Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:50 am

Molto Verboso
'07 LX150
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1293
Location: Sartell Minnesota
 
Molto Verboso
'07 LX150
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1293
Location: Sartell Minnesota
Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:50 am linkquote
I mean, it doesn't keep the bike from being stolen. Just not driven until the thief bypasses the chip. Or sells the parts. It doesn't even help the owner locate the stolen bike. It just really makes it something of a pain to have to be sure to use this key and not that key for operation. It makes it even more of a pain if you lose something or the immobilizer goes on the fritz (apologies to Fritz). I'll bet the little flashing light, which is only on for forthy eight hours anyway, does more to deter a would be thief walking by. I'd be happy with the little flasher and nothing behind it to make me, the owner, not have to buy a super duper ultra expensive and durn near useless chipped key just so I, the owner, can start it again.

I would love to get that dealio that can locate your stolen bike by signal to a reciever. Now that would be a much better idea. Does that place do any work in say... Minnesota?

The Roadbum
Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:07 am

Hooked
2004 Vespa ET4
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 242
Location: Toronto, ON
 
Hooked
2004 Vespa ET4
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 242
Location: Toronto, ON
Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:07 am linkquote
The flahsy light also displays the 'Piaggio Code' to diagnose problems.

I think as a theft deterrent it is excellent and I would personally always keep the immobilizer because I see it as a way to keep my scooter put when somebody goes jamming a screwdriver in the ignition thinking they can easily jack it. Better to replace the immobilizer than the scooter!

Beyond the 'walk-by' theft, it always comes back to the point that if somebody is serious about stealing your scooter, pretty much nothing is going to stop them (New York chain, immobilizer, pitbull, etc.). So I see the immobizer as an effective tool to mitigate some of the theft risk. Not a hassle for me at all.

That being said, my immobilizer failed this past summer and I was lucky enough to have it replaced under warranty (as I'm sure it's not a cheap job). The shop told me they sometimes fail for no good reason. Mine failed and left me stranded after visiting the ATM. Interestingly enough, I was able to diagnose the problem using my shop manual (kindly hosted on this site) and the Piaggio code.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:10 am

Hooked
'80 p125x
Joined: 26 Aug 2006
Posts: 347
Location: kansas city
 
Hooked
'80 p125x
Joined: 26 Aug 2006
Posts: 347
Location: kansas city
Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:10 am linkquote
collbain2000 wrote:
The flahsy light also displays the 'Piaggio Code' to diagnose problems.

I think as a theft deterrent it is excellent and I would personally always keep the immobilizer because I see it as a way to keep my scooter put when somebody goes jamming a screwdriver in the ignition thinking they can easily jack it. Better to replace the immobilizer than the scooter!

Beyond the 'walk-by' theft, it always comes back to the point that if somebody is serious about stealing your scooter, pretty much nothing is going to stop them (New York chain, immobilizer, pitbull, etc.). So I see the immobizer as an effective tool to mitigate some of the theft risk. Not a hassle for me at all.
.
+1

I've had a bunch of kids f* up my ignition by trying the screwdriver job and they ended up going home empty handed.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:54 am

Molto Verboso
'07 LX150
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1293
Location: Sartell Minnesota
 
Molto Verboso
'07 LX150
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1293
Location: Sartell Minnesota
Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:54 am linkquote
The screwdriver thing presents a real enough issue. I also didn't read about the light being a diagnostic tool. I can be fairly handy around my bikes so I didn't think of that. Still a new technology to me lol.

Maybe all I'm looking for is a GPS locator if the bike ever were stolen.

Thanks for the replies guys.

The Roadbum
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:01 pm

Molto Verboso
GT200
Joined: 08 Jan 2006
Posts: 1877
Location: Bay Area, California
 
Molto Verboso
GT200
Joined: 08 Jan 2006
Posts: 1877
Location: Bay Area, California
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:01 pm linkquote
There is Lojack.
http://www.modernvespa.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7655
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:02 pm

Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Ossessionato
'10 GTS 300 Super, '79 Vespa P200E, '04 Vespa PX200, 2011 SportCity 300 Cube [Sold]
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 2923
Location: San Francisco, CA
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:02 pm linkquote
roadbum wrote:
The screwdriver thing presents a real enough issue. I also didn't read about the light being a diagnostic tool. I can be fairly handy around my bikes so I didn't think of that. Still a new technology to me lol.

Maybe all I'm looking for is a GPS locator if the bike ever were stolen.

Thanks for the replies guys.

The Roadbum
I'm surprised people would try using a screwdriver - would that ever work?

I thought GPS locators only existed in the movies. They really make these things for vehicles?
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:02 pm

Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: 15 May 2006
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
 
Molto Verboso
(GT200L) ... no more scoot :o(
Joined: 15 May 2006
Posts: 1168
Location: Riverside, CA, USA
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:02 pm linkquote
collbain2000 wrote:
The flahsy light also displays the 'Piaggio Code' to diagnose problems.

That being said, my immobilizer failed this past summer and I was lucky enough to have it replaced under warranty ..... Interestingly enough, I was able to diagnose the problem using my shop manual (kindly hosted on this site) and the Piaggio code.
It is good that you mentioned this.

I wouldn't have automatically known that there was a code.

Now I'll know to investigate if it were to fail.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:13 pm

Hooked
2004 Vespa ET4
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 242
Location: Toronto, ON
 
Hooked
2004 Vespa ET4
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 242
Location: Toronto, ON
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:13 pm linkquote
Here is the page from the ET2/ET4 Tech Manual describing the Immobilizer code. Kind of hard to understand at first but becomes clear after a few reads over.



(sorry for the crappy quality, best I could do @ work!)
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:35 pm

Addicted
Vespa LX150 (Diamondwhite baby!) 2003 suzuki Savage 650 (Thumper)
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 581
Location: Oklahoma City, OK USA
 
Addicted
Vespa LX150 (Diamondwhite baby!) 2003 suzuki Savage 650 (Thumper)
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 581
Location: Oklahoma City, OK USA
Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:35 pm linkquote
Very nice, thanks for the list of stuff.....

but one problem, my LX doesnt have a helmet storage, only a Pet Carrier

Scott
Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:51 pm

Hooked
GTS250 black
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 113
Location: Newcastle Australia
 
Hooked
GTS250 black
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 113
Location: Newcastle Australia
Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:51 pm linkquote
I think there should be a warning sticker on the dash that states there is an immobilizer fitted & the bike is useless without yhe ride key etc.
This might discourage would be thieves.
A few weeks ago I went to a salvage auction to bid on a stolen/recovered ET4, when I had a look at it the ignition barrel had been ripped out in an unsuccessful attempt to start it. There were heaps of old blokes hanging around it saying they were going to bid on it, so I informed them that it would require a new immobilizer etc and that they were rather expensive.
These old guys then told me that I didnt know what I was talking about because "you can just bypass the stupid immobilizer". I left them to bid on it & the guy that bought it paid way too much for it.
Anyway last week I'm at my local dealers & the dealer is telling me about this old guy that is driving him mad by pestering him about the cost of parts(ignition system etc) for a stolen/recovered ET4 that he got at an auction.....Made me smile!
Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:54 pm

Sir Frets-A-Lot
Vespa GT250ie/L, Honda Ruckus 50, Honda NT700V, Honda CB125
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 11197
Location: Bee eff eee.
 
Sir Frets-A-Lot
Vespa GT250ie/L, Honda Ruckus 50, Honda NT700V, Honda CB125
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 11197
Location: Bee eff eee.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:54 pm linkquote
David wrote:
I think there should be a warning sticker on the dash that states there is an immobilizer fitted & the bike is useless without yhe ride key etc.
This might discourage would be thieves.
A few weeks ago I went to a salvage auction to bid on a stolen/recovered ET4, when I had a look at it the ignition barrel had been ripped out in an unsuccessful attempt to start it. There were heaps of old blokes hanging around it saying they were going to bid on it, so I informed them that it would require a new immobilizer etc and that they were rather expensive.
These old guys then told me that I didnt know what I was talking about because "you can just bypass the stupid immobilizer". I left them to bid on it & the guy that bought it paid way too much for it.
Anyway last week I'm at my local dealers & the dealer is telling me about this old guy that is driving him mad by pestering him about the cost of parts(ignition system etc) for a stolen/recovered ET4 that he got at an auction.....Made me smile!
It's kinda true - it actually just terminates at the CDI, so if you replace the CDI you'll be fine. E.g., get a Malossi CDI kit and your immobilizer won't work anymore. Means you can get away with a regular key cut for it, I guess.

Not that I told anyone that...
Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm

Addicted
Piaggio X9 "Lexx"
Joined: 16 Dec 2005
Posts: 622
Location: London
 
Addicted
Piaggio X9 "Lexx"
Joined: 16 Dec 2005
Posts: 622
Location: London
Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm linkquote
In countries where scooters are common thieves know exactly which ones have immobilisers. Most thefts are by opportunist joy riders and will automatically go for bikes that are easier to steal and ride immediately. Yes, most bikes can be ridden with a screwdriver jammed into the ignition lock. Immobilisers stop that. The stolen bike statistics show that immobilisers are very effective at encouraging thieves to steal someone else's bike.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:35 pm

Hooked
dragon red 2006 lx190
Joined: 29 Jan 2007
Posts: 184
Location: bronx new york
 
Hooked
dragon red 2006 lx190
Joined: 29 Jan 2007
Posts: 184
Location: bronx new york
Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:35 pm linkquote
dude
sure it is, it keeps num-nuts from hot wiring and driving away ,sending them to another country,cause i would think its not easy to replace without the bike being registerd to you. its a good thing



Tue Jan 30, 2007 3:34 pm

Addicted
GTV250 GTS 300!! MP3 500, Lambretta TV200 S3 77 07 Aprilia Tuono 1000R 64 Vespa Vbb150
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 620
Location: Los Angeles/San Diego
 
Addicted
GTV250 GTS 300!! MP3 500, Lambretta TV200 S3 77 07 Aprilia Tuono 1000R 64 Vespa Vbb150
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 620
Location: Los Angeles/San Diego
Tue Jan 30, 2007 3:34 pm linkquote
There wouldn't be anyway to bypass the immobilizer system because it sends a signal to the coil when to fire and also limits the spark (Rev Limiter). Also the turn signal rely is located in the CDI unit, so without it you will have no working turn signals. Also what a lot of people don't know is that the headlight rely is a direct power circuit for the immobilizer. If your headlight high and lo beam are out and the LED light on the dash does not come on replace the rely and your back in business.


Jon
Tue Jan 30, 2007 4:24 pm

Molto Verboso
'07 LX150
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1293
Location: Sartell Minnesota
 
Molto Verboso
'07 LX150
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1293
Location: Sartell Minnesota
Tue Jan 30, 2007 4:24 pm linkquote
Holy CRAP I had no idea about all this stuff!

I'll just shut the hell up now.

rb
Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:04 pm

Sir Frets-A-Lot
Vespa GT250ie/L, Honda Ruckus 50, Honda NT700V, Honda CB125
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 11197
Location: Bee eff eee.
 
Sir Frets-A-Lot
Vespa GT250ie/L, Honda Ruckus 50, Honda NT700V, Honda CB125
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 11197
Location: Bee eff eee.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:04 pm linkquote
scooterjon wrote:
There wouldn't be anyway to bypass the immobilizer system because it sends a signal to the coil when to fire and also limits the spark (Rev Limiter). Also the turn signal rely is located in the CDI unit, so without it you will have no working turn signals. Also what a lot of people don't know is that the headlight rely is a direct power circuit for the immobilizer. If your headlight high and lo beam are out and the LED light on the dash does not come on replace the rely and your back in business.


Jon
Ironically, one reason people replace the CDI with the malossi CDI is that it removes the rev limiter, thus giving you "extra" speed (at the expense of your engine).

Malossi has 2 iterations of each unit - one for bikes that have the immobilizer and one for those that don't. Neither will result in a bike that has a functioning immobilizer, obviously. But to my knowledge, without replacing the entire ignition system that's the only way to bypass the immobilizer and still have a functioning bike.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:14 pm

Addicted
GTS250 SOLD
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 631
Location: Westmont, NJ
 
Addicted
GTS250 SOLD
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 631
Location: Westmont, NJ
Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:24 pm

World Traveler
2007 LX150 Daring Plum Leonardo Da Vespa
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 29304

 
World Traveler
2007 LX150 Daring Plum Leonardo Da Vespa
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 29304

Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:24 pm linkquote
That's cool Bwyn. No hawaii Does anyone have this? Does it work like it says?
Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:24 pm

Addicted
GTS250 SOLD
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 631
Location: Westmont, NJ
 
Addicted
GTS250 SOLD
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 631
Location: Westmont, NJ
Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:24 pm linkquote
Don't know Judy. There's a company in Alaska that sells a motorcycle locator. I didn't follow up as I was moving. I'm under t he impression that it'll work every where since it works off the satelites. If I find out more I'll post it.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:55 pm

Addicted
GTS250 SOLD
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 631
Location: Westmont, NJ
 
Addicted
GTS250 SOLD
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 631
Location: Westmont, NJ
Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:55 pm linkquote
Judy, found this using google. http://cgi.ebay.com/1-GPS-SPY-TrimTrac-Vehicle-Asset-Tracking-Locator-NEW_W0QQitemZ150084391017QQihZ005QQcategoryZ73362QQcmdZViewItem

It is different than LoJack . This site has a detailed explanation and description.
Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:39 pm

Molto Verboso
2004 Vespa ET4, 2009 Vespa S150, Suzuki Burgman 200
Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 1793
Location: Florida Keys
 
Molto Verboso
2004 Vespa ET4, 2009 Vespa S150, Suzuki Burgman 200
Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 1793
Location: Florida Keys
Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:39 pm linkquote
I work as a police dispatcher and I've had calls from Lojack saying a customer had hit the emergency alarm and our officers have found the vehicle in a parking lot. They actually tell us where the car is within feet. I don't have Lojack nor would i want Onstar because I don't want corporate America knowing where I am, thanks. Government employees have no incentive to keep track of you or your spending habits, no matter what the conspiracy theorists tell you. Yeah Lojack works- as long as you hit the button!
Tue Jan 30, 2007 9:49 pm

Hooked
2006 GTS 250ie
Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 371
Location: Camp Hill, PA
 
Hooked
2006 GTS 250ie
Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 371
Location: Camp Hill, PA
Tue Jan 30, 2007 9:49 pm linkquote
On the scooter fact page of the I Scoot NY site is an alternative solution. http://www.iscootny.com/scoot_faq.htm#lojack

(Q.) Do it yourself LoJack idea

(A.) From a suggestion first posted on the GothamRally forum:
LoJack uses a hidden transmitter registered with the police that they can turn on remotely when you report your vehicle stolen. Then they home in on the signal coming from your ride. They have it for bikes. It costs $595 but there are alternatives.
Since '02, Federal e911 regulations require all new (G3) cell phones be locatable so Big Brother can know your position by sensing your closest transmitting tower. Some providers let you find your friends this way. It's a little creepy. The buzzword for such gizmos is "Location Based Services." It's not GPS. GPS uses satellites in space and, yes, there are also GPS locators for stolen cars. There's at least one anti-theft device that uses LBS. You have to set up a cell phone account ($20 or so per month) to support it so it can contact you, then you hide it in your bike and it sends you periodic text or e-mail messages telling you where it is. (Sending lots of text messages can also cost $$$.)
Fuck that. Why not make one yourself?

If you have a Cingular/AT&T phone (for example), get yourself an additional line account with a new free phone for $9.95 a month. Hide your old phone in your bike (under the fuel tank) and invisibly rig it to your scooter battery with the clipped wires of a cell phone power cord for a car cigarette lighter. Set the phone to allow the "Find Friends" feature. Anytime you wannna know where your bike is, just pick up your own AT&T phone and use mMode ($3/month) to find out. And the police can use e911 do it much more precisely if your bike is stolen.

You'll want a phone/provider capable of e911 "Phase II service" for the best locating capability. Phase II is fairly new (2004). Maybe it would count for insurance discounts, too? Don't tell your
broker where you got it, just tell him you have such a system
installed. Rob S.


I have no idea how well this works.
Wed Jan 31, 2007 9:36 am

World Traveler
2007 LX150 Daring Plum Leonardo Da Vespa
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 29304

 
World Traveler
2007 LX150 Daring Plum Leonardo Da Vespa
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 29304

Wed Jan 31, 2007 9:36 am linkquote
Thanks Bwyn. I have that locater option on my cell phone turned off but if i was going hiking or someplace remote here, turning it back on would be a good thing. If i fell and didn't come back they might be able to locate me via the phone. That being said does this feature work if your battery is dead and have no signal? Just wondering. I think think it's a little un-nerving that people you don't even know would know where you are. Big brother is watching
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