Modern Vespa

No, let it ride for a while Jess, there is a lot more information that will accrue over the next few days.

Thanks for the emoticoms.

I don't ride at 100 mph to begin with nor do I match revs to slide around corners because riding like that is moronic. So, no, I can't pass your skills test. My point was the principle of shifting gears is the same on a bicycle, car, motorcycle, shifty scoot, ATV etc... there is nothing frightening about it.

Yes I'm sure you'll handle it just fine! It might take a while to get used to the clutch/shift thing and a couple of embarrassing engine stalls while taking off from a red light or a stop while on a slope, but it's all part of the learning process (and some might say, fun!).

Not sure about the constant tinkering part as I've always been told to go Japanese when it comes to reliability, and despite once owning a supposedly reliable Japanese bike, I find myself having to learn to ticker with bits of it every now and then (supposedly a motorbike owner's thing). There's also more maintenance too like keeping the chain clean and lubed. Wasn't it something about the birth of the Vespa being a design by somebody who hated motorcycle designs?

So yea, I suppose it's a lengthy way of saying although it has two wheels and leans on turns, it's quite a different vehicle to ride and maintain from a GT200 and you can definitely do it although you might have to be learning it from the beginning!

Nope, but neither should you accuse me of picking fights when I am dispensing my own opinion about whether someone should get a motorcycle or not.

People can read both sets of opinions and decide which one makes the most sense.

'course if you're just going to accuse me of picking fights (when there are at least two unnecessary posts in here which serve no purpose other than to start fights) then of course people will discount any experience or help I give. But you like it that way.

Exactly - hence my suggestion of a used 250cc $1000 Honda Rebel instead of a new $8,000? More? Triumph to learn to ride on.

But people are always free to tell others what to do with their money. I'm trying to save her some heartache.

But it's FUN to tell people to just go ahead and go for it!

Thanks!
THAT is exactly the type of advice I was looking for
(You'll do better on the "modern side" if you start with that)

And they didn't have us pick them up
And there were some huge motorcycles there,
probably others couldn't have

And for anyone who's interested, the Moto Guzzis have a 32" seat height
Seriously!!

I was more making a comment on the "bored" part than the fight-picking part, but if you'd like to seize upon that aspect, go right ahead. You seemed to be ruffling feathers just fine before I got here, though.

Carry on, then. Dirty feather-ruffler.

I agree that 250 is a good size for a first bike. Here is one with a similar look to the Triumph.

Please!
(That's pretty funny!)

Like that (except for the stupid little mirrors, which I be you can change out)
What is that?

I don't know the answer to that. But it wouldn't hurt you to go to a dealership and look. A Honda Rebel is basically the same bike they teach the MSF course with, however, I didn't like it. It wasn't comfortable, the airbox is awkwardly placed, in my opinion, and tended to dig into the back of my thigh. After a couple of hours on it, I was sure I wasn't comfortable.
The S40 is designed to be an entry level bike with higher end features to make it a good ride.
It's true that you will probably drop a bike at least once after you get it. so perhaps going with a used one that someone is selling to trade up to a higher displacement is the way to go.
I am saying that the configuration of the S40 is more upright than the usual 'crotch rockets' and the placement of the foot controls is more forward (rather than underneath) which makes it easier for shifting (IMHO) for those of us with "small feets".
Your best bet would be to demo what you are interested in if you are able for a least a week, even if you're only driving it in empty parking lots to see how it feels.

It's the Suzuki TU250. It actually have fuel injection! Modern (and probably indestructable) engine with the retro look...

http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycles/suzuki-tu250/

Suzuki TU250

There is one problem I foresee with this bike, although it does look very nice. It's got a 30" seat height, and the OP stated she is short, er, vertically challenged.

Not sure if I liked linked brakes, but that is another story.

I wasn't going to participate in this testosterone festival, and I won't waste your time with my bonafides but I have some thoughts.

1) the heart wants what the heart wants--if you love the Bonnie, then who's to say you shouldn't get one. It is a fine and beautiful machine.

2) You ask if you can learn to ride it. Of course you can if you want to.

Now here's my little story.

25 years ago my wife decided she wanted a motorcycle...apparently she had always wanted one and decided that was the time. She didn't want a little piece of crap she'd get tired of and found a 650cc BMW that was love at first sight. She had never used a manual shift in her life.

I explained how the brakes, clutch and shifter worked and she was off. First take off found her in our neighbor's yard. A little practice, getting a feel and she took to it like a duck to water.

A few weeks later we went out on our bikes together. I let her go in front so I wouldn't lose her. I was both amused and surprised when at the first sharp turn she expertly downshifted, matched revs, leaned way, way over and smartly accelerated out of the curve.

I know it took me much longer to get that confident. She got good, fast, because she WANTED to.

If you want to, you will learn.

(edited to correct typos)

P.

I test drove a 70's (I think) Triumph Trident recently, and found it reminiscent of the old days, but not in a good way. The handling was heavy, lots of vibration, and the whole thing seemed pretty primitive, esp. compared to my GTS 300 (duh). Anyway, I passed on it, even though it was a very good deal. BTW, do they still use those weird Whitworth wrenches?

Don't get the rebel, you might as well stick with the scooter as the rebel is not highway capable 65mph top speed or so. Plus it has spoked wheels and tube tires. 250cc (air cooled) are for new new riders. You've already been riding a scooter so the dropping because I forgot the kickstand thing should be out of your system. The other drops can happen the same on a scooter or a motorcycle. The triumph has 67 hp maybe less and is strong up to 85 mph. Tubeless tires too. (I've had lots of flats and wouldn't like to get stuck trying to fix a tubed tire on the road. There are some reviews out there on the triumph and they are spot on. motorcycleusa.com

Lots of good info to chew on here

Thanks guys!

Are you serious about the Shiver? I've done quite a bit of canyon riding on one, also quicker stuff at up to 135 mph on the thing, and felt quite stable! Much more so than my GTS at 85... I think the Shiver is a great bike. Why call it a POS?

As far as the Bonnie goes, it is a SUPER easy bike to learn shifting on. It's very forgiving, and honestly, as a result, pretty boring to ride in my opinion.

I wouldn't call this a "little bike". The new Suzuki Tu250 is a neat little bike, the Bonnie is a medium weight 850cc sized standard.
Handle well at 70? Sheeesh, these bikes handle okay at 120+!
However they are heavier and more awkward steering than a scooter (especially at first),
need regular chain adjustments and maintanence, require shifting, and cost around $8500 new to get OTD...

And they're not an OLD design. These new Bonnies have been updated with an all new design, better frame, good electrics, EFI, etc, etc.
True, they're not designed like the sport bike crotch rockets are, but most of your new crotch rockets are designed
more for the track than for realistic and comfortable street riding, and IMO are mostly bought by johnny-racer-boy types...
Older designs unsafe design for speed? -Hell, my old '92 750cc Honda Nighthawk was speed rated at 132MPH,
and I found out a few times it would handle okay at 90-100MPH!
You gotta run at more than that on the streets and highways, you need a shrink, not a motorcycle IMO !

Hey L:

Yeah, a Bonneville is a big step up from a GT200. What year is that one? It has a speedo & tach, but also side reflectors.

Anyway, if you are interested in a moto, as a first step, consider a 70's Honda CB 350, or an 80's Honda Hawk 400. Both great low-maintenance bikes & lighter. A triumph will be a bit more maintenance and definitely sexier, but overall handling is similar.

Once you a feel comfortable on that, a Bonny or a TR6 (single carb) might make more sense.

$0.02

\\osc

This is a man to listen to.

I love the Honda CB series. LURVE.

Hawks are also fun.

I kind of agree with Mike, oddly, though - in a grander concept - which is be careful. in particular, switching bikes (from a less to more powerful bike) happens to be a rather large cause of accidents.

It's important to take the time to actually learn the differences in approach between a smaller, flickable scooter, and a larger, torquey motorcycle. Respect and expect the differences.

The modern triumph has a pretty good track record as far as reliability, on par with the japanese bikes. Basically oil changes and chain adjustment. the engine on the bonneville se has been around for 5-7 years so its solid. 80's UJM are great but your talking about 20+ years of sitting around or use. Need parts? Might not be so easy. I've read that the nighthawks are pretty solid though, shaft drive and bullet proof engines.
This new triumph is very scooter like in its torque curve. That's what I thought when I test rode one this spring. It doesn't have that delay that a scooter has though when you twist the throttle but it also doesn't throw you back in the seat either it just moves forward. I have a 300 gts and I would say the two are similar in their ease of use in urban environment. The scoot gets the nod for flickability but the triumph is not far behind. When I ride my M109r around town its like a bull in a china shop I really have to watch the trottle application. The triumph and scooter I can just twist and go.

The Bonneville SE is a fairly new retro model--2009/2010
The straight Bonneville doesn't have the tach
(which I'd like on anything that shifts, not that I'd be looking at it much)

I would be very interested in a 350/400--that seems like a better power range to start
I rode a 250 in the basic MSF class and cannot imagine them being too useful as a street bike

But not so much interested in older bikes
My wrenching abilities are limited,
mostly by a husband that completely freaks at the thought

Incidentally, the husband is warming a bit toward the Triumph,
but he still wants his BMW
Go figure!

Good advice on this thread. Take the MSF course and learn to ride a motorcycle (shifting, etc) and then make your decision. One of my best woman friends drives a v-rod, which weighs about 650 pounds, and she doesn't weigh much over 130 pounds herself.

When people see my Vespa and say they wish they had one, or that their wife wants one, the only thing I say is DON'T WAIT! If you have the money, and can ride, then just do it. Life is too short to wait around. Two wheels are just too much fun! I wish I hadn't waited so long.

I started off on a 125cc Aprilia Habana Custom and then did the DAS.
As soon as I passed i bought a Yamaha FZS600cc. I've ridden bigger CC bikes and scooters since so here is my twopenneth......
Take your time learning (you never really stop learning) and respect the bikes power and hopefully all will be fine.

I had a couple of points. First, can you retake the MSF course and learn to shift on their bikes? When I took it they had bikes you could learn to shift on. I'd recommend taking that course to anyone who might want to ever ride. They're really good at getting you going.

I recently took in my lx150 for repairs at a local shop that sells BMWs, Triumphs and Vespas. They loaned me a Triumph Scrambler while my scooter was in the shop. It's a 900 cc twin like the Bonny, and I absolutely loved it. I'd buy a Triumph in a heartbeat after riding that thing, and I think the Bonny has much better ergonomics. The Scrambler has a higher seat and a high exhaust pipe. I was seriously looking for a used bonny after I turned the scrambler back in.

As to Mr. "Drag your knee or die"'s comments, ignore him. There, I poked the troll, let's see if he comes back out from under the bridge.
Here's my obligatory emoticon. Seriously, he makes some good points about knowing the bounds of your control of your vehicle, but his overheated rhetoric about "downshifting 2 gears to get to 120 mph quickly" is a bit overblown. I rode sport bikes for 15 years with no accidents, and I didn't have to beat the shit out of my bike to blast away from accidents. Just pay attention so you aren't surprised by the antics of the idiots around you.

Finally, have you considered just a bigger scooter? Some folks love the kymco people 250 on the highway. If you just want to feel better on the highway, a bigger scoot with bigger wheels might be the way to go.

JR

Chazlee, the Nighthawk 650 gets past 100mph in fifth. Then, I remembered there's yet another gear to use! Fun fun.

To the OP, the guy canyon riding is probably not the same type of rider you intend to be. But he's making strong points too. I would Strongly recommend the Suzuki TU250 and find some place to ride off road. Not trail racing, trail riding. You learn everything you need as far as instinct on the trails and its best to learn that instinct on a bike that isn't overwhelming. Plus, the seat on the TU ought to squish down a little, I would imagine.

Take a dirt rider put that rider on the street and no matter what gets in that rider's path, instinct will most likely get them through it. Take an exclusively street rider, albeit a very good one, put that rider in the dirt and prepare to render first aid. The TU would make an excellent trail bike.

I have to say this. Because its become so ingrained in people that it needs to be addressed:

If you ride a safe motorcycle for the kind of riding you ride, you do not need to get a bigger bike just because someone tells you so. Climb a hill and you'll have to twist in some more throttle to get up it. Doesn't matter if its an 1,800 cc behemoth or an LX150.

Everyone is different. How they learn is different too. We can't tell you what to buy or what not to buy based solely on displacement or overall size because we really don't know you. The truth is, appreciating a bike's appearance has almost nil to do with the experience of riding it. That's a sound warning from one of the posters on this thread. Please consider it.

Harv

i like the duc.

Hey Linda, bring your scoot up to Spartanburg, we'll go riding and you can check out some of my motorcycles. I have a Honda GB500 and a Honda CB 500 which are very good first time bikes. I also have a Kawasaki H2 750 which is very scary to ride. I like the Bonneville and know people who have them. They are great bikes. I plan on owning one of them one day.

I'd agree if it weren't so rare.

Just one.

How'd you get 120(+?) out of an RD350? I'm going to assume it's modified quite a bit from the stocker's 40 hp to be able do that..and as for the Ducati, these days, you can do a little 10 minute internet search for a road test on your Ducati and get a good idea of how fast it is capable of going....its not like it's a big mystery or anything, or that it's so fast that nobody knows.

My point with the Duc is it's so fast I've never had it up to top speed to actually test it against the claimed top speed. No where really to do it in this area.

And yes, my RD is modified, though stock they were about 110 so eeking out another 10mph isnt hard. My mods have mostly been for the lower/mid range though.

Read the latest issue of Motorcyclist Magazine. In the tech section in the back they mention that there is an electrical issue with the new fuel injected Bonnies that Triumph is aware of but has not yet figured out.
Apparently if the ECU does not recieve the correct voltage it will not start the bike. So unless the battery is in absolute tip top condition it has stranded many riders.

Here's the thing. When a bike sits, the voltage drops below 12V and often drops below the threshold the Bonnie needs to start, even thought that's fine for almost any other bike. It has some weird programming in the ECU.

Previous year non FI Bonnies are fine.

That's a bummer.

And why my bikes sit on a battery tender if I'm going to leave them more than a day.

Both the RD and Duc have left me hoofing it to the Metro a couple of mornings before I got wise.

The problem is if your battery was not prepped perfectly by the dealer in PDI, it will never hold a full charge, no matter how long you leave it on a battery tender afterwards. So people are experiencing this issue even if they use battery tenders. Or once their batteries start to get some miles on them.

Excellent! That's very generous

Please look for a PM

Yes, I've been considering a bigger scooter for freeways for a long time

Some of the freeways around here are not perfectly groomed and have a speed limit of 70 mph,
so lots of folks are going at least 80
Eventually I'd like to ride them on 2 wheels, but not on a Vespa

BTW, I'm NOT rushing out to buy anything--certainly not a $8500 motorcycle


Just weighing my options and looking for that "dream girlbike"

Thanks! That's good info

I'm sure they'll get it figured out before I'm ready for one