Modern Vespa

This bike was for sale on Ebay last year. Someone here on MV posted a link to it. It is custom and not a bodge. Someone here with search skills may be able to find the thread.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/mcy/1897220057.html

this is just NASTY!!

haha I was *just* about to post this, then I saw you had beat me to it.

"I purchased this bike a while back, spend time to restore her and now i want to sell her. California title." Suuuuure ya did, buddy.

dude this thing is a beauty if the guy gave me 50 bucks i would def drive her home..!! lol...

"There is currently no inspection as they enter the country. Because the vehicles are vintage they enter the country reletively easily, with actually very little paperwork. They are too old to get NHTSA interested. Then at state level, the local inspection reveals very little. The inspection is basically, turn the bike on, check that the lights work, OK you're done. The stringent UK MOT doesn't often reveal cut and shunts in cars, so there's no way the crappy inspection over here would ever reveal it.

The vehicles are either purchased online, and the private individual who bought it gets it through customs, or a re-seller in the US buys a container, and resells them over here. There are very few vietnamese resellers based in the US that stay in business for a long time. Customers have to sue, normally in the next court up from small claims as the amounts are generally too high for small claims. These cases are generally settled in mediation and the public is none the wiser. Where the customer eats the extra amount and goes through small claims, the reseller generally doesn't turn up, the person gets a default judgement, but its a whole lot of work and expense to collect on that judgment. The distances involved in these sales also don't aid in collection or judgement. Many customers are put off litigating because of this.

Any reseller of vehicles has to be licensed as either a new vehicle dealer, or a used vehicle dealer. These re-sellers are not, and have no dealer insurance, therefore no product liability. Because they are not licensed resellers there is no recourse to the state, so no option for the end buyer but to sue. The states generally won't act because its on the consumer to educate themselves about whether they are dealing with a licensed dealer. Caveat Emptor and all that.

As for the people overseas with websites that sell to people in the US or Europe - how the hell does one go after them They operate in countries that have no licensing requirements. How would you sue some one in Vietnam or Indonesia? There is very little recourse if there is not a strong consumer advocate tradition in the country of origin.

These people selling these bikes are not stupid. They take advantage of every single lax regulation and loophole they can find, and NEVER stand by their bikes."


i lifted that.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vintage-Classic-Vespa-Scooter-VBB-1965-Low-reserve-/330459941056?pt=Scooters_Mopeds

Whatcha think? Boots aren't yellow, but......

Oh, not to worry. The seller assures us that, although the scooter was obtained from Vietnam, it was turned into a bodge right here in the U.S.A.

(Newbie attempts to spot a bodge.)

I see the ugly rubber floor mat and excessive chrome, including a chrome exhaust pipe. It's parked in grass to hide the "launching into space on my 10" wheels" effect. There are those big wings around the badge on the front fairing. Two-tone paint is suspicious, although there are plenty of non-bodges that have custom two-tone paint.

Black boots. Not yellow.

There are Piaggio badges on the crash bars around the rear cowl. Does that occur with good-quality crash bars or is it a suggestion that this is a bodge?

What have I missed?

(No way would I buy a Vespa that had Vietname in its history....)

too many "rare" accessories ... winged badge on horncover .. sheriffs badge hubcaps... twin seats covered in some vile off coloured vinyl that tries but misses in compilimenting the paint .... rear brake that comes through the frame [thats a p range thing] .... 10s squeezed into an 8 just to match the "new" engine

having said that some are getting clever and now drop alot of the shiney and have a single seat and no pillion pad ....

also i think although this sticky thread is a good thing for new first time buyers its also a good not to do list for these builders

Here is the text from CL posting http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/mcy/1899573260.html

I'm noticing that the ads get taken down as soon as someone posts it to the MV website. I wonder why? Here are some of the bodge-tastic pics just in case the ad gets taken down. Oh, oh, oh! He also sells vintage handbags, vintage furs, Levis, vintage gloves, etc, etc, etc...just the same stuff all vintage Vespa restorers sell, I am sure.

Vintage Vespas and Lambrettas for sale. They all run and are a blast to ride. They are like no other bike, motorcycle, or scooter you've ever ridden. Any questions please call me at 626 676 9401 thanks. Restored $3200 to $5500.

We have hundreds of pictures on craigs list...
Click here to Check me out on MySpace




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I was wondering that myself.

It's not like it's hard to figure out how to correctly restore a bike. Or even to just make it look like you've correctly restored a bike.

But for as long as people have been discussing bodges and wondering if discussing bodges would make them harder to spot, it hasn't happened yet.

It's like there's some alternate Vespa Technica, a VietTechnica if you will, they're all referring to. Either that or there's some rubber trim mafia forcing them to install it in all the wrong places. And of course the target audience for these things isn't really the people who care in the first place.

So I say just keep on talking...

Even the guys who should know better still put on that stupid blingy plate frame or stainless floor rails and give it all away.

With the Indian and Indonesian bikes of course it can be harder to discern the origin in a blurry CL pic, because they're generally less over the top aesthetically. But that's always been the case, one which many importers have taken advantage of.

This just might turn out to be the most viewed page on MV?

Thanks for doing this Jess.

Here is a Flickr set of what to expect inside these deathtraps. Covers both Vespa and Lambretta

http://www.flickr.com/photos/35987984@N00/sets/72157600026363625/

Cheers

^^^ Wow

I think this one, with the caption, is my favourite:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/laprell_fontaine/4462396256/in/set-72157600026363625/

Ooh... another golden egg on SFbay CraigsList:
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/mcy/1902465154.html

"Vintage Vespa for sale - restored to excellent condition. Please call with any questions - 408-691-7442"

Here's a good question: "Did you take the yellow boots off, because it didn't match the orange?"

I got this one covered... i posted a reply on craigslist mate..!!!! and also ripped him a new asshole with a phone call..!!!

Niiiiice.

Just in case anyone else wants to harass the guy, I have his full name (supposedly), his email, and phone number...
Barry Bakken
408-691-7442
bbakken4749@gmail.com

http://nwct.craigslist.org/mcy/1903978321.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seller's tale: "1962 Vespa Piaggio 150cc

Onxy Black and Faro Basso

Completely Restored, engine rebuilt new tires.

Absoultly beautiful vespa, we have put a lot of money into this to make it look like this.

75 to 80 mpg 2% Oil to Gas Mixture

Please ask any questions and i will answer what i can.

This Vespa is pretty much new.

The Vespa GS was top of the line in 1962. At $500 new, it made10.5 HP at 6500 RPM from 160 cc, and had a cruising speed of 65 mph. It also had amazingly fast acceleration. "
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That scooter is NOT a Faro Basso, nor is it a GS. Neither of those models would run a 2% mixture either. The owner hasn't put "tons of money" into restoring that scooter, nor is it "practically new".

See our many posts on how easily this is identifiable as a bodge. It doesn't have the build of EITHER a Faro Basso or a GS - a GS wasn't a fenderlight, BTW. And a '62 GS would be a 160, not a 150. It has yellow boots. It has chrome wings. It has chrome everywhere. That is not a Vespa taillight. Very classic example if you read the ROVERS link posted in the beginning of this thread.

$6200 is a particularly absurd price, too... usually they keep their ripoff intent down in the 4-5k range.

I was sick and tired a while ago when there were bodges on a Belgian site (Kapaza..it's something like eBay)

I was telling people that they were bodges...did bidds of 1 Euro on a bodge and telling everyone to get away from this "things"

But then,I began to get hatemails...mails where they really said that they gonna find me,and beat me up and so one...I suspect it came from those "bodge"sellers....


Anyway....I dont do that anymore...I was really shocked...

I was bored today so I sent this person an email of inquiry, wanting to know who did the restoration. I received this reply:


It was restored by a gentlemen from Italy and the shipped back to the USA


To which I replied, "really? hmmmmmmmm"

I just got a response from them as well. I stopped contacting these people years ago, but for some reason I decided I needed some exercise in futility today. Here was my response from them:

"How can you tell me what I'm selling isn't what it is? The scooter is practically brand new and we've put more money into then I'm sure you make on a monthly basis to restore it.

Instead of being so rude in your email you could of been grown up and provide information supporting your claims???"

Another great example of why not to bother contacting these people. And if you are new to scooters and contact someone selling something suspicious... they'll just lie and tell you it isn't a bodge.

Gentlemen, and I guess there are a few Ladies here....

If you want to be helpful and educate the masses, please stop posting links to ebay and craigslist ads. These ads expire, and serve no use once they are gone.

Please, copy and paste the text of the ad.

Please, copy and paste the photos in the ad.

Please write up something to explain why you think it is a bodge.

Otherwise we are just wasting bandwidth.

Underneath the shiny paint on a Vietbodge:

























...

[quote="JoeP833"]http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vintage-Classic-Vespa-Scooter-VBB-1965-Low-reserve-/330459941056?pt=Scooters_Mopeds

Whatcha think? Boots aren't yellow, but......[/quote

whats with the pfork? i got that shitty [redacted] pipe on my bike it aint to bad

[quote="n8murphy"] Asian origin - two tone, that crappy floor mat they have a lot, chrome wings, star hub cap, tons of chrome, and VBB (very common scooter to be bodged and imported here).

The Bodge scooter makers are getting smarter. You don't see the yellow boots and two tone paint except on resales from people who bought them years ago. They are putting out single color paint jobs, and getting smarter about not changing a VBB to a handlebar bike. But some of those are still out there. I still see a lot of 8" to 10" wheel conversions.

One thing to look for is the thickness of the paint. The bodgers put the paint on so thick that seams where parts were welded together have no edge to them anymore. This is most obviious on the horncast. That strip of metal welded on the front of the leg shields. This has an obvious edge where it's welded to the leg shields. Bodges don't have that edge. If you can't see or feel that edge with your fingernail, chances are, it's a bodge.

The other thing to look at, is who owns the bike? Ask to know the history. Where did he/she buy the bike from? Who did the restoration? If the seller doesn't know, can't give you receipts for the restoration etc, chances are they are hiding something from you.

Hey guys,

Please spam this f**king liar

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/mcy/1871129809.html

Indeed!

Awesome. Thanks for sharing this.

Spammed Before it ends in tears........for someone.

Cheers

What he said! Hate clicking on the link only to find it's expired, or removed by the culprit....

Here is a classic example of a bodge seller.

"Perfect Italian Vespa...made in Italy...Pure Italian Vespa..."

Note for noobs: Vespas were almost exclusively made in Italy. The are a few exceptions: Motovespas in Spain, the Vespa/LML joint venture in India, Douglas in the UK, and a relatively small number of German-built GS150s. All of the above non-Italian production Vespas were only sold in their home markets and were never exported for sale. So it is redundant to refer to a Vespa as "Italian" since, for all intents and purposes, they all were.

The seller goes to great lengths to point out the scooter's Italian origins...what he doesn't tell you is that it was RESTORED in VIETNAM Having trolled some of these sellers myself, they will always use diversion tactics when you ask about the restoration of the scooter. For example:

Q: "Where was this scooter restored?"
A: "It was made in Italy."
Q: "I see. Who did the restoration?"
A: "The scooter was made in Italy. It was restored by a skilled mechanic."
Q: "OK, so what country was the restoration done in?"
A: "It was made in Italy. A real classic Italian Beauty!"
Q: "Alright, but what I'm really trying to find out is where the scooter was restored. Was it restored in Vietnam?"
A: "The scooter was manufactured in Italy. It is a 100% authentic Italian machine."
... and so on.

The point is not where it was manufactured some 40 - 50 years ago but rather where it was restored recently!

This is also a good example of a bodge that doesn't scream BOOOODDDGE to the noob (aside from the obvious yellow boot stands); there is no tacky 2-tone paint, garish chrome, or photos with with palm trees in the background. The only visual giveaways to me are the yellow boot stands, ugly aftermarket spare tire cover, weird mud flap, non-North American chrome license plate frame, and incorrect centre mat.

Identifying bodges is also about reading between the lines though. Read the seller's description. Why is this person selling? Does the seller sound like a Vespa enthusiast? Does he tell you about his history of ownership? In this case he tells you to buy this Vespa to make some money. I think that about sums it up.

Great post MOMP. I'd like to also note that us-spec Sprints did not come with trapezoid headsets. We had the SS180 here which came with trapezoid headsets, but that is it, as far as I know.

It is possible to find euro Sprints in the US which people imported, so don't discount outright a scooter being sold with a trapezoid headset. But it's a BIG flag to probe deeply into the history of a scooter in the US unless it's an SS180. Bear in mind, that Vespas inherently "come from Italy" (except for weird things like Motovespas and the like) - therefore a seller telling you it's an "Italian bike" isn't enough to make it ok to have a trapezoid headset in the US.

The trapezoid headlight as a visual clue slipped by me! In Toronto it seems that most vintage Vespas on the road were sold by Motoretta - a local dealer - who has imported a seemingly large number of scooters from Italy (not Vietnam!) and restored them locally at their shops. So every time I see a Sprint here it has a trapezoid headlight and this looks normal to me.

I've also updated my post to make the origin/restoration thing even more clear as you've done in your post.

Here is another one. No tell-tale yellow boots though. I didn't know it was so tropical in Pittsbugh...

I'm not as good with the vintage vespa so tell me is it so?

http://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/mcy/1891393981.html

My friend is selling a vintage and totally restored antique 1968 Vespa VLB motor scooter. @ 120 mpg. $3,300. FIRM.
Please call Larry at 724-316-4780

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/mcy/1902465154.html

AT LEAST THE CAT IS HONEST.. (WELL APART THE VIETNAM PART) NOT ABOUT BEING IN EXCELLENT CONDITION...

heres a lammy that ended up in aus .... luckily this happened while being unloaded from a van and not zooming down the road

Well, well, well, just for a change of pace some modern Vespa bodges. Well at least rebuilt salvage.

http://bike4sale.net/vespa.html

Just noticed that one of the salvaged LX 150s is one that a new person on the board was going to buy but ran into money problems. Glad she didn't buy it.