Modern Vespa

My GTS has developed what I will first describe as a rattle.

It is much nastier than a rattle though.

It sounds kind of like roller weight rattle but seems to be coming from the rear.

It is a snatching, catching sound like there is a loose nut caught in the clutch.

It comes and goes, going over a bump will start it, it is random.

I removed the transmission cover and had a good look around and didn't find anything.

I put it all back together and took it for a ride and the noise came back.

Now that I have ruled out a rock or whatever caught in the transmission housing it's like it sounds like it is coming from inside the final drive gearbox.

Has anyone else experienced this?

Anyone heard anything like this happening?

It is so loud , CLACK, Rattle, SNATCH CLACK CLACK that whatever it is, it's trashing something, so I'm not riding it until it's figured out.

Any help, suggestions and wild-ass guesses all welcome, it's my commute vehicle and I need to fix it.

thanks in advance.

marc

How's your hub oil level and how does the oil look?

Maybe a certfiied Vespa tech at your dealer's can help?

That's where I'm going next.

Now that I've bragged on Jess's exhaust thread how I'm still on my original graphite bushing I guess I better pre-order a new one of those before I go in there

My nearest tech is 50 miles away, Vespa Santa Cruz, great guys and very competent.

I guess I'm trolling for the answer that's obvious.....

The only other thing I can imagine is the rear brake pads/caliper setup is at fault, the rear brake has seemed a little stiffer than usual the past week or so but is working.

Unless someone comes up with 'yes it's the lock washer falls off the shreminizer in the fahoogle, just replace it, it will be fine'......... anyone?

Nope, sorry. Not without experiencing it in person - which is why you should wish for the advice of an *experienced* tech.

Thanks jimc, I have about 35,000 miles on modern Vespas logged in the last nine years or so and haven't ever heard this noise before or even heard of it talked about.

The funny thing is there is no difference in performance, whatever it is nothing important has stopped working, yet.

I'd be just as worried as you seem to be - like concerned - but relieved nothing has actually seized yet...

At 35,000 miles (if that is the bike's life) I'd be thinking of stripping the transmission, giving it a good eyeball and replacing whatever's necessary anyway.

I've had 2 clutch-backing plates break loose and they rattle like mad, doesn't effect performance, just gets on my tits.

I had a gril in for service last week with a similar rattle and turned out to be her license plate ratteling. But I assume that that would not be the cause of this noise. Also, I have had a customer with a loose center stand. I think yours may be more techical. Good luck!

Check the most obvious things first, like the main wheel axle nut is tight and it isnt the nut/washer/retainer/split pin set up making all the noise as its all loose and rattling about... also make sure the swingarm to engine mounting bolts are still in place and tight...

Check the brake caliper pads havent worn a ridge into the retaining pin OR elongated the hole in the brake pads that the pin fits through, as this could allow the pads to chatter in the caliper and make a right old noise...

Its also worth checking the needle roller bearing in the clutch unit, its unsealed and exposed to belt dust in the drivecase and can often break up on some unlucky people which can also make some horrible noises...

If none of them are the problem then it looks like a gearbox strip time, but its rare to have one fail... very rare really, so do it as a last resort only.

Thanks for the tips everyone!

cheekythomas, thank you, it seems to be on the wheel side of the clutch.

The clutch spins smoothly, I spun the rear wheel with the transmission cover off focusing on the clutch area and it didn't play for me.

After I re-assembled the cover I started it up again on the stand and the brake caliper area caught my attention, the pad squidding and catching on the cooling holes on the rotor would produce the sound, it's just that with the exhaust right there it's hard to pinpoint and it only does it when I rev the engine.

Of course this is all speculation, I couldn't strip the exhaust off last night to get at the wheel (which is all tight and copacetic btw) because it was hot, so I will be at it tonight after work.

Now I did drop the bike, massive rear wheel lock-up and stood her up on the front wheel, like a brakey, then the rear spun around (in the air) and came down on the left side badly bending the rear brake lever, but I've put a couple hundred miles on it since then, only 4 miles since the noise started.

It may have landed heavily, sideways, on the rear wheel and knocked something loose in the gearbox.....I'm not sure, I was doing a 'Captain Kirk' roll into oncoming traffic at the time.

I have never stripped a gearbox, are there special tools involved, like pullers?

O.K!

I believe my nasty noise is a failed bearing in the cast aluminum housing that the rear axle, r.h.s shock and exhaust mount to.

If it isn't this bearing needs replacing anyway, it is 'crunchy' and turning it with my finger I can cause it to sieze.

Next problem, how does that bearing come out?

I have replaced the bearing on an ET's transmission cover, where the axle sits and it had a circlip which, when removed, the old bearing came out using a large socket and some light taps.

This bearing has no circlip and I have bashed at it with a socket and drift mallet and all I've done is pop the plastic cover off the bearing race.

Anyone have an insiders tip, I'm hoping it does not involve heat.....(yeah, wishful thinking) as I have a custom wrinkle finish paint job on the housing....

How about freezing?

My kids hate fishsticks so I can make room in the freezer and be a hero at the same time (sorry mom, they 'had to go')

Any techs out there replaced this bearing?

It just presses out IIRC. It's a very standard bearing, just use the part number stamped on it for a replacement. I do know the Kawasaki equivalents are far cheaper then the Piaggio ones. How do I know? Just had to replace one on the X9 125 a few months ago.

Thanks jimc, there is a bearing store close to me over in Salinas (where Bobby McGee slipped away).

The bearing is a little grotty so I need to get it out and clean it up to see the number.

The thing is the outer ring is protected by the housing from the rear, so to press it out (or bang it) pressure must be applied to the balls themselves or the inner ring.

I am reticent to keep at it and be stuck with an outer ring only having burst the innards out, so to speak.

I'm thinking there may be a particular 'technique'.

Heat is your friend...

You need Piaggio part #82545r....its a sealed radial bearing, size is 17 x 47 x 14. Piaggio asks $20+ for this part....less than half that price at a bearing shop.

Common metric bearing.

Easy job really. I just use a large socket and rubber mallet.

My $0.02

R

8)

Thanks Rich,
I was using a large socket (27mm) and a nylon mallet, but man, I was wanging on it so hard I was beginning to fear for the casting.

I've brought it into work and I'll try some heat and a small hand press.

The bearings a 6303 2RS C3.... Cheap as chips!

..so was it the baring? i have the same problem with something rattle clacking sound. specially over bumps. it comes and go. i bought a 2014 gts 125 3v i.e recently. herd the weird sound and took it to a vespa specialist but they said they couldn't find anything. this is in vietnam by the way. certify specialist over here sucks bad!

^^GTS99999999

What you're experiencing in your very new scoot may be just standard GTS roller rattle. These things have a really noisy cvt compartment. Noisier than any other scoot I've owned.

If you're unsure, upload a video of it making the noise. Some of the tech-savvy people here do a pretty good job identifying sounds from a video.

the sound comes and goes. but if it get any worst. i will upload a video. good looking out! thanks,