Modern Vespa

Changed the subject since the discussion got out of hand and now talks more about the stylish and non stylish scooter wear.

When I saw the title to this thread I thought it was a heavy duty use MacBook Pro, sort of like the Panasonic Tough Book laptop PC.

Personally, having put my hands on an Armadillo jacket and looked at the materials, I would say this:

A heavy coat from Old Navy would offer the same level abrasion protection.

None.

When I saw the title, I thought it was about something like chili mac... you know... macaroni and cheese with armadillo meat.

Gues we will never know about their d3 protections untill someone crashes with it.
The question is do the Mac rain coat they offer hold up in wind and rainy conditions.

My alternatives is to keep riding in my M65 fishtail or get something sleeker with some protection.

I personally own 3 jackets. My favorite and the one that gets the most use is my < 75 degrees jacket. I have hit the ground wearing this jacket and can attest to it's ability to take a beating, it is a 6th Gear Track jacket. Leather, and CE armor.

http://six-gear.com/apparel2/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=19&products_id=17

In addition to the that, I have a Corazzo Shop Jacket and a a Shift mesh jacket. The Shift was cheap, and I have no faith that it would hold up in an abrasion situation. It would fair OK impact, but the abrasion away from the armor pockets would be poor.

And that is the real issue for gear IMO. It has to protect from both. Impact without abrasion will only happen at a stop or very low speed spill. Otherwise, the worst road rash will come from the abrasion, not the impact. Look at the injuries on folks that crash. It's elbows, but also forearms that don't have armor protecting them. Never discount the value of abrasion protection, and in some ways good abrasion protection is MORE important than the impact protection. At 45 mph, if you go down in a lowside (most common), you only have to absorb an impact once or maybe twice, but you do have to absorb a good bit of abrasion as you slide to a stop. Roadrash generally doesn't come from the initial impact but the abrasion of the slide.

There is a good reason the racers where full leathers, and frequently walk away from lowsides at 100+ mph.

check out this thread: UPDATE - Warning on Armadillo Scooter Wear

about three posts down, you'll find a copy of a quote from another thread, outlining some of the problems with the 3do armour. that was about a year ago now, so i'm not sure if armadillo has upped their game - i know they've come up with some funky designs but i'm not sure if the quality of the armour has improved at all.

Point is, my dealer dumped Armadillo after customers complained about the quality and protection.

Don't buy it, it is expensive and not even that good at what it purports to do.

You can see how one holds up compared to the Corazzos in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVLosv46vrA

This is not a scientific test and it was conducted by Corazzo, but you definitely get the idea.

I'm still conflicted on the d30 armor, too. Have read both good and bad about it, but not enough firsthand crash reports.

If given an Armadillo with $10 in the pocket - for free - I'd say it was still a bad deal. No thanks.

Ewe, armadillo meat. Is that even editable?

To bad then. No other brand makes any stylish jacket.
Corazzo is the worst. The complete opposite to a Vespa, dislike the finnish and designs.

The tucano ones miss on the details. But uggly buttons, seems and such.

Armadillo is the only scooter jacket you can walk into a important client meeting not looking like a bad taste biker.

Then again cost Vs protection is low according to your judges.

Gues we'll have to wait for next brand to take it from here. Until then it's Fishtail Parka M65, M51 and M48 that counts.

I guess you've just upset a lot of people with that comment. In my opinion the Corazzo 5.0 is the only stylish urban scooter jacket. Nothing to do with Italy either.

FWIW, Corazzo previewed a much more stylish men's 3/4 length coat at Amerivespa. Very sleek, lots of interesting features, didn't look like gear. I'm really hoping it's in production and available soon!

Yes, sorry for that, taste is something very personal and everyone has and is entitled to their opinion. Will definitely look into that.

If you like parkas, Tucano make a good version in breathable fabric with a removable liner. Better than the armadillo one for sure.

Look at those pockets! Look at those buttons! You cannot wear this!
This is what I meant on my judge upon Tucano. They are close, very close but fall before the finishing line!

Except for the pockets it's a nice jacket.
The Tucano Montgomery looks quite good to if your into that style.

I think you mean the Tucano Montgomery.

Yes, my bad.

Need to rephrase this.
I do always ride with back protection, an expensive one.
I do only ride with well known brand full face helmet.
I do wear protective gloves.

I do ride Vespa daily around town but never reach highways and rarely pass to speeds above 70mk/h.

I have a job were I always need to appear well dressed.

What most riding gear manufactures miss out is attention to the detail.
The ones that do get that, like armadillo miss the sense of quality on the detail. Equally important.

if a jacket is stylish or not is solely based on the details of the design, the materials used and the thought through implementation of the aforementioned parts.

The Tucano above miss out on detail on pockets, buttons, line of sew on pockets and bottom of jacket, the length, the way the garment stretches and pulls together.

The corazzo goes to a different type of buyer. Their jackets are not correct choice in my line of work. They concentrate more on the street smart style and feels more casual wear.

I just order this jacket, in this color, I hope that I've made a good choice, because I was between the Dainese Zurigo, Armadillo and this one from Tucano.

Man ... You are a bigger clothing nerd than I am.

I wear hand-made suits every day (well most days) for work. Yet I still wear a Corazzo, I like its casual, street smart feel. I can wear my Corazzo like any other jacket I own and step off my scooter and walk away (without looking like I just stepped off of a bike) which is what scooters were designed for and what us riders are looking for yes?
In terms of quality, finish and attention to detail I sent an email to Corazzo recently commending their products.

The Tucano range isn't for me but I can see what they are trying to achieve with the brand, it is a very fine line between form and function and Tucano are right on the line. So I can see the temptation.

Armadillo is nice to look at but the quality of the armor is just not good enough. I recently went to a shop to try a parka on and the armor seemed lightweight and flimsy in comparison to the Corazzo. That coupled with the poor PR they have received online has convinced me that this product is not quite the finished article yet.

And you are able to fit a suite underneath a corazzo?
It's all down to taste. That kind of jackets and finish just isn't "it".
A parka, a mac or a mont is far more stylish in that terms. Although they have to be well designed. God knows there are 100s of ugly parkas out there.

I do choose my clothing with out most detail. I do like the Shop Jacket from corazzo but they missed big time when they put their logo on the arm-sleeve. Of course that silver line on the back is a big no-no.

Tucanno misses something all the time. They always feel nice with a big "but". There is something there that does not sit well.

Armadillo almost makes it style wise. They are not perfect by far but the ones that does it the best. The rest have miles and miles to travel.
Their lack of quality and protection is a big turnoff though. If you ask for that kind of high price then you better be up there with the best.

To flunk out 200 pounds and not feel safe is a bad combo, very bad.

have you tried looking at belstaff and dainese stuff? very very stylish and well made. very costly too, unfortunately.

I guess this all comes down to what style you are looking for. Do you have an example of ?

After typing that and the fact you wear tailored suits daily, can you buy armor and have your tailor build you a riding top coat out of of one in the style you like and have him add the reinforcement where needed? Maybe buy up two sizes and have him add the armor? Or just start with function and figure the design you like?

Most of you won't find it stylish, but here is an example of protective clothing

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=507934

Having a coat custom made would almost be easier than adapting one.

It's pretty difficult to add armor to an oversized coat in any way that would be valuable in an actual crash. I've considered doing this with a Belstaff I have (favorite coat but no armor) and with a Spiewak parka. The sizing on the Belstaff is right on so there's no room for armor. The Spiewak is big so there's nothing to keep the armor (especially elbows) in place. The armor really needs to be designed into the jacket or there would have to be a lot of tailoring and adding of straps, sleeve length and so on.

I have the Armadillo Parka and Corazzo 5.0 I transferred the Armor from Corazzo to Armadillo until it warms up again. Corazzo sell just the armor on their website also

I was thinking a tailor could deconstruct the oversized jacket and use the extra materials and space to add armor. Off road armor can be purchased as a suit to be worn under garments.

Any protection is better than none imo.
I have a few jackets with various types of armour and do quite like my Armadillo (i'm not gonna diss it until i have a bad experience with it).

I have an Armadillo City Rider (bought from ebay for £50.00).
I also have the black Armadillo parka (also £50.00 but minus armour).
Just bought a Lewis camo jacket with proper armour from the BMF for £37.00.
Then there's the old faithful Frank Thomas cordura jacket i've had for years.

You can always buy armour as a fishnet sweatshirt to go underneath regular clothing but then you miss out on the tough material when you go sliding down the road. So back at Armadillo again.

Belstaff had some good ones. I didn't see anywhere if they were armoured, are they?

Motorsport probably kicks as as protection. But then again we ride scooters ah max 50mph in town.
If they could hire me as a style judge then they can make a armoured M65 fishtail copy or a Mac-jackets.

Guess some protection is better than none and if you buy an Armadillo then you have tones of information here on what works and what doesn't.

On the earlier posts. I would like an official CE test of these scooter jackets. To have Corazzo test the competitors is not what I cal fair play.
It sounds more as marketing strategy. Tell me of your experiences with the parka?

I haven't used it yet mate as it came without armour and so i've been using the lighter City Rider throughout the summer.
When it gets colder i will swap the armour over and give it a go.

I did use the City Rider for a full weekend in Belgium back in April and it was warm enough for me.

agreed. Corazzo's intentions may well prove to be sound and above board, nevertheless, prospective buyers need an independent test of Armadillo clothing.

It doesn't look good when people keep referencing the negative reports of a direct competitor.

For clarity d3o, which is the protective element in Armadillo jackets, is CE certified. So I believe that it protects in the manner claimed, no problem.

The complaint about Armadillo should be more targetted at the fit of what they make. Bluntly the protection moves around too much to provide protection for elbows and knees. My dealer dropped their stuff because of this. People had accidents and the armour did its stuff but in the wrong place!

If the jackets fitted better, they would have an better product.

Incidentally, d3o is successfully used in other motorcycle brands, for ski gear, and motorcross. I think it is a good product. Armadillo just don't do a good enough job of using it in their clothing.

Damn

this has been my experience with the Armadillo stuff. I had a pair of their overpants and the hip armour, though well placed, would have torn away immediatly in a crash - it was held in place by a thin layer of nylon. the knee armour was pretty much useless, as it was placed far too high up the leg, held in place by a flimsy internal pocket, and not shaped to fit the knee at all - it was like a cardboard rectangle flapping about on the top of my thigh, and would have been a complete waste of time in a crash.

i bought the overtrousers about two years ago, so their construction may be sturdier in the newer stuff, but i'd still advise anyone thinking of buying an armadillo product to look carefully at the way it's put together.

i've one off in my corazzo jacket, at about 15mph, landed on my elbow. no bruising at all, and not a mark on the jacket.

I agree the armour could be held in place better but......an Armadillo jacket with armour is still better than any not purpose made jacket without armour.
Like piss pot helmets this all comes down to personal choice.

I quite often wear Draggin Jeans (mine have no armour) because of the Kevlar lining.......helps against friction burns but won't save me from a break.

That is really is a common problem with all armored gear, and depends more on body shape than on shoddy construction in my opinion. All it takes is a couple inches difference in one's thigh to lower leg ratio, or arm length, etc, and the armor is out of place. It is practically impossible to make gear that fits everyone perfectly. And that problem is compounded for more loose-fitting garments, either for style or to be worn over something else, for instance to commute to work, or worn by people who don't have the money to buy a whole series of season- and weather-specific jackets and pants.

Basically, you have to look for the best fit and compromise. I have never seen an Armadillo jacket in person, but even by that video, sure they ripped more than the Corazzos, but seemed to offer probably adequate abrasion protection to the average city user who is Armadillo's likely target customer and rarely goes over 40 mph. After all, over 50% of all motorcycle accidents occur at less than 30mph, and that is likely a vast overestimate, since the slower an accident's speed, the less likely it is to be reported. The statistics for scooters must be even more slanted.

Now, would I routinely use one of those Armadillo jackets to go at 70mph on the highway? Obviously not, but then I would not feel safe in my Corazzo 5.0 for that purpose either. The safest gear to travel at highway speeds is clearly the kind of stuff that race riders wear - thick, tight leather suits with extra armor. And I doubt anyone would want to ride a scooter in that stuff.

I agree that Armadillo is okay for pootling in town.

Tucano Urbano is for that too, though they used to make leathers (and good ones at that) for higher speeds.

Bering do some black style parkas, and those are properly protective. Better than either Armadillo or Tucano.

I walk into meetings all of time with my Tucano Urbis...much more tailored than any parka-style. It looks great over a shirt and tie. Mine's black - but I think the beige or brown ones' look especially "un-biker" like. In fact I wish I had gotten the brown one now that i think about it.

It is very functional, warm, dry, too warm in fact when the vest is zipped in. The only bad thing is the back pad is non-CE...that can easily be switched out.

If I understand CE ratings, the pad is rated independant of the garment. So, the jackets job is the hold the pad in the correct place during an off and provide abrasion protection. What the corazzo video shows is seams failing and the fabric showing abrasion damage. I am not convinced that you will achieve a good amount of protection from any "loose" fitting garment as the pads will tend to move too much.