Modern Vespa

Just to document it in the thread, what is the ballpark cost for a pump replacement (e.g. parts + labor = total)?

I cannot believe all the posts about Fuel Pump Failure...about the symptom, but no forensic data or research regarding the ROOT CAUSE...just finger pointing at OEM vendor, problem "fixed" substitution of an unknown quality replacement by some nebulous "date code" or serial number range or brand not stated. Almost like the dealers are robots or hand puppets going thru "motions"

Where is the hard evidence, weak spring, corrosion or binding of metal or neoprene seal/plastic element breakdown or electrical overheating, coil burnout or what not? Amazing that this has gone on for almost 2 years running and NOTHING???...And not even NHTSA getting involved if sudden engine stalling or failure which is a SAFETY ISSUE!!!! Where is the outrage?!!!

I remember a post here claiming auto mechanics were only parts changers...has it gone to the point where motor scooters and such are going the same way? This is a "stone ax" reliable motorscooter with almost 100 years running...I can see having a bad run, but then date codes or serial number issuance and QA/QC records should have rooted out this problem statistically even without the forensics, I find that this would be intolerable especially to a well respected marque like Vespa or Piaggio!

I feel sorry to all those stranded, but could I ask if anyone had the trouble with a 2011 GTS?

I never had a scooter or motorcycle strand me yet! Once had the temperature gauge sensor on my BMW F650 loosen and then the high temperature warning alarmed. Being a "thumper" I checked the bike over and pushed it back in business. Had a push rod go (bent) back in an old bike but it was still usable until I got it to the wrench.

I believe the bad batch cause. This has been the cause of many automotive troubles. Does anyone know the main fuel injection supplier(s) and the one who built the bad ones?

Back in this thread:

Possible Solution To Fuel Pump Problems

I offered to help collect and analyze data about the problem, but asked for help regarding the actual data needed. The offer still stands, but someone need to help me write a protocol to collect data uniformly and to decide what data is needed.

/Andy

NICK it's been a problem with the 250's also. I don't remember what years they were tho.

I tried to get the NHTSA involved. I point people to the thread logging the failures on their site.
I very much think it is a safety issue , losing power on your scoot while in traffic can be very hazardous indeed. But for some reason the NHTSA seems more concerned with recalling cars because the grommet valve on the Ipod connector may cause music to skip....

I would not buy a 300 until I knew this issue has been resolved. Piaggio knows very well about it but their concern for their customers is certainly lacking.

Around 2008 I believe - same as the 300s, and probably the same pump

We have the same problem with Greek Gts models too. Made in China fuel pumps totally unreliable to most GTS-GTV MODELS.

2010 models, the LXs, 300 Supers and 250 GTVs here in Singapore are failing too. As usual, dealer will replace pumps FOC but replacement pumps are no better than the original. Someone who has been dealing with Vespas for years tells me the failure is due to the pump's electronic chip.

I got call from my dealer today- they want to replace the pump as part of a recall at no cost. I have had no problems with it though.........

incorrect.

The latest pumps are different. They are the ones marked with the already legendary three blue dots...

I also got a call from my dealer about recall. Going to change out mine at no cast. Wasn't having a problem, but after reading that others were getting stranded, I'm thankful for them telling me.

My 2010 GTS300 Super had one replacement at 1300km and now at 4000km, the replacement fuel pump failed again. It is now at the dealer awaiting for a new fuel pump. Only 10 months old.

I am now contemplating buying a spare pump to keep it. Despite the problem, I still love the Super.

Anyone know where I can buy one at a reasonable price?

Anyone have any ideas to modify a third party pump to fit the Vespa?

Thank a lot

Sorry for your trouble. I replaced mine at about 1400 miles and now have 2650 miles on the scoot total. The scoot is 4 months old. I am intentionally and happily piling on the miles while it is still under warranty. Scooterwest sells them for 390 dollars. I am guessing you can do better - if you can find one. My dealer said it took about 1.5 hours to replace it. I never got any kind of notice from Piaggio about a recall of any kind. Mine is a 2010 purchased 2011. It was built in 2009.

Has anyone had to recently replace the pump more than once?

i finally filled out the NHTSA complaint form online. It only took a minute or two and I encourage anybody with a pump failure to fill it out.

Hmmm, I must be missing something here. Why are so many MV members upset that Piaggio is doing this recall without being forced to do so by NHTSA? They have developed very complete information on vehicles involved and are going through a comprehensive replacement program that is undoubtedly replacing thousands of perfectly serviceable pumps along with a few potential bad actors - all at their own cost. What else would you have them do? (seems like many of you are unaware of the fuel pump failures which have occurred on various fuel injected automobiles and motorcycles in recent years - this is hardly a unique problem to Piaggio)

MQ i would bet that your dealer put one from the old batch in the first time it was fixed. Make sure it has the blue dots and is from the new batch and you shouldn't need to have it done again. A fuel pump isn't cheap so i wouldn't want to keep one as a spare. Once fixed, with the new batch, i don't see people having any problems. Your dealer still might have some of the old batch if they haven't done many. Check to make sure your getting a new one before you drop it off. If not your going to have the same problem again. Piaggio has enough of them now. They didn't before. Good luck.

Thanks for the info. The last "new" pump they put in have the blue dots on them.

I also bought an Akrapovic can for my GTS which i waited 3 months. On the day it arrived, the fuel pump problem started. I have not fitted it till I resolve the problem. arghhh.

---

Desmo:

Can the three blue dots be seen after the pump is installed (I think not)..but just asking.

Well, after hoping it would not happen to me ... Rode for 45 mins on a 34C day, returned home, parked the scoot and 20 minutes later it would not start. None of the characteristic per-start fuel pump noise either.
Let it rest for 2 hours and it started perfectly .... Ho hum, a call to the dealer tomorrow ... Let's see what they say as I really have better things to do.

Looks like its back to the G650 tomorrow! Pity, the scoot can't be beaten around town.
FP
1100km, 5 months old and white.

PHIL first a warm aloha and welcome to the forum. If you got a new 300 they should of fixed the fuel pump before they sold it to you. Wait i see it's only 5 months old so they definitely should of. Sorry about the inconvenience but it will be worth it when it back up and running. Hopefully it won't take very long since they should have a supply of the new ones by now. Hang in there and i'd love to see some pics of your scooter. 8)

I just picked up my brand new 2012 GTS 300 this evening, and after only 29.9 miles, it died while I was riding it. I had to push it home. I assume it's the fuel pump... the engine just shut off so instantly, and the engine light came on as soon as it did so. The motor turns over when I hit the starter, but it won't actually start. I've let it sit for nearly an hour, and it still won't start. I was so looking forward to having it for my morning commute... Austin traffic is such misery.

Might be the fuel pump, but try wiggling the spark plug cap a bit, see if that helps!

You did not accidentally hit the kill switch, did you?

The kill switch is the first thing I checked.

I tried wiggling the spark plug cap... we had one wiggle off on one of our s150s a year back. The cap is very tight on the 300 & the bike still won't start.

I pulled the fuses in the glove box, none are blown. Are there other fuses on the bike?

For what it's worth, I can hear & feel the fuel pump when I turn the ignition on. So I have no idea what's wrong.

There are a couple of other fuses you can see when you take the under seat storage out. Has the HT lead melted on the exhaust?
I would just give your dealer a call in the morning to come pick it up...

I am sure others will chime in soon with other ideas!

Man that sucks! I would be miffed!

Thanks for the warm welcome ...

Called the local dealer ... The usual 'no idea' but suggested that I bring it to the workshop on Saturday ... Not confident ... Say goodbye to the lovely Vespa for a while methinks

Phil

Well it was off to the dealer for the fuel pump change this morning, convinced that if they were reluctant to acknowledge the idea of fuel pump failure that I was ready for an argument and maybe even, shock horror, a trade on a trail bike.
On the super-slab decided to overtake a truck, the Vespa responded beautifully .... there was no way that I would trade this machine!

Got to the dealer who said " .... So the girl (?) is not starting when hot ... It's the fuel pump ... we've done two this week. Should be about 3 days to get a new pump. WE ARE SORRY FOR THE INCONVENIENCE ...."

So, I am Vespa-less but happy with the response. Although I ride a Suzuki TU 250 and a BMW G650GS I will miss the Vespa until 'she's' back home

Phil
PS He knew about the blue dots too

It turns out my problem wasn't the fuel pump. The electric sensor on the fuel injector wasn't properly fastened at the factory, and wiggled loose. All you have to do is push it on until you hear it click, but apparently they were all drunk that day at Pontedera!

For what it's worth, I was told that my VIN is not a part of the pump recall. Perhaps they've now switched to another supplier/updated pump?

Glad you got it all sorted out! Drunk Italiens? No way! Lol

Good that you are getting the problem fixed but this was hardly your dealers finest hour. When the recall/upgrade on the fuel pump occurred, dealers were supposed to check all of their stock and replace the pump on those that were in the range for the recall -including 300s. If you have one with a pump in the defective series, he should have replaced it BEFORE he gave you the scooter in the first place. (and there was no reason for him to delay as Piaggio pays the dealers for the replacement job)

. If you have one with a pump in the defective series, he should have replaced it BEFORE he gave you the scooter in the first place. (and there was no reason for him to delay as Piaggio pays the dealers for the replacement job)[/quote]

Yep, he should have but I am not sure that dealers provide such a service in the 'land of Oz'. Bought a 2011 BMW G650 GS just 5 months ago that also came with recall electronics, rear sprocket etc etc ....

The Melbourne dealer certainly may no attempt to alert me to these items or to check to see if said BMW was subject to the recalls before I took delivery ..... Indeed I discovered the recall on this wonderful resource called the INTERNET .... These Bulletin Boards are worth a million.

Awaits news of the blue-doted fuel pump with great anticipation.

Phil
from the land where the crocodiles roam free

PHIL glad their fixing it without difficulty. Coulda, shoulds, woulda on the fixing it before they sold it to you but at least they are doing it now. 8)

Fuel pump replaced and back on the cool white 300 ... Missed the 'girl'.
Feel better that she's back.
Time for a ride tomorrow.
Thx for all of the advice!
Might even offer Obama a ride when he calls in to Darwin on Thursday
Flyingphil

No perhaps about it. The newest machines are being delivered with the same pump being used in the upgrades.

I have had issues with my bike (2010 vespa GTS 300) not starting after a longish ride; it takes up to two hours sometimes to start up again. I does seem as though fuel pump is the issue. Has done 2200 kilometres. I wonder when the FP is replaced if the later ones are any better?
Gino

Yes, the new ones do not have the same problem and are therefore reliable.

Can anyone tell me the symptoms of a fuel pump falure?

Picked up my GTV (private sale) yesterday, just 600 miles on the clock. Rode it 200 miles, stopped outside shop and it failed to start for an hour. I sprayed WD40 under all the leads in the engine compartment, and it finally started. It then rode fine after that.

Today, just been round town on it, just a handful of miles, jumped back on after an hour and again it wont start.

The engine compartment feels very warm ?

Is this typical fuel pump failurte? GTV300, 2010 model...

That sounds absolutely typical. Next time you restart, listen for the fuel pump whirring as it primes the system. If you hear it, the bike should start. If you don't the bike won't start as the fuel pump has stalled.

It's a free replacement under the recall if you have the above symptoms.

Sounds like it to me.

When you turn the ignition on before you press the starter you can normally hear the pump for a second or two as it primes. When it overheats and won't start you'll get silence.

I found a couple of two litre bottles of water in the top box were handy to help cool the bike a bit quicker when it failed.