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Hi folks, I picked up a 1981 P200E recently. It's a non-runner and I plan to do a little work and get in on the road for this summer's riding season.

This is my first auto lube Vespa (all my others are pre-mix) so...

My question, I pulled the tank the other day and found what appears to someone's attempt to disable the auto-lube system. Drawings of the auto-lube system I have seen online show a plastic tank below the gas tank. This apears to be missing from my tank (see photo below) - I should add that my bike does not appear to have hole in frame for oil sight glass (I don't know if this makes a difference).

Also in second photo I have circled where I assume the auto lube metering device inlet is . Is this correct? As I put this back together I just want to make sure I have identified this correctly. And any advice of where to get the parts I need to make this right would also be appreciated.

thanks
Scott

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1980 P200E - "Old Rusty", 1976 ET3 Primavera
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Hello,
Not all P200Es were autolube. I THINK Canadian market bikes were all autolube, but Euro models came without autolube.

It seems as though you have a "premix" Eurospec P200. I love autolube and think it is a great development in the design, but I would not try to convert your scooter to autolube. There are many things missing on a Euro bike for autolube to work - not just the hole in the frame.

Besides, Euro bikes are cool because... well they are not North American.
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It's a little hard to tell with the air filter blocking the view, but to me that looks like an oil pump.

And in the first picture the tank is missing the oil tank. I would think that if they really wanted to produce a premix version of the p200 they would just use a regular tank with out the oil filler hole.
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That does look like the body from the oil metering pump, but it does not have the throttle cable connect pivot mechanism showing or the oil supply tube showing. The oil supply tube would go into the area you circled. The actual drive for the pump goes through the bottom of the airbox. Check the front edge of the airbox where the throttle and choke cables go through, there would be a third opening for the oil supply.

I would also get a cooling shroud for the cylinder before doing much engine running.
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Yes, it would be worth checking for the metering drive coming out of the casings. It sounds like they have a Euro body (OP - do you have turn signals inside the legshields? Maybe a pic of the scoot would be helpful), so I think it is likely that the tank is just a North American one which was used as a replacement in the scooter.

If the engine is "autolube ready", you could set up the oil tank without the sightglass (plug up the hole) and run a "stealth" autolube without cutting into the frame (you'd have to be vigilant about looking down into the tank though to make sure you don't run dry and break yo stuff).
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Thanks for all the replies - here's a couple more photos as requested.

Thanks

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take the air filter off.
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TravisNJ wrote:
take the air filter off.
Alright - here's a photo with the air filter off:

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That's an autolube pump. However, the throttle correlation link has been removed, and the throttle cable run directly to the carb instead of the autolube pump arm. You would want to open up the pump body to be sure all the parts are present.
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It is an auto lube pump in carb tray, link to carb/throttle cable is missing, also the metal pipe which exits carb tray for oil pipe is missing. This attaches to the indicated position in carb tray and exits via spare grommet shown in photo.

The pipe from below tank has been cut and drilled with holes! The oil tank sits on the end.

The frame should have a hole for autolube sight glass.

Alot of p200e were not autolube, does this suggest the original engine and tank has been replaced for the autolube version?

You are going to struggle to fit autolube system without hole in frame.
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I don't mean for this thread to turn into an auto-lube versus premix debate - but from what I have heard and based on this particular scooter I guess my best bet would be to run this bike as 2% premix and ensure the auto-lube gear is removed and inlet is plugged so it's not sucking air. Right?
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snaps wrote:
I don't mean for this thread to turn into an auto-lube versus premix debate - but from what I have heard and based on this particular scooter I guess my best bet would be to run this bike as 2% premix and ensure the auto-lube gear is removed and inlet is plugged so it's not sucking air. Right?
That would be the best course of action. Unscrew the three screws that are holding the pump, pull it off, and check that the drive spindle is not there. You will have a choice of plugging methods. Thinking about it though, I'm wondering if after removing the spindle, replacing the pump with its gasket would be enough? It would then essentially function as an additional case breather like the one above the clutch but not allow crud and stuff into the case since there would be no moving parts within the pump itself.
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classic rider wrote:
snaps wrote:
I don't mean for this thread to turn into an auto-lube versus premix debate - but from what I have heard and based on this particular scooter I guess my best bet would be to run this bike as 2% premix and ensure the auto-lube gear is removed and inlet is plugged so it's not sucking air. Right?
That would be the best course of action. Unscrew the three screws that are holding the pump, pull it off, and check that the drive spindle is not there. You will have a choice of plugging methods. Thinking about it though, I'm wondering if after removing the spindle, replacing the pump with its gasket would be enough? It would then essentially function as an additional case breather like the one above the clutch but not allow crud and stuff into the case since there would be no moving parts within the pump itself.
But leaving the inlet unblocked would also allow air to be sucked into the cylinder and mess with the fuel/air mixture wouldn't it?
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Dunno what you guys are talking about w/all the throttle link missing stuff. I can see the throttle link for the oil pump peeking out just fine. The direct connection you're seeing is the choke, yeah?

Missing the oil pipe for sure though.
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Yes, linkage does appear to be there (photo below).

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snaps wrote:
classic rider wrote:
snaps wrote:
I don't mean for this thread to turn into an auto-lube versus premix debate - but from what I have heard and based on this particular scooter I guess my best bet would be to run this bike as 2% premix and ensure the auto-lube gear is removed and inlet is plugged so it's not sucking air. Right?
That would be the best course of action. Unscrew the three screws that are holding the pump, pull it off, and check that the drive spindle is not there. You will have a choice of plugging methods. Thinking about it though, I'm wondering if after removing the spindle, replacing the pump with its gasket would be enough? It would then essentially function as an additional case breather like the one above the clutch but not allow crud and stuff into the case since there would be no moving parts within the pump itself.
But leaving the inlet unblocked would also allow air to be sucked into the cylinder and mess with the fuel/air mixture wouldn't it?
The air path to the cylinder would be through the pump internals, the channel under the airbox to the oil injection port in the carb's venturi. With the way the pump internals are arranged I would think very little air would be pulled into the venturi by the low pressure ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venturi_effect ) hence having minimal impact on the air/fuel mixture. The oil inlet to the pump would be easy enough to plug for peace of mind though. If air got to the cylinder from the case route you would have a seal problem on the clutch side.
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yes i agree the linkage is there. (new photo).

But again no hole in frame, if you try to make one, if its not exact then sight glass will continouosly crack, and leak oil.

To disable autolube correctly,
Remove carb tray,
remove oil pump drive shaft sticking out from engine casing
remove oil pump cover
remove oil pump chamfered cog and spring. Replace cover.
Buy/make a bung for hole were oil pump drive shaft was, and seal.
Underside of carb tray, groove for 2t oil, fill with silicon/instant gasket.

replace carb tray and carb.

pre mix at 2%

I remove chamfered cog to prevent the throttle cable sticking
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as xantufrog says it is possible to convert to autolube without a hole for the sight glass...

a mate of mine fitted one to an early px frame and just turned the oil tank 90 degrees- ish..

you do have to keep it topped up though..
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Dipsticks make great oil measuring devices. Even new vehicles still have them. A homemade one would work fine. I'm not sure Jim Williams chopsticks would be long enough though. Put a buttplug in the sight glass hole. Just think, the only rider to check the autolube dipstick before the rally ride.
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blackbart wrote:
Dipsticks make great oil measuring devices. Even new vehicles still have them. A homemade one would work fine. I'm not sure Jim Williams chopsticks would be long enough though. Put a buttplug in the sight glass hole. Just think, the only rider to check the autolube dipstick before the rally ride.
I called, but they didn't know what I was talking about, they got all mad, so I checked the catalog... Found it. Doesn't specify which model. Must be one size fits all.
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Vader19 wrote:
blackbart wrote:
Dipsticks make great oil measuring devices. Even new vehicles still have them. A homemade one would work fine. I'm not sure Jim Williams chopsticks would be long enough though. Put a buttplug in the sight glass hole. Just think, the only rider to check the autolube dipstick before the rally ride.
I called, but they didn't know what I was talking about, they got all mad, so I checked the catalog... Found it. Doesn't specify which model. Must be one size fits all.
Haha! Yeah, good luck talking to someone at scooterworks who knows anything about scooters.
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I know all about them, but I was really surprised that they didn't claim to know anything about Item "D"
That seems more in tune with what they do know
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astromags wrote:
Vader19 wrote:
blackbart wrote:
Dipsticks make great oil measuring devices. Even new vehicles still have them. A homemade one would work fine. I'm not sure Jim Williams chopsticks would be long enough though. Put a buttplug in the sight glass hole. Just think, the only rider to check the autolube dipstick before the rally ride.
I called, but they didn't know what I was talking about, they got all mad, so I checked the catalog... Found it. Doesn't specify which model. Must be one size fits all.
Haha! Yeah, good luck talking to someone at scooterworks who knows anything about scooters.
Aces!
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Vader19 wrote:
I know all about them, but I was really surprised that they didn't claim to know anything about Item "D"
That seems more in tune with what they do know
I just caught that. Is that really in the book?
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Nah
I figured you'd catch it right away w/ you gd eye... I did a quicky PS job, but left some of the "coppied" letters floating at the top... wife wanted to get on computer and didn't think my work was important... not important? d'oh

But if you called their "tech support" you'd have a better time getting proper info on a buttplug than a scooter Razz emoticon
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Running autolube without a sight glass is no big deal.

The autolube tank holds some 1.5 - 1.7 litres. That's enough for over 5 tankfuls of petrol. I don't wait for the sight glass to tell me it's time to add 2T. I just top off the tank every 3 or 4 fill ups. If I can't remember how many fill ups it's been, I just top it off. It's a very simple task. And a visual check when filling up works as well.

If you premix, you have to measure and add oil every time you add petrol. Even if you are OCD and topped off the autolube at every fill up, it's still a slightly easier task.

If you can get the autolube running, it's worth your while.
⚠️ Last edited by Aviator47 on UTC; edited 1 time
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If you decide to run the autolube:
look at the directions above for how to DISABLE the autolube. Make sure that either
A) those things were done correctly to your scooter by the previous owner. If they were, you need to undo those steps (e.g. clean out the channel under the airbox and find a replacement drive gear - try Scooters Originali).

or

B) if those things were not done correctly to your scooter, inspect the gears and internals of the autolube system. It is lubricated by the oil it pumps. If it is simply run without oil, the insides burn themselves up. In this case, you need to replace parts which are worn out if you want to trust the device to work.
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Aviator47 wrote:
Running autolube without a sight glass is no big deal.

The autolube tank holds some 1.5 - 1.7 litres. That's enough for over 5 tankfuls of petrol. I don't wait for the sight glass to tell me it's time to add 2T. I just top off the tank every 3 or 4 fill ups. If I can't remember how many fill ups it's been, I just top it off. It's a very simple task. And a visual check when filling up works as well.

If you premix, you have to measure and add oil every time you add petrol. Even if you are OCD and topped off the autolube at every fill up, it's still a slightly easier task.

If you can get the autolube running, it's worth you while.
+1 in my place non autolube had a sight glass and all seem doin fine, even my excel

good luck with the bike and cheer
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