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@luthorhuss avatar
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R.I.P. ----K.I.T.T.500, Agent Orange (400)
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@luthorhuss avatar
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UTC quote
So I had a long weekend this last week. Old as dirt was very generous and offered to help me with my bag of mods that I wanted to get done while my poor bike is sitting garaged. I also have to give a big thanks to Bravo Two Four who has been my own personal electrical consultant on call .

So here's the mods I got done this weekend:

-Installed Dr. Pulley 15gram weights on the variator
-Installed Dr. Pulley shoes on the variator(the little horshoe bits)
-Installed an extra washer on the variator as per the "Fuzzy" mod
-Removed that pos evap canister
-installed a Blue Sea marine 6 hub fuse block
-installed a marine grade weatherproof 12v outlet on the dash(wired to fuse block)
-wired my heated grips and switch directly to fuse block
-installed a Stebel horn(wired thru fuse block)
-installed a Motiontek million color underlighting kit

That's all I could get done over the couple of days. The hardest part was probably the initial fuse block wiring, but only because I was lazy and didn't want to pull off all the panels, so I had to feed it through with a clothes hanger.

The mechanical bits are an amazing improvement. The bike runs smooth, takes off like a lil 125cc and even has stopped all sputtering when slowing or taking off...it runs like a brand new bike, which is pretty good considering I've ridden it 16k miles and its a daily commuter(when not cold).

I didn't post pics of the variator or horn mods because to be honest, they're exactly like many other tutorials on here.

The light kit is great, but was way more time consuming to install than the manufacturer listed(30 mins lol). I like it, and I know that blue, red, green and some other colors aren't "legal" in many states, but I don't plan on flipping this thing on while riding. It's not about visibility, it's about parking and having fun at rallies, etc and the occasional cruise through a parking lot(in which case purple works for me). The red is really great in person, but the blue photographs better . The kit has a ton of options like flash, strobe, pulse, etc on and on...and will auto change colors to music beats, etc. Best part, the whole thing with two add ons(which is why I have so many lights), cost me under $100 on ebay. Fun stuff.

The fuse block was recommended by Bravo Two Four and I also used Ancor marine grade tinned copper wires. I color coded and labeled everything(the fuse block comes with labels). The Blue Sea box is a bit more($42) but was worth every penny...once it was in, the other peripherals were a snap and I still have plenty of room for future ones. I especially like the fact that it carries two spare fuses in case of road issues too. You'll notice that my "innovative" bracket is an old torn mudflap off my 500. Who says you can't ride the tires off these? It worked great. It is VERY stiff despite being a mudflap and had a ton of little brass fitted holes that could take any tie straps no matter how taut. I figured if this thing could handle the open road, then some electronics wouldn't be a challenge to it. It fit perfectly in the little groove and holds the box at a good angle for seeing the work.

Now, the one thing you can't see in the pic is that when I got done with all the electrical, i had an extra light from the kit, so I mounted it inside pointing up so when you take the front cover off, you actually have a little science experiment look with a brain in the middle. In other words, it's like lighting up the engine under the hood of a car...it's just a detail that was coold and honestly, I had no other good spot for the light.

Feel free to ask questions...I certainly would love to share some of the 'mistakes' I made while doing these. Again BIG THANKS TO BRAVO TWO FOUR AND OAD... this is the reason I joined this forum .
Blue Sea 6 hub fuse block
Blue Sea 6 hub fuse block
Homemade bracket for block :D.
Homemade bracket for block :D.
Fuse block in...you can see relay in upper left.
Fuse block in...you can see relay in upper left.
Green is horn, blue is grips, yellow is 12V
Green is horn, blue is grips, yellow is 12V
labels came with fuse block
labels came with fuse block
I purposefully positioned lights where I wanted them...the blue is eye catching imho
I purposefully positioned lights where I wanted them...the blue is eye catching imho
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
sorry for the bad pic...was finishing up at 2am
sorry for the bad pic...was finishing up at 2am
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
The red looks SOOO much better in person and with a lil less light...
The red looks SOOO much better in person and with a lil less light...
Marine weatherproof 12V closed
Marine weatherproof 12V closed
and open
and open
And of course...thanks to my wiring helper...who ensured that all bits were equally scattered everywhere :D
And of course...thanks to my wiring helper...who ensured that all bits were equally scattered everywhere :D
UTC

Enthusiast
2009 MP3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 53
Location: Columbia TN
 
Enthusiast
2009 MP3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 53
Location: Columbia TN
UTC quote
Very cool and detailed. Nice job. Now when can I drop mine off and let you do some of this to mine? LOL.
@bubbajon avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
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@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
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UTC quote
Great job Shawn - awesome fusebox and mount. Seriously - I might have to move mine having seen yours. Only bad thing and I fear it really will be bad is the outlet location. Exactly where mine is but opposite side. The suspension can go that high and does so on a regular basis (the way I ride anyway). The guaranteed way to do it on mine is to take a hard fast left up a steep incline that causes the suspension to travel all the way up on the hard lean. Bang - shoves that outlet up about 1/2 inch. One of our Brit forum members pointed out that a mere 2" up from there works perfectly - mostly because the outlet is angled in not down. Oh well - hope it works for ya there buddy...
Just as an FYI go back to my post on installing the Stebel and see how I mounted it. I honestly feel its the best location and method on the 500 - never comes loose, horn is directed out so you get full benefit and it doesn't interfere with anything.
Regards,
Jon
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UTC quote
BubbaJon wrote:
Great job Shawn - awesome fusebox and mount. Seriously - I might have to move mine having seen yours. Only bad thing and I fear it really will be bad is the outlet location. Exactly where mine is but opposite side. The suspension can go that high and does so on a regular basis (the way I ride anyway). The guaranteed way to do it on mine is to take a hard fast left up a steep incline that causes the suspension to travel all the way up on the hard lean. Bang - shoves that outlet up about 1/2 inch. One of our Brit forum members pointed out that a mere 2" up from there works perfectly - mostly because the outlet is angled in not down. Oh well - hope it works for ya there buddy...
Just as an FYI go back to my post on installing the Stebel and see how I mounted it. I honestly feel its the best location and method on the 500 - never comes loose, horn is directed out so you get full benefit and it doesn't interfere with anything.
Regards,
Jon
Will do, but i'm pretty sure I'm okay. When I put it in(before gluing/screwing), I undid the lock and leaned it out/in pretty far. This is one reason why i moved the Stebel to the opposite side of the outlet. If it does pop it up, it'll be a snap to move because I still have a ton of much more shallow switches that need to be installed...radar detector, satellite radio...etc.
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@luthorhuss avatar
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R.I.P. ----K.I.T.T.500, Agent Orange (400)
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UTC quote
Robbc123 wrote:
Very cool and detailed. Nice job. Now when can I drop mine off and let you do some of this to mine? LOL.
Thanks! You can drop yours off anytime, just leave the master key, title, and a check for $500...okay since you're from TN, make it $400
@bubbajon avatar
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RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
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UTC quote
luthorhuss wrote:
Will do, but i'm pretty sure I'm okay. When I put it in(before gluing/screwing), I undid the lock and leaned it out/in pretty far.
LOL - I did too - it ain't the lean - it's the bump while leaning.
@bravotwofour avatar
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'09 Mp3-500 - Gone Now
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UTC quote
Nicly done! Love that fuse block mounting, innovative and functional while making use of otherwise unneeded bits, and well secured too. Good location for it as well. Odd that when I look at that pic of the arrangement under the t'ware "hood" on your scoot I don't quite seem to see the same structural components as I have on mine, at least as I recall... weird. Will have to look more closely next time home, but I can tell that without the windscreen mounting like I have there is additional room up near the relays and you made use of that. the Blue Sea fuseblock is a great choice, and one with the ground bus makes wiring a bunch easier, eh?

The underside lighting looks awesome, well distributed and has to be fabulous looking when dark out. How long did it take you to go through the entire million colors?? Razz emoticon

When I saw the pic of where you positioned the 12v receptacle I had the exact same thought as bubbajon... sure hope that works out for ya!

Cheers!
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@luthorhuss avatar
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R.I.P. ----K.I.T.T.500, Agent Orange (400)
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UTC quote
BravoTwoFour wrote:
Nicly done! Love that fuse block mounting, innovative and functional while making use of otherwise unneeded bits, and well secured too. Good location for it as well. Odd that when I look at that pic of the arrangement under the t'ware "hood" on your scoot I don't quite seem to see the same structural components as I have on mine, at least as I recall... weird. Will have to look more closely next time home, but I can tell that without the windscreen mounting like I have there is additional room up near the relays and you made use of that. the Blue Sea fuseblock is a great choice, and one with the ground bus makes wiring a bunch easier, eh?

The underside lighting looks awesome, well distributed and has to be fabulous looking when dark out. How long did it take you to go through the entire million colors?? Razz emoticon

When I saw the pic of where you positioned the 12v receptacle I had the exact same thought as bubbajon... sure hope that works out for ya!

Cheers!
Thanks, Bravo. I do have the Givi bracket going across so maybe that's what you're seeing. Yeah, the fuseblock was worth every penny...I am really excited about how easy it's gonna be to mount the rest...but that will all have to come as I get more weekends free.

I'm not too worried about the 12v...maybe it's just the pics that are misleading, but it is really far away from the suspension. One thing to consider is that while it might seem in the same position, don't forget that it has a thick lip it's sitting on so it's a little higher than normal. I really didn't have a choice as where to put it, it's perfectly hiding the horrible hole caused by my first failed attempt at the hot grips. OAD was amazed at the way it perfectly covered it...you can't even tell there was a previous install below it. If I do have to move it, it won't be hard, simple pop out, move and rescrew/glue. I have a smaller series of waterproof rocker switches which I plan on putting here anyway should the need arise. I'll let you guys know...I should be out riding it sometime this weekend or next week.
@old_as_dirt avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 GTS
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Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
 
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@old_as_dirt avatar
2007 GTS
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Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
UTC quote
luthorhuss wrote:
Robbc123 wrote:
Very cool and detailed. Nice job. Now when can I drop mine off and let you do some of this to mine? LOL.
Thanks! You can drop yours off anytime, just leave the master key, title, and a check for $500...okay since you're from TN, make it $400
and 2 quarts of good shine
@old_as_dirt avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 GTS
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Posts: 22533
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
 
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@old_as_dirt avatar
2007 GTS
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Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
UTC quote
luthorhuss wrote:
BravoTwoFour wrote:
Nicly done! Love that fuse block mounting, innovative and functional while making use of otherwise unneeded bits, and well secured too. Good location for it as well. Odd that when I look at that pic of the arrangement under the t'ware "hood" on your scoot I don't quite seem to see the same structural components as I have on mine, at least as I recall... weird. Will have to look more closely next time home, but I can tell that without the windscreen mounting like I have there is additional room up near the relays and you made use of that. the Blue Sea fuseblock is a great choice, and one with the ground bus makes wiring a bunch easier, eh?

The underside lighting looks awesome, well distributed and has to be fabulous looking when dark out. How long did it take you to go through the entire million colors?? Razz emoticon

When I saw the pic of where you positioned the 12v receptacle I had the exact same thought as bubbajon... sure hope that works out for ya!

Cheers!
Thanks, Bravo. I do have the Givi bracket going across so maybe that's what you're seeing. Yeah, the fuseblock was worth every penny...I am really excited about how easy it's gonna be to mount the rest...but that will all have to come as I get more weekends free.

I'm not too worried about the 12v...maybe it's just the pics that are misleading, but it is really far away from the suspension. One thing to consider is that while it might seem in the same position, don't forget that it has a thick lip it's sitting on so it's a little higher than normal. I really didn't have a choice as where to put it, it's perfectly hiding the horrible hole caused by my first failed attempt at the hot grips. OAD was amazed at the way it perfectly covered it...you can't even tell there was a previous install below it. If I do have to move it, it won't be hard, simple pop out, move and rescrew/glue. I have a smaller series of waterproof rocker switches which I plan on putting here anyway should the need arise. I'll let you guys know...I should be out riding it sometime this weekend or next week.
I was most amazed by the dr pullys and fuzzy washer
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Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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UTC quote
Where did you find the external 12 volt socket? It looks like a good choice since it will seat solidly!
@old_as_dirt avatar
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2007 GTS
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UTC quote
mvtroiano wrote:
Where did you find the external 12 volt socket? It looks like a good choice since it will seat solidly!
it a marine grade one. I think he got it at a boat dealer in knoxville. you should be able to get it at any boat dealer in one of there accessory cataloges or online
@kevink avatar
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MP3 500 (no - longer); 2008 Victory Vision (gone), 2012 Goldwing (gone), 2019 Wee-Strom (gone), 2024 Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro
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UTC quote
Man I wish I had known you were doing the mods that weekend, I would have loved to watch the work in progress. The wiring and some of the mods are what I have to do as well.

The Blue Sea fuse block is an interesting idea. I am thinking about mounting the fuse block in a different location (haven't settled on where yet) to make it more accessible for future mods so I don't have to remove all the front tupperware to get to it. However, the location does make it easier to route the wiring.

What gauge wiring did you use for the horn and grips? What grips did you put in? Did you replace the grips you got from Cyclegear? I am leaning to buy the Hot Grips right now.

Are you still planning on putting in an additional battery where the evap canister was located for heated gear?
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Hooked
MP3 400 i.e.
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Location: London
 
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UTC quote
The Dr Pulley weights and the 'Fuzzy Washer' seem to work for everyone. We must be accruing quite a bit of experience with this simple mod now, and quite a few miles. I wonder if anyone has experienced any problems at all?
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kevink wrote:
Man I wish I had known you were doing the mods that weekend, I would have loved to watch the work in progress. The wiring and some of the mods are what I have to do as well.

The Blue Sea fuse block is an interesting idea. I am thinking about mounting the fuse block in a different location (haven't settled on where yet) to make it more accessible for future mods so I don't have to remove all the front tupperware to get to it. However, the location does make it easier to route the wiring.

What gauge wiring did you use for the horn and grips? What grips did you put in? Did you replace the grips you got from Cyclegear? I am leaning to buy the Hot Grips right now.

Are you still planning on putting in an additional battery where the evap canister was located for heated gear?
Hey Kevin, sorry I didn't call...you definitely woulda been welcome. The only part that might have deterred you is that I was leaving work at 5pm most days, getting home, and working into the early hours every day before being back at work at 8:30! Eeek...thus the title.

I put it here because I knew there was a lot of space and to be honest, it's very easy to get to, having taking off the front so often. The only thing that comes off is the spoiler, the piece below the headlights and then the front center piece. It sounds like a lot, but all 3 of these pieces fit really well. I would caution anyone thinking about mounting one anywhere else because here's the problems:

underseat: great room, but then you have to wire all your peripherals all the way through the length of the bike to reach the fusebox

inside leg wall(in wheel well area): The side panels are "easy" to get off, but the more you take them off, the more the tabs break...eventually all of them will be gone. I now try and remove the side panels as rarely as possible. And then you have to worry about the suspension hitting and also debris coming off the road.

Can't think of anywhere else that the fuseblock I got could fit. Here it's protected from the elements(but it's marine grade anyways) and also gets a lil breeze from the grill located above it.

I used 10gauge wire as my feeder line from my battery to my fuse box. So this wire is thick, which made feeding it a bit harder, but it is solid as a rock and also this thickness made it very easy to connect to the fuseblock and to splice/tap into, etc. I used 14gauge for everything else. I could have adjusted it for specific peripherals, but time was an issue since I had to get done in the garage while my folks were on vacation. The biggest benefit and reason I did the mod for the block was because in the future, for adding other items, I'll simply get the item and will only need a couple of feet at most of a ground/positive in the appropriate size wire. I still have a bunch of 14g wire left and I'll probably just use that, but who knows. I bought my stuff from West Marine boat shop and they sale the Ancor wire by the foot so that I could just get the gauge I need and spend less than $5 or all of it. No need to buy a huge amount to reach the battery anymore.

The grips are just my old ones with the controller thrown out/stomped on because it was horrible. They now produce a little bit more heat but are still crappy. I have them on the little blue rocker switch you see on the dash. After about 10 minutes it's the equivalent of a hot hands in your palms. The main reasons I wired them were because it alleviated loose wiring just hanging underneath and also when I switch to other grips, I will just solder/butt splice the old wiring to the new instead of rewiring the full deal to the fuse block. It's a placeholder.

At the moment, Bravo has convinced me that I don't need the extra battery, but we'll see. I am considering going with a wiring scheme that they make that connects a second battery to your main. When you're riding, both are charging and then when you use your peripherals, the second battery acts like a backup to your main. Then when you aren't, they both start charging again. Again, the beauty of the fuseblock is that I now have just one simple big wire going to my battery, so if I want to rewire everything to a second, I could just move the wire one foot back to the backup.

I have a lot more mods planned, some that are very time consuming. I would say that 90% of them will get done this summe when I don't have classes and will not be working on weekends. Gimme a shout when you start any of yours if you want me to help. My soldering skills have gotten very good, thanks to OAD and Bravo.
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UTC quote
A few general comments after reviewing the couple recent posts...

Marine grade components are a good choice for scooters out in the weather and Blue Sea Systems makes good components. The fuse blocks are bulky but robust and can be had in a number of circuit variations, with or without the negative bus portion. They are not watertight or weatherproof but very resistant to corrosion. Marinco makes the 12V receptacle and amatching plug. Suggest you use marine grade wiring as well, tinned copper fine stranding makes wiring easier and its very resistant to corrosion as well. You can google these up easily. And the electronics vendors like Newark, Mouser and Allied have tons of useful switches, indicators, breakers and whatnot ready for the DIYer. And don't forget McMaster-Carr for hardware and everything else!

With good planning and getting adequate time you can plan wiring adds and mods as required so conductors are sized as needed and color coded too, if desired. luthorhuss executed his plan well and the results speak for themselves!

FWIW, I did not use a Blue Sea fuse block but opted for the cheapo Napa six circuit block - this worked well for me.
@g03 avatar
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Molto Verboso
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@g03 avatar
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Gratz on all the mods! I rather put the fuse block under the seat for ez of access. Wish this scoot just had a little more spare room for mounting stuff and running wires. Mine just has three inline fused wires as feeders, but then the bulk of wires as you stated still exist. Gratz again!
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@luthorhuss avatar
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G03 wrote:
Gratz on all the mods! I rather put the fuse block under the seat for ez of access. Wish this scoot just had a little more spare room for mounting stuff and running wires. Mine just has three inline fused wires as feeders, but then the bulk of wires as you stated still exist. Gratz again!
Like I said, the only problem with putting the fuse block under the seat is then, let's say you want a gps mount, an external speedo mount, and a stebel horn. You then have to run 6 wires(positive and negatives) through the hardest part of the bike and into your underseat housing somehow. That's if you have the neg. bus fusebox. Even if you opted to ground to the front frame, you still have to run 3 positive wires through the leg guard and into the underseat. Plus, everytime you want a new peripheral...here ya go again...all the way through the bike to the underseat.

Trust me, I don't know what other ppl are seeing, but I could fit a small baby in the space in front of my headlight relays up front. Now, if I want to add something like say, a voltmeter up front, I simply mount it in the dash, and two short wires go straight to my fuse box. I never even have to open the battery compartment or even look at it. Done in under 30 mins tops.

Thanks, G03...it was a blast. The funny thing about mods like this is that you learn more while doing them than anything else. Trust me, I'm NOOOO ELECTRICIAN. My expertise is fab work/body work. Bravo was very helpful but he'll tell you had to hold my hand...When I started this project I didn't even understand what a relay was! Like he said, do a bit of research, use his excellent tutorial on here and mine and others, and ask ask ask....I'll be glad to answer anything I can. I think my understanding on the wiring has increased 500%.
@bubbajon avatar
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RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
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@bubbajon avatar
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UTC quote
luthorhuss wrote:
...I am considering going with a wiring scheme that they make that connects a second battery to your main. When you're riding, both are charging and then when you use your peripherals, the second battery acts like a backup to your main
What you're describing is an auxiliary battery which is used for no other purpose than to run accessories. There are plenty of wiring diagrams for this setup. The goal is to allow the charging system to charge the battery but not allow the auxiliary equipment to draw from the main battery. Usually involves a rectifier or two.
I mounted my fuse block in the left wheel well. I don't have to take off the panel to wire to it and it's easy to check for a blown fuse as I use the fuses with indicator lights - only happened one time when the suspension shoved my 12V socket out and shorted it. Now I have a rubber cap over the end until I can find a plastic plug for the old hole and relocate it up a tad.
Socket is really only used for the GPS - now that I have pretty much settled on TomTom I need to just wire it in. I just really hate the way TomTom provides power - Garmin really has the best setup for that - but the ball mount sucks. *sigh* can't win i tells ya.... If I ever get heat for my mitts it'll be the gloves themselves - trying to heat the grips makes no sense to me - I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
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Molto Verboso
Piaggio MP3 500
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Piaggio MP3 500
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Location: North Georgia
UTC quote
Your outlet is in the same location as mine. Shannon is kind of persnickety about placing things, and he leaned it over and bounced on it (bout gave me a heart attack. a) I don't want my pinstripes scratched if he dropped it & b) I'd have to kill him if he drops it and gets oil/gas/grease all over the den floor (I'll let him work on the bikes inside on the concrete den floor, but I have my limits) What we are both more worried about bumping is the horn. The bit the sound comes out of is well within the range that if it is at maximum lean and bounces could hit, but the bit that hits isn't crucial. I like where you mounted your fuse block. Your lights look really awesome too. I know you are going for the KITT look, but I still think the red light in the front chasing from left to right and back would make a killer Cylon bike Laughing emoticon
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luthorhuss
Looks great. BTW Where did you mount your horn?
Thanks in advance

Ride On
Mike F
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Nice wiring! I'd like to know where you put the Stebel too, as I'm not satisfied with my location. I have the same power outlet, found it at West Marine.
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Mike F wrote:
luthorhuss
Looks great. BTW Where did you mount your horn?
Thanks in advance

Ride On
Mike F
Hey Mike and Ramblerdan, I didn't take pics, but I'll try and show on this diagram. I know others have used brackets and what not, but I got heavy duty thick tie straps and went to town. Seriously. I would put a couple on and then try and wiggle it hard in every direction. If it budged, I would fix it. The thing is on like iron now and moves with the frame. Hope this pic makes sense. It's not just tie strapped to the one bar either, but several of the frame tubes up near the headlights.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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BubbaJon wrote:
- Garmin really has the best setup for that - but the ball mount sucks. *sigh* can't win i tells ya.... If I ever get heat for my mitts it'll be the gloves themselves - trying to heat the grips makes no sense to me - I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
I agree on the grips. I'm still debating if they will be replaced by new grips or something else. There's a very good chance heated gloves will be on the way to me.

As for the gps mount, don't know how big a rush you're in, but in about a month or two you should see something 'interesting' from me on that topic...
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BubbaJon wrote:
I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
Wrongo wrongo.... I ain't sure about how well you "know the electricals" but having successfully installed 4 sets of Hot Grips methinks yer missing something somewhere. I can tell you this, I can't run mine at full temp for long as it gets uncomfortable. Maybe you're riding in sub-zero temps and that explains it? Wha? emoticon Why don't you put in a call to the folks at Hot Grips and ask them for their input, they're in Texas too.

LL75 Razz emoticon
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UTC quote
larrylarry75 wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
Wrongo wrongo.... I ain't sure about how well you "know the electricals" but having successfully installed 4 sets of Hot Grips methinks yer missing something somewhere. I can tell you this, I can't run mine at full temp for long as it gets uncomfortable. Maybe you're riding in sub-zero temps and that explains it? Wha? emoticon Why don't you put in a call to the folks at Hot Grips and ask them for their input, they're in Texas too.

LL75 Razz emoticon
Mine work very well indeed in sub-zero temps. That's in conjunction with muffs mind, I can't see the point in using one without the other.
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jimc wrote:
larrylarry75 wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
Wrongo wrongo.... I ain't sure about how well you "know the electricals" but having successfully installed 4 sets of Hot Grips methinks yer missing something somewhere. I can tell you this, I can't run mine at full temp for long as it gets uncomfortable. Maybe you're riding in sub-zero temps and that explains it? Wha? emoticon Why don't you put in a call to the folks at Hot Grips and ask them for their input, they're in Texas too.

LL75 Razz emoticon
Mine work very well indeed in sub-zero temps. That's in conjunction with muffs mind, I can't see the point in using one without the other.
My Oxford Hot Hands can only be left on for about two or three minutes and they approach too warm... then they are off for about fifteen minutes or so. The outside temp was about 35, riding speed near 60, and I have the Bagster muffs. I am pleased with the setup. An amprobe reading shows the hot hands at just over 1-1/2 amps when cold, 2 amps when heated, well within the 5 amp limit I put on them and the 4 amp fuse on the circuit.

I like the hot hands because they can be completely removed from the scoot in about five minutes, but I may opt for heated gloves in the future.
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larrylarry75 wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
Wrongo wrongo.... I ain't sure about how well you "know the electricals"
Ummm fair question - worked as an industrial/automation engineer for over a decade working on and with heat elements from itty bitty to big enough to cure a solid rocket booster. With and without controller circuitry. Given the design constraints of a typical handle - and the fact that there is a hollow heat sink it's wrapped around (handlebars). So looking at their web site it appears that a particularly beefy unit is rated at 3 amps. That's 36 watts at 100% efficiency - a better figure would be 60% but I'll be generous and call it around 30 watts. Near as I can tell that power consumption is for *both* grips so call it 15 watts each grip. That's about double a nightlight/ Christmas tree bulb wattage. Now - consider that the heat is radiated out in all directions - that means the inside of the handlebars are being heated same as the outside - so again power is half (as far as your gloved mitt is concerned). Not a whole bunch left over to make it through layers of rubber & gloves - 7 watts. The good news is that the handle and your gloved paw will hold some heat as they have mass so I can see some heat making it - but I still don't see it as being very efficient - and we were assuming wide open on the delivered heat. Bear in mind I haven't actually owned or know anyone who has one of these units - just if I was contemplating it for me this is how I would calculate how well it would work.
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BravoTwoFour wrote:
...I like the hot hands because they can be completely removed from the scoot in about five minutes, but I may opt for heated gloves in the future.
I'll have to look into those - removable being the key phrase there.
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UTC quote
larrylarry75 wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
Wrongo wrongo.... I ain't sure about how well you "know the electricals" but having successfully installed 4 sets of Hot Grips methinks yer missing something somewhere. I can tell you this, I can't run mine at full temp for long as it gets uncomfortable. Maybe you're riding in sub-zero temps and that explains it? Wha? emoticon Why don't you put in a call to the folks at Hot Grips and ask them for their input, they're in Texas too.

LL75 Razz emoticon
the problem Larry is everyone is installing the other heated grips not "hotgrips" brand.
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UTC quote
The key is the grips themselves are 'insulated' by the riders gloved hands. This ensures that just 25W each side is efficiently deliverd just where that power is needed.

They do work - very well.
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UTC quote
BubbaJon wrote:
BravoTwoFour wrote:
...I like the hot hands because they can be completely removed from the scoot in about five minutes, but I may opt for heated gloves in the future.
I'll have to look into those - removable being the key phrase there.
Photos of the hot hands and muffs I installed are here, along with a link to a review of the hot hands. For what I invested and what they are I like them fine; come warmer weather I remove the muffs and reinstall the Powermadd handguards, then eventually remove the hot hands as well. 'Easy peasy' I think I heard said elsewhere on this forum...
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jimc wrote:
The key is the grips themselves are 'insulated' by the riders gloved hands. This ensures that just 25W each side is efficiently deliverd just where that power is needed.

They do work - very well.
I'll likely go with heated gloves because I got "burned" by bad grips Razz emoticon .

And you guys are forgetting the best part of gloves...your hands can stay nice and toasty even when one is removed to flip off cagers or when you find yourself in a nice bar scuffle .

Honestly, I have heard great things about the Oxford and the Hot Grips. Fuzzy has the Oxford and swears by them and lord knows he road test stuff in all conditions.

My thinking is that it'll just be nice to have gloves that can go in a box where I live for 9 months out of the year marked "cold weather gear" and then not thought about amps or drain or wiring or connectors or anything...just pull out, plug in and wear when needed. I also like the thought of being able to just put back in the pkg and return should they not work like they're supposed to. My previous fiasco has proven to me that this isn't the case with INSTALLED, glued on heated grips that suck.
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jimc wrote:
The key is the grips themselves are 'insulated' by the riders gloved hands. This ensures that just 25W each side is efficiently deliverd just where that power is needed.

They do work - very well.
no. I felt luthorhusses this past weekend bare handed and after 4-5 min. they were barely luke warm. Fuzzys on the other hand were HOT when I felt them with bare hands. There are some junk stuff and good stuff. the hotgrips brand I have never heard of any not performing as advertised.
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luthorhuss wrote:
Hey Kevin, sorry I didn't call...you definitely woulda been welcome. The only part that might have deterred you is that I was leaving work at 5pm most days, getting home, and working into the early hours every day before being back at work at 8:30! Eeek...thus the title.
That would not have been a deterrent. It would have given me an excuse to leave work! Besides - I would have brought refreshments! Clown emoticon
BubbaJon wrote:
I mounted my fuse block in the left wheel well. I don't have to take off the panel to wire to it and it's easy to check for a blown fuse as I use the fuses with indicator lights
I saw you put it in that location in a earlier post, and that is what I am thinking of doing. My main reason is the same - if I blow a fuse I want to be able to get to it quickly.
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BubbaJon wrote:
Given the design constraints of a typical handle - and the fact that there is a hollow heat sink it's wrapped around (handlebars). ... Bear in mind I haven't actually owned or know anyone who has one of these units - just if I was contemplating it for me this is how I would calculate how well it would work.
The handlebar being a heat sink is true if you are thinking of grip heaters. Grip heaters are glued to the metal and do lose heat into the handle bar. More on the right side than the throttle because the throttle is a shell that doesn't absorb as much heat. However, the heated grips usually have an insulation on the inside of the grips to reduce the heat loss into the handlebar. That improves the efficiency dramatically.

The only time I have used heated grips is on a snowmobile, and it works wonders for comfort.

I agree with JimC - used in combination with muffs and your hands will be very comfortable.

edit: I meant more on the left side (not right) than the throttle side.
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UTC quote
BubbaJon wrote:
larrylarry75 wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
I understand the attraction but I also know the electricals well enough to doubt heated grips will ever be very effective...
Wrongo wrongo.... I ain't sure about how well you "know the electricals"
Bear in mind I haven't actually owned or know anyone who has one of these units - just if I was contemplating it for me this is how I would calculate how well it would work.
Bingo big guy....you know not of that which you speak. I wouldn't want to piss you or anyone else off but by your own admission your method of deduction is based not on experience with the product in question but rather on experiences with other devices which you feel are similar enough to make the call. I can tell you you're off base a little on this one but otoh I'm not that concerned whether you try these out or not, it's your money and your call. My thoughts and suggestions to you were based on real world experience with the actual products, not just guessing and I was trying to be of help. You can choose to consider that information in the spirit in which it was given or not, it's up to you.

LL75
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kevink wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
Given the design constraints of a typical handle - and the fact that there is a hollow heat sink it's wrapped around (handlebars). ... Bear in mind I haven't actually owned or know anyone who has one of these units - just if I was contemplating it for me this is how I would calculate how well it would work.
The handlebar being a heat sink is true if you are thinking of grip heaters. Grip heaters are glued to the metal and do lose heat into the handle bar. More on the right side than the throttle because the throttle is a shell that doesn't absorb as much heat. However, the heated grips usually have an insulation on the inside of the grips to reduce the heat loss into the handlebar. That improves the efficiency dramatically.

The only time I have used heated grips is on a snowmobile, and it works wonders for comfort.

I agree with JimC - used in combination with muffs and your hands will be very comfortable.

edit: I meant more on the left side (not right) than the throttle side.
I hear what your sayin Kevin but luthorhusses scoot was in an enclose garage and it was warm enough in there just having a shirt on - no jacket. the scoot was not cold at all. So the grips he has should have heated up within a couple of min to be hot enough for me to want not to grab them and his are wired direct to the batt just thru a on/off switch.
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old as dirt wrote:
I hear what your sayin Kevin but luthorhusses scoot was in an enclose garage and it was warm enough in there just having a shirt on - no jacket. the scoot was not cold at all. So the grips he has should have heated up within a couple of min to be hot enough for me to want not to grab them and his are wired direct to the batt just thru a on/off switch.
I'm not saying that all products are effective. I think Luthorhuss has a defective product. I'm willing to make an investment to test a different product. If I could ever get out of working weekends and have the weather warm up a little, I'd tackle the mods and there would be something to compare to.
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UTC quote
I may be a lucky one to have no problems with the controler on my Oxford grips.

Calculating theoretical function assumes all the details and variables are totally understood. Even the people who do the design then build and test. Actual results trump calculations every time.

Bottom line they work well.

With temps in the 40s and on high settinng they are too hot to hold tight with regular leather riding gloves. The controler allows adjusting heat output for conditions. If below 40F I wear insulated gloves and use higher setting because the outside of my had gets cold with regular gloves (no muffs). This has been fine for temperatures down to 15F.

The grips do have insulation on the inside to prevent major loss of heat into the metal handlebars.

My personal preference for grips over heated gloves:
- They are always there
- Gloves wear out
- Don't have to mess with plugging them in every time I get on bike. (I have a Tourmaster heated jacket liner so I do have the plug available at the end of my sleeve.
- The installation is not an issue for me in the summer when not in use.
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