Modern Vespa

My highschool years social scene and my present one are starting to mirror each other in one aspect: punks. Back then, I simply was drawn towards the misfit (not the band) attitude. I never even listened to punk, but sported a wallet chain (which I now know originated from bikers) to try fit in. Haha poser.

I started noting one of my punk friends sporting Nazi skinhead Ts at school. I told him how I felt about that crap and notably distanced myself.

Later, rude boy/ska and skateboarding was in. Now I hear that skinheads (not Nazi in origin!) actually shot off from the mods as did the ska scene.

So now I see some punks, and having really only heard a tad of DK that I like, am wondering for conversation sake, how to make the mod to skins connection, historically.

So can anyone reccomend a documentary or something? I am getting Quadrophenia for my birthday, so that obvious answer is covered, thanks. I remember the raggae to ska connection from a cool docu, but I don't remember skins or mods in there. Also, if someone better versed in the scene could give me a run down on what punk bands are associated with Nazi punks, I'd appreciate knowing those red flags when I see them. Like OP Ivy, that's ska right? Nazi-free? DK, well they had that F*** Off Nazi Punks album, right? Subhumans, Nazi, right? Agnostic Front? And how about iron crosses on a punk, is this like skater-dude-Independent-brand-board-whoops-I-didn't-know-it-was-Nazi-I saw-some-cool-biker-with-it innocent, or a subtle nod why-yes-I-am-a-Nazi-skin-but-let's-keep-it-on-the-low-LOL-no-one-gets-the-iron-cross-connection-anymore? Oh, and the metal spikes? Are they Nazi helmet inspired, or like a tribute to maces and morning stars? Oh, and Sharpies, that's S.kin H.eads A.gainst R.acial P.redjudice, right?

Lots of questions, I know, but a little nudge is all I'm looking for, thanks.

Lotsa questions there. One point: The Iron Cross pre-dates the Nazi party: http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-medals/iron_cross.htm. Metal spiked helmets in Germany & Austria also pre-date the Nazi party. There are both racist skins & anti-racist skins. I've only got one hand to type with at the moment, so I'll leave it to others to provide more insight & knowledge.

Not a documentary, but the movie "This is England" gives a great portrait of the skinhead scene of about 30 years ago. The movie's website also contains a discussion of the evolution of skinheads, starting in the '60s:

http://www.thisisenglandmovie.co.uk/#

As for the bands, I have to say the use of the iron cross and other German iconography is a far cry from being Nazis, especially in the punk scene. Agnostic Front, one of my old favorite New York bands, were certainly not Nazis, although they definitely embraced skinhead culture, as did many other bands in NYC who were not Nazis. Things might have been different in other parts of the country.

Brendan

The Subhumans and AF were never white power bands. Skrewdriver, Bound for Glory, Rahowa, Brutal Attack are a few I can think of. As a general rule any RAC/Resistance Records bands are going to have those connections. I don't think you'll come across many of those guys at scooter rallies though, I wouldn't worry about it.

Heh, thanks guys. Don't really see myself at a SC rally untill this injury heals (SR, mums the word untill I talk with my lawyer).

I got a 404 on the iron cross first link, I will check the 2nd one out soon. Thanks to both of you.

I thought I saw a Subhumans T with pronounced SS style lettering, guess I was wrong. Hell, by that logic, Sabbath's "Sold Our Souls..." would be Nazi (is it???)

One more Q, the rudeboy b/w checkerboard, any link to Mod Mudflaps?

Thanks, I look forward to skankin' it in the know, safely!

I can only echo the relief I felt when questioning a ska/punk, finding out it wasn't ALL about Nazi skins.

By the time you reach drinking age you'll probably be less concerned about juvenile social alliances...

Here's an interesting article on the Mod > Hard Mod > Peanut > Skinhead evolution http://www.modculture.co.uk/culture/culture.php?id=1. That website is a real treasure trove, by the way.

If you want to read up more on the evolution of Mod, an easy place to start is with this little Paolo Hewitt book: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Soul-Stylists-Decades-Modernism-Casuals/dp/1840185961.

I would say that mods in England go back to the integration of the Caribbean community at the end of the war. They brought over with them the early 2step music, slim leg suits and pork piie hats. At that time the rockers had bean around awhile and were not so keen on intergration. It's my understanding that the younger English kids mixed and grew up with the Caribbean community inbraced it's music and clothing styles. Ie the Mod. Like wise the use of the scooter was to make them stand out from the 'old system' rockers whose British bikes were always breaking down and being fixed at the roadside, hense the nickname greasers. Whereas the Vespa had been seen to be clean and stylish.

The checker connection comes from TWO TONE RECORDS label who used it as part of their identity.

There is a scene in Quadrophenia where phil and ray's character's are having a bath. That was filmed in KT public baths where I lived. I can still remember my old fella taking me to meet the cast and crew. NO they were not doing the bath scene. We were all sitting around laughing drinking tea and eating cheese rolls.
Good times.

Try again, friend. I'll chock it up to your skimming my post or my wording of the OP. I'm almost 30. It's been 13 years since I was friends with punks. I see punks at my newly found "scene". I MIGHT enjoy ska, maybe even some punk rock. I am not the teenager trying to fit in, I am genuinely interested in the true ORIGIN of the emulated "scene" I see expressed. Instead of close-mindedly dismissing the youths, I may find I can strike up an intelligent convo.

That's the goal. And I've found just skimming so far, lots more info than I'd expect.

Thanks.

Reminds me a bit of my own youth; attending a public school (where whites were the minority) in the rural USA South. I had my own cousins disown me for befriending blacks, well, actually before I had a chance to, as I had once attended the (at that time) white private school. I even picked up a bit of GeeChee & Gullah.

Wishful thinking on the mudflap, I guess. Obviously a checkered flag from a race on the scoot.

Really, the checkers only from a record label? Seemed like a deeper part of the ska scene.

Wow, so rockers actually birthed greasers? Like The Fonz?

OK, I should read these links before more posts.

I'm not what I ride, but while I'm riding, I should at least know the culture behind it all. It's not simply a hipster/glasses/PBR Apple iPad thing after all, right?

If this link works then it will answer a lot of your questions asked. It gives a broad understanding of culture and styles around in the Modern 60's.
Suedeheads refers to the hire cut at the time.

Enjoy.

http://www.filmnoirbuff.com/article/suedeheads

As a footnote the thumbs up/down are how you earn your roundel under your info. So a thumbs up for inquiring into the history of your interest.

http://www.scooterwest.com/item_details/Mudflap-Checkered-W-Vespa-logo/2033

This is England. Thats a very good film. It gives you an idea of how some skinheads turned to racism.

In the book "Scooter Boys", Gareth Brown writes about how racist skinheads were able to infiltrate the scene in the late 80's. In 1986 racist skins attacked Desmond Dekker at the Great Yarmouth rally and the Isle of Wight rally the same year with almost 10000 scooterists attending ended in riots. This is all from the book. Interesting stuff..

You might be interested in the film SLC Punk

You must be really bored. Way I always saw it was mod hated skin, skin hated mod, punk hated both and emo's hated themselves. So not sure on any mod/skin relation To much high school BS to bother with! IMO

But whats that saying, If ya gotta ask then you'll just never know?

For someone so bored your knowledge astounds me.

Buts what's that other saying, if you don't have anything to say then don't say anything.