll even ship it to you! Seriously, the Fj1300 is nice, but I got my 500 out the door for under $9K with only 40 miles on it at purchase and that was AFTER eating a tad on a trade in and with 12 months no payments/no interest.

I look forward to ANY NEW Piaggio stuff, as they tend to be only still 'tweaking' new models here or there. The bad news is that it looks like they're putting a lot of effort into the hybrid which to be honest, is like trying to invent the airplane and then go to the jet in one model. You've got a great thing going with the 3 wheeled technology and you've got great forums like these for improvements and for taking that idea and running with it....don't screw things up by trying to combine still 'iffy' tech of hybrid power with it simultaneously. I honestly think that if you put out a mp3 800-850 RIGHT now that was just like the 500, but of course could handle the weight/pressure on the bearings, but got 30 mpg...we would still buy it. I think the only people who ride mp3s for the "gas savings" are those who haven't owned one long or don't own one yet. After one year of service, mods, tires, gear, etc...you realize that it's a hobby, just like golf and the minor mpg savings vs a sportbike, motorcycle, or economy car are unnoticeable.

Its gonna be hard for a motorcyle to ever compete with a sccoter unless they develop more storage. Most motorcyle riders ride for pleasure. Alot of scooter owners use their bike as a second vehicle, me included. Just adding a topcase is not enough storage for some. I guess in a perfect world a person would just own a scooter and a motorcyle.

Most motorcycles don't handle as well at low speed as scooters either.

Wayne B

I have to say, the combination of Fuoco and GP800 comes close. They overlap a bit, both being huge fun in the twisties, but fast long distance touring on the Fuoco is not so pleasurable (monkey-butt and leg-ache) and around town on the GP800 is not so great (frustration at the slow speeds).

That said, I'm hoping to take the Fuoco to Italy next year - but using only back-roads.

My long-gone X9 500 was the best for touring though - comfy, capable of 100mph+, 160 mile range, seemingly infinite foot positions for 'adjusting' oneself. If the current owner puts it up for sale I might buy it back.

Ahh,, THE X9-500,, was the best Piaggio ever made for touring.

It was the 'Rolls Royce' of the Piaggio range, and as far as I and many other previous owners are concerned has never yet been bettered, or replaced with any equivalent.

However it had some weak points, such as over-reliance on the Digidash working at all times, but apart from that was top-notch. Even those foibles could be worked around if one was handy at electronics (thankfully I was).

now all we need is ray or mike to make a turbo charger or NOS valve and were set!

YES!!!!

A thing of beauty that would be, the Mana engine and transmission in an MP3 400.

[/img]

V-Twin 850cc = 75 hp

Which is why I suggested that *IF* they produced a three-wheeled, swing across design, you'd get that extra security tied to a popular name brand. And that's an apples to oranges comparison... I've seen used 08 FJs with very low miles for around $11k, too.

*****

I'm not implying that the match-up is perfect right now: my WHOLE POINT is that right now it's not, and that means the MP3 is 'safe'. But the competitors are not sitting around twiddling their thumbs, either.

They know that the "automatic motorcycle" has been increasingly popular, and that it's only going to grow as people decide or perceive (correctly or incorrectly) that a two-or three-wheeled bike might save them a few dollars on personal transportation. The discussions on this forum about a competitor's products (e.g. Honda's dual-clutch automatics) only prove that point.

Let's be clear: Piaggio's competitors certainly have the skills, equipment, and know-how to not only replicate a Piaggio MP3, but probably do it better (in my opinion)... right now they've simply chosen not to. Personally I'd like to see Piaggio hold onto its leadership position, but technologically they're going to have to do some serious overhauls if they were to produce and potentially compete with the "big boys" in the large CC cycle/scooter market.

I think the Mana is a great example of the ingenuity the company has, but don't think the competitors have shrugged it off. If an ideas works, every company will duplicate it within a year or two. It's the way of the automotive world... something tells me companies can't ignore statistics like these: http://articles.latimes.com/2009/apr/01/business/fi-honda-automatic1 (see end of article).

Zang

I don't have the MP3 500 because I can't ride a bike with a clutch, I did that for 31 years with no problem. I didn't by a big bike because big bikes come with huge insurance rates. The get much over 500 cc and the rates go up, go to a liter bike and they more than double. Not willing to pay $800 a year for motorcycle insurance to own a liter bike.

Wayne B

what about the gp800?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0fOguL9yT8&feature=related

the mono headlight i dont like but the dual exhaust is thrilling like the power

this is insane:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFzkXaNqVjU&feature=related

even too fast for me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5ueYSbqOJU&feature=related

Yes, the speedo needle does go off the dial! It was a private road, honest!

uh huh, sure it was

Since this thread began over 3 years ago and there still is no MP3 800, isn't it fairly safe to assume the answer to the original question is, "Never!: or "Not in my lifetime."

Jerry, you've looked at when the OP joined the forums. The post was started 3 days ago.

perhaps this thread needs to be a stickey

It'd become invisible then.

Well there is not likely to ever be a production 850 MP3. Although the Mana technology could make it possible. It is not practical, it would be competeing against too many motorcycles. That much power and responsiveness in a 3 wheeler would demand 16 or 17 inch wheels, for stability, handling etc.

I have truly enjoyed this 250, it has been the most fun I have had on a bike in 30 years of riding. I rarely ride the Harley any more.

I told my wife I was going to trade the MP3 for a Mana and she became upset. Stated I couldn't get rid of the MP3. I told her I wanted a Mana 850. she said I could have two bikes, by trading the Harley. I replied I wanted to get a dirt bike too, she said go ahead, I could have 3 bikes as long as I keep the MP3. While she does not ride it, she loves the reaction we get when traveling around town.

She ia a keeper, so is the MP3.

Smart, smart man...

Could we do a mind meld to my wife?

Wayne B

Wayne - you listen to your wife when it comes to vehicles???? Good for you. My husband just doesn't get it when it comes to the bike. But there are times he just takes one look at me as simply says "go - I'll take care of the kids."

There have been times when I wanted to move up from the 250. But after 1 year I can tell that the 250 is perfect for what I do. With my top case I have enough room for a ton of groceries. I love the 65 mpg I get. I really can't go 60 mph in the city anyway. I don't get to go on road trips - my kids are still young. So a bigger bike wouldn't get the use just now anyway. But if I ever have to start commuting then I would consider something else.

I had the wife talked in to a new BMW...she even called the dealer for me. She about exploded when she heard the price.

Sill looking for those extra bikes...

If piaggio builds an 800cc MP3, I'll buy it. In the mean time I spread my time between a BMW R1200GS and my 500 MP3. Love em both. Use them differently. It will never be either or for me. We all need bikes for each application that interests us, because no single bike does all of it well. I prefer the aired down MP3 in the sand to my R1200GS. I have the skinned shins to illustrate why.